Damn, 2 minutes too late. haha.
I've been waiting on an update to correct an issue with a file since May, with about 5 or 6 emails with no responses.
It seems that if the issue isn't in dire need due to inability to drive, then the update will be avoided until a problem that arises with everyday driveability does come up.

 

Well, I had been considering a remote tune down the road for my R50 when all other mods were done, and RMW seemed to be the obvious choice. Looks like I should reconsider and look into WayMotorWorks. Thanks for posting this thread. It's unfortunate Jan hasn't chosen to respond to the thread or make your situation right. Customer service is a lost art.

 

This whole thread reminds me of Mike at Aesthetic Creation. They produced some really good graphics etc. but their customer service was terrible. Even yelling at people here on NAM who had the "nerve" to openly complain about the service they were getting. They eventually dropped off NAM as a vendor over a year ago. I like the stuff they produced and was happy with the quality but they were not customer orientated. Souns like that is what happening wiht Jan

 

I just wanted to ask how many tunes you got total and how much you paid for the tunes? Reading the post I can't tell, but it seems like you had quite a few tunes and I was just wondering how many times Jan redid your tune before he decided he didn't want to do it anymore.

 

Without any doubt, Way is a true professional and I would recommend him to anyone.

What happened here was that RMW was/is on a mission to sell as much as he could to anyone he could, with the mission of putting every other tuner out of business. For a guy who doesn't even do any of his own fabrication, wrench turning, or even manufacturing, he ends up being the "middle man" in almost every aspect of his business. This means very poor quality control and the dependency to have to then reffer BACK to the guy he buy's it from or the guy who installed it, or built it when it goes wrong, but at the same time will always point too them for any issues as being their fault.

 

Just stepping in here to say that opinions are opinions, and everyone is entitled to theirs. People are stating their opinions of a particular service or product here, and so far I have seen nothing that crosses the NAM Site Guidelines with regards to respect.

I appreciate everyone's attempts to self-moderate here, but it's perfectly okay (and even welcomed here) for folks to give their true opinions on a service or product.

Carry on

 

I have no dog in this fight but what a great response from a moderator. IMO any information NAM members can find on this site to help them make repair, modification or purchasing decisions is very valuable. Thanks you MLPearson 79.

 

None taken. Best of luck with your next tuner, Mark. I'll be paying attention since my next MINI will be an S...

 

X2....

This was not to attack Jan’s personality, this thread was to express my complete dissatisfaction with RMW’s customer service.

Everything I have said is true and I see no intention on attacking his personality.

I figured I’m already screwed but if perhaps by some miracle, Jan reads this and realizes that perhaps he has made a mistake, perhaps it will allow him to concentrate on what’s important.... that being, the people that support his business.

I sure as hell don’t know everything but if I were to get a group of people basically complaining about the same thing, then I’d say it’s time for me to open my eyes.

If not, at least this thread may help someone else from getting screwed over.


Mark

 

The first time I drove to KY, I paid the usual 400-500 bucks for the tune and 200 for Jan’s time. (it took two hours to tune)

Every once in a while Jan would send me beta files to try and I would give him my feedback.

The second time I drove to Orlando and had problems, I honestly don’t remember what I paid if anything (I’m pretty sure I paid Jan because he did spend time but I think he cut me some slack... I’m not completely sure)

After that, I paid 500-600 (something to that effect) for Jan’s dimsport tuner.

Then I bought an Alta Accessport tuner and Jeff has given me at least 2 dozen files to try.... at one point when I was racing in Savannah (I think) Jeff sent me 5-6 tunes in ONE day!!!

I’ve never asked Jan for anything for free. I even offered for him to make his same dimsport tune in an Access Port version and I would pay him.

After countless times of me asking Jan to help me get rid of the CEL and getting blown off, I made a post asking who else messes with the Dimsport tunes.

After many helpful people offered tuning help, I ended up sending Jan’s tune to a major tuning company for them to turn off the CEL and after a month of dissecting Jan’s tune, they came back and told me that they wouldn’t even touch Jan’s tune because they thought it was unsafe.

Mark

 

10 bucks Jan will contact you soon and fix your problem now that this thread has come out.


Mark

 

It is tough to know what to say in a thread like this. Your experience isn't like mine. I think it is pretty safe to assume that for one reason or another, Jan doesn't want to do business with you. Without hearing every single conversation word for word, I wouldn't want to guess as to why, but just like in a free market people can choose what product to buy, vendors can choose who to do business with. You seem like a nice enough guy, but it is clear no more RMWs tune for you.

All I can say is that while my car and others were being tuned on the dyno, Jan spoke with 4 or 5 people on his phone about their cars that day. He wasn't just busy in CT, but with others the same day. Not sitting at a desk and being able to do tunes all day does make comparing it with Alta a bit hard. Biting off more than one can chew is often a killer in small businesses.

Regarding someone thinking your RMW tune was unsafe, it is always wise for people dealing with canned tunes to make one size fits all tunes that will be safe for all cars they are installed in. When a tuner can be on a dyno, with your car, he doesn't have to be so careful. Checking the air ratios for each vehicle with the specific mods lets any tuner go into the "unsafe" area without worry since they can see it is actually safe for your specific car. Also, it isn't at all uncommon for a tuner not to want to touch a car that is tuned by someone else since if something goes wrong, they get the blame.

All in all I am sorry to read the thread and hear about your experiences, but I can't really comment much on your set of circumstances since only you and Jan know all the details. At the same time you were getting ignored, he was helping others, so I have to think it is something specific in your relationship.

I'm not defending anyone, it just seems to be a specific issue you are having rather than a general trend. I'm not talking about him disappearing for a week or two on others, since I sort of see how a one man band can just get too busy, but your issue seems to be different and permanent.

Keep in mind, my experience is only one car, so it isn't much more info. People will have to get a general feeling based on the dozens of folks who have done business with any vendor and make a judgement based on the averages, and take their chances on their one car. I have tried to contact him and had to try a couple times before he got to my things (which were not pressing at all) but, he did get back to me.

Honestly I wish things were still OK with your car and hope you get it running as good or better than it was before. It sucks when things don't work out, but putting it behind you and moving on has been a way I have found there are more than one way to skin a cat.

PS. I in no way want to suggest you deserve being ignored. I do know that when two people are involved both folks think they are justified in their point of view. It is impossible for me (or anyone) to know what goes on in other's minds. I have had things taken the wrong way by others and been stupefied at their view on things.

 

I understand and appreciate your response. I personally had no problem with Jan’s tune. I had it on my car of 30K miles.

I don’t know what Jan’s problem was/is. He didn’t get upset with me until he found out that I sent his tune to Cobb to see if they would turn off the CEL. After 6 months of asking him to fix it, I sent him a text asking him if he’s not fixing my tune because he can’t (I don’t mean whether he can, I mean maybe he physically couldn’t), doesn’t want to or doesn’t know how.

In either case, I didn’t care, just tell me so I would quit bothering him.

Bottom line, he blew me off AGAIN and I was forced to send his map to someone that would/could help me.

First, that’s just naive to think that each tuner doesn’t have another tuner’s maps dissected.... they and others (just like Jan has) have other tuner’s maps.

You’re right, at this point, nothing is going to happen but I think it’s fair I tell what happened....

I’m glad it worked out for you and for 30K miles, it did for me...

Oh well.

Mark

 

Sorry for your problems, but my experience has been quite the opposite. I've looked into doing a major amount of work on my car--head, header, cam, intercooler, pulley-and didn't initially want to do it unless I could do it with the tuner there live. But there were none close by, and after a fair amount of reading and phone conversations with various vendors and people here I trust, I finally went the RMW remote tune route.

It's currently in progress, but should be done hopefully Monday. The person doing the installation has phoned Jan (funny thing is all he knew was the name, googled it as he couldn't get in touch with me), and they worked out a cam timing issue there on the spot. Jan wasn't expecting the call, and Dan (Extreme performance in Neenah, WI), mentioned how helpful he was on the spur of the moment. I'll start a seperate thread when the work is done.

I've met Jan in person, and although the internet persona can be rough at times, in person he's a great guy. ALL the tuners are relatively high strung--it's a function of what's required for them to do what they do. There will always be problems with modding--it's the nature of the beast.

I can't speak for RMW--it almost seems like you're hoping for a reply here from RMW--but really, nothing good would come of it. In the past, it seems Jan would reply to these type of threads, and they'd just degenerate into a flame fest. But it also seems this CEL occurred after an accident, and wasn't necessarily due to an issue with RMW parts?


There's always two sides to a story, you've got the podium, doubt we'll hear the other side--but in the interest of civility, it's probably best that way. There is definitely an anti-RMW vibe here, including the moderators, you've already convinced a few folks away from RMW tunes (which is really a shame, taking one experience, without the full knowledge of the situation and basing a decision on that, but in this new era of sound bites, that seems to happen fairly frequently across the board), despite saying you have no desire to badmouth anyone (a bit disingenuos, but that's beside the point), not sure what else there is to accomplish here.

I'm not saying Jan/RMW is perfect. EVERY tuner makes mistakes, not just RMW, there are plenty of issues out there. It's not a perfect world, and modding isn't a perfect science, it's a do it at your own risk proposition. You have to pay to play. THAT is the one thing I wish ALL tuners would come out and say at the beginning.

 

Mark, I do not much to say about your relationship with rmw but I am more than surprised that you did send one tuners code to another. In my former business world, that would be tantamount to a lawsuit and people have been jailed for that. First off, no one knows what is proprietary. Second, what may be protected by patents. You do not know for sure that everyone is already sharing. Software guys are kind of particular about this.

Just be careful with this kind of stuff. I suspect you do not own the rights to RMW's code but only have the right to use it within your car's ECU. I spent lots of time with intellectual property rights and it is a thorny issue.

 

This thread has nor ever had anything to do with the quality of Jan's tune. I ran Jan's tune for 30K miles with no problems.

The accident had nothing to do with anything. After the dealer reflashed the computer, they upgraded the version number. Jan was easily able to rewrite what was neccessary for me to continue using his tune. (and he did)

I drove for a few weeks with his new tune with no problems whatsoever. It wasn't until after a couple of weeks I realized Jan had mistakenly set my shift point at 6500 rpms instead of 7000.

Not a big deal, I simply asked Jan to change it. And he did HOWEVER, when he changed the shift point to 7000 rpms, I immediately got a check engine light.

ALL I ASKED WAS FOR HIM TO REMOVE THE CEL... It took 2 months to get him to write the updated file for the new software version and FOUR months to get him to remove the CEL and AFTER 4 months of asking, I went elsewhere.

There are two sides to every story but how the hell would Jan explain why it took 2 months to write a tune and then blow me off for 4 months.

I've had quite a few PM's from people telling me the same thing but are afraid to say anything in fear that Jan won't work on their tunes. Then I had a conversation last night telling me I was childish and immature for making a post.

WTH?? So apparently it's a no-no to say anything bad about the almighty tuner because why??? It amazes me, there are certain vendors on here that if you say anything bad, you're looked upon like you stepped on the holy grail. I guess that's because there are certain vendors that have sole ownership in the sense you can't go anywhere else to get a problem fixed. ie, RMW. If this was about Alta or M7, no one would say anything because if you don't like either company, you can go elsewhere. It's like you can sell your tune off your car and go elsewhere, you just need to suck it up and throw it away.

The point of this thread was for me to complain about a vendor. If he wanted to defend or explain himself, he had or has the opportunity. The problem is there isn't anything for him to say because it's simply a case of Jan's too busy to take care of business.

And if anyone really wants to hear both sides, I have saved EVERY text message since December that Jan and I had. (99% of our conversations were texts)

I'd be more than happy to post them so everyone could see "the other side".

Mark

 

I agree but you know what, everyone has a copy of someone else's tune. It's funny, it's hush hush yet every tuner has the competitor's software already dissected.

I can name 4 companies right now that have each and every other tuner's tunes. If anyone thinks Jan didn't copy and paste from the Italian original dimsport tune, they're crazy. (or alta's tune or anyone elses)


The other thing is... if I wait 2 months to get a tune fixed and then another 4 months to get a tuner to fix something and yet it still doesn't get fixed (or looked at), at what point do YOU think it's okay to say, "okay, it's obvious I'm being blown off, let me see if someone else can fix this"?? OR do you just say screw it and throw away the tune because you don't want to send "his" tune to someone else and then go elsewhere? I mean seriously, I thought after trying to work with Jan for 6 months, I was being pretty patient.


Mark

 

Isn't the whole tuning thing sketchy to begin with. You are "hacking" into the ECU and changing engine control parameters to your liking not the OEMs, which could be dangerous and void your warranty.

If BMW/MINI wanted tuners to do this they would sell a kit to them which allowed them to do this. Just like in the computer world with a software company and their SDK (Software Developers Kit and APIs.)

I have had my car tuned twice by Jan. He is brief on the phone and via email but is a very nice guy to talk with in person.

I will just leave this comment. He is difficult to work with AFTER you have a tune on your car and want to change something. I have been asking him to change 3 settings in my current tune for over 3 months now. Other than that I have no problem with him.

I will continue to support Jan and RMW.

-Steve

 

So you admit that you were sharing at least one tuner's maps with other tuners?

 

AGAIN, a customer service issue... I completely understand that things won't be right the first, second or third time but at some point, does it really take Jan 3 months to change your settings? And also, didn't you have this exact same problem with him about 6 months ago where he wouldn't do anything for you until you bitched and he finally fixed it. I swear this is deja vu all over again for you.

Wait 3 more months and see if you say that...


Mark

 

I do not really have a choice. This is such a niche market. I do not want to start over with some one else. The easiest thing to do would be to pay another $800 and buy an AccessPort from Alta. I do not like or trust Alta as a company so I am not going there.

 

I wasn't sharing other maps with other tuners. I sent ONE map to ONE tuner to have them fix something that the original tuner wouldn't....


Mark

 

[QUOTE=onefish2;3323267]I do not really have a choice. QUOTE]

That's the problem... most people don't have a choice. I've received at least half a dozen PM's from people that have complained about the EXACT same thing I'm bitching about but don't want to post because they can't afford to go buy another tune from another company so they don't want to say anything in fear Jan will take even longer fixing their problems.


Fortunately, I bought an AP tune so it didn't matter. I was just hoping Jan would have stepped up to the plate and done the right thing.


Mark

 

While I fully understand your point of view and don't condone terrible service, I was just trying to make sure you do not get caught in the legalize which can be a nightmare.

In law, it does not matter whether the tuners share or that they already copy each other. What matters is whether you have the right to share someone else's work.

 

I appreciate the concern but I'm willing to bet that any judge that reads 6 months worth of text messages where I have politely asked for him to fix something and then get blown off....

Well, I'll take my chances.

Mark