How many BMWs have you bought new.

I've purchased 3 new MINIs. One had no issues in 20,000 miles. One had an oxygen sensor go bad at 18,000. One had a clutch replaced along with a transmission seal at 1000.

I've purchased 4 new BMWs in my life. You'll have to trust me when I tell you, the list is longer with the BMWs.

I don't usually keep cars longer than about 18 months, for whatever reason. Anyway, I've only had two out of around 20 between my wife and I that didn't have any issues at all. One was a MINI, the other was a Mazda Protege5.

My '08 S arrives in about a month. Could be good, could be bad, but will certainly be FUN!

 

Based on what I read on forums I expected by the time I had 5K miles on my MINI I would be waist deep in problems and thoroughly disgusted. Boy was I wrong. (problems=0)

 

It probably "does" have BMW quality. BMW build quality is nothing to rave about. I would never recommend a BMW from a build quality point of view. Driving quality and vehicle dynamics BMW gets a big thumbs up.

BMWs I've owned: 95 M3 (emissions issues), 95 540i (engine block and transmission), 02 M5 (emissions, transmission, clutch).

 

My 2007 MCS has had fewer build problems than my 1990 Acura Integra (Honda) when it was new. Mine has only needed a software update, and the scoop color was a little off.

The cigarette lighter socket did break. Part of that was poor design, and part was my fault. It wasn't build quality.

 

1985 T-Bird Turbo Coupe: Rebuild 5 speed trans 2 times
1995 Impala SS: Driveshaft vibrations-replaced driveshaft
2004 Honda Pilot: Seat trim broken and replaced, fuel pump failure at 53,000 miles.

Other cars in there too with some issues. I have come to the conclusion that it does not matter what brand of car it is there will always be some issues.

 

1991 Jeep Cherokee: Rear main seal broke. Transmission went. 100,000 miles
1999 Audi A4: Great car, but too many problems to list. Had to get rid of it fast.
2000 Honda CRV: currently 135,000 miles. No problems at all.
2008 Mini Cooper: Coming soon! Hopefully not too many problems.

 

I don't like nor listen to anything J. D. Powers says. I stopped listening to them when they were always touting American cars back in the days when most American cars were pieces of rat droppings.

In fact, when I hear an ad on TV that says "JD Powers this, JD Powers that" I look at such as a negative, that a company would be so desperate as to publish such useless "bought and paid for" surveys or data.

Yes, bought and paid for. I think JD Powers makes lots of money by selling the outcomes of their surveys and tests. They are not like Consumer Reports who does NOT allow manufacturers to even mention CR's name in an ad [to maintain the integrity of the magazine and Consumers Union.]

 

This is the first and will definitely be the last. Don't get me wrong, I love this car to death. However, if it doesn't stop leaking oil, I'm getting MINI to buy it back and moving on.

 

I don't think your situation is typical. I know that doesn't help when it's your car. But car forums, all car forums, are packed with people having problems. people without problems have less cause to post. to read these forums one would conclude that MINIs are pure junk, destined to fall apart within weeks. That is why every time I read a post like yours I post my own experience (so far). 3 months and 5K miles I have had not so much as a rattle. I get 37mpg mixed and 40mpg highway. It is fun as hell to drive. So far I am 100% satisfied with the car. That may change tomorrow. I am truly sorry that you've had problems. I know if it were me I'd be somewhat less than happy.

 

BMW type quality? Excuse me, but BMWs, just like Toyota or Ford, have problems [and "quality" issues.]

I had a new BMW 740i, which at the time cost me $70,000. You would think the Company's flagship car to be a monument to "BMW type quality."

I won't go through the list, but briefly, but these were warranty repairs:

1. A fuel leak developed in the engine area to where a puddle of gas would form on the ground, underneath the engine. Prior to seeing that I smelled raw gas and was wondering why, as I was blazing down the highway [well not blazing, yet.]

Had it towed in to the dealer. They fixed the issue. But on getting it back, it still leaked fuel. Had to have it towed back, again. This time it was fixed and they never told me what the problem was.

By the way, the fuel was partially leaking on to a hot exhaust manifold.

2. There was a rattle in the front dashboard area that took them two trips and many hours to figure out where it was coming from and then to fix. [Loose parts underneath the dash.]

3. Right front suspension are went out, to where the car would not align. They replaced some bearings and an arm thingy.

4. Dash light went out, to where they had to disassemble the dash to get to to it.

5. Power motor on right window stopped working, new motor installed.

I won't bother talking about all the issues with my BMW 325i.

But I still consider BMWs a superior product and BMW a company that cares about producing a quality car. In fact, I consider them far superior to Mercedes [I have had four Mercedes.]

Based on all this, I find my 2006 MINI to be a superior product and on par with other cars in its price range.

Heck, even my Toyota and Nissan have had problems, one a $600 out-of-warranty repair [Nissan shocks] and another $700 [Toyota starter motor and other parts.]

Just sayin.

 

Well, I hate to agree with JD Powers surveys (as bogus as I think they are most of the time), but in our case, I found it to be true. Now, don't get me wrong, we both love our MINIs (hers an 07, mine an 05), but they both have had initial issues. Hers, a bad tranny straight out of the factory, and now an intermittent check engine light. Mine (it was used though), a bad top, scratched rear windows, flywheel/clutch/slave cylinder recall, leaking axle seal, and now, a suspected leaking coolant tank (known issue).

To put it in perspective, our previous cars were sebring convertibles (hers a 99, mine an 01), and hers had one freeze plug replaced (at 98k miles) and sold it at 130k miles in excellent mechanical condition, mine had a top replacement (defective from the factory) and one leaky thermostat housing (at 101k miles) and it was totalled (not my fault) at 110k miles still running flawlessly.

I dunno, but I was expecting our MINIs to be better built than Chryslers.

 

That's your best bet.

Sounds like you may have a lemon. Check the lemon laws in your state, that based on your comment, I suspect you have.

Sidenote: I check on Craig's List to see how MINI is doing on value, etc. I saw a listing, in think in the Los Angeles Craigs, that said the car was a "Lemon Buyback" car, but the dealer [not a MINI dealer] had paperwork saying the car's issues had been fixed.

Don't know if the dealer was required to disclose this by law, but that did not seem to convey to any prospective buyer that they should consider buying it.

Also, have you been taking the car to the same dealer for the repair? You can go to any dealer for a warranty claim. You might want to take it to a different dealer as the one looking at it may have a competence issue, or simply behind your back think you are full of it.

See my post on my having to take my car in twice to fix a fuel leak in the engine compartment. I suspect the guys did not do squat the first time around. I have no proof of such, but how can one miss a fuel leak where there is a constant drip of fuel to where in about two minutes there is a 5" diameter puddle on the ground?

Sounds to me like a competent mechanic needs to really dig in there to see what the problem is. Competence and expertise in the service department is hit or miss at dealerships. This might be considered a minor issue that the head mechanic delegates to the newbie guy promoted from car washing to the service dept.

There are some cars that are lemons, that is why lemon laws came about. The laws were also passed to motivate the manufacturers to make sure they train and supervise service department personnel. But as you know, most laws don't change human behavior.

 

What bugs me most about "known issues" is that MINI [BMW] is hit or miss on covering what are clearly defects in design, engineering or manufacture.

While MINI does not need to say that nasty, horrific word "recall," they had better stand behind the brand and not make it hit or miss when someone makes an out-of-warranty claim on something that clearly should not be going out or failing, tranny, for example.

Obviously the CVT [tranny] was a bad thing. It has rendered older MINI's valueless as word continues to get out that any older MINI with a CVT should be avoided. The Net is filled with posts by people who say they can't sell their MINI because it is an older model with the CVT.

To be sure, all the bad "press" on CVT caused me to get a 2006 MINI, rather than older, and also motivated me to buy one with a 5 speed Getrag.

If BMW was smart [maybe not?] they would do anything possible to prevent stories being posted on the Net where someone has had to pay for a $6000 to $8000 CVT replacement because the dealer said "sorry, out of warranty."

Maybe BMW is riding high on MINI sales and thinking that they don't need to do anything to correct their erroneous designs and engineering. But in my experience, especially with the Net, such a cavalier "take a hike" attitude will catch up with them.

MINI needs to issue service bulletins on all those issues known to be model wide defects. Yes, that would be expensive. But they would reap the benefits of word getting out that BMW stands behind their products, rather than the loss of sales and damage to reputation caused by people posting on the net that their CVTs went out at 50,001 miles and it cost them $7,000 to replace it.

To be fair to MINI and BMW, when I had my Toyota 4Runner I got a recall notice on making a mod to the towing package because it was unsafe. I also had a starter motor go out while on the road. Almost a $700 repair.

And my brother's $55,000 Audi had a timing belt defect that existed on the model. His engine blew up because of the defect. Dealer told him to take a hike. [Is this a German attitude. ]

Eventually Audi USA sent checks to anyone who had the problem and suffered engine damage. My brother got almost $5000 as reimbursement for what he paid for an almost entirely new engine [top end.]

Just sayin.

 

I've already written a letter and sent it to MINI. They received it. I called them today. I'm taking the car in on Monday. This will be the fourth time for the same problem. I have to call MINI after I take it in. They in turn are going to contact the dealer. If they can't fix it, I have the option of getting my money back or having them replace it. I'll let everyone know what happens. I really do hope they can fix it.

 

Some designs come out of engineering and they are a perfect concept. The engineering to support the concept can also be top notch. The day the product rolls out, luck and the randomness leading up to that point in time can come together to produce perfection.
I can think of a few; the P51 Mustang, the Jeep, and the MINI.
Does perfection in quality matter? Not at all; we have perfection in our MINI.
Brian

 

This list is deceiving. As mentioned, the industry average is 1.2. The Mini is listed at 1.6. That is minimal and really nick picking. I have owned my Cooper for a year now and it has been great.

 

I've had 6 new cars over a 30 year time period. Only one of them never required a warranty repair, that was an 01 Audi A4. All 5 of the others needed some type of work done.

The best repair ever was when my 88 Toyota pickup with 3VZE (3.0 V6) was recalled because supposedly small engine oil passages causing some engines to seaze. I don't think there was anything wrong with that engine but they put in a new engine in my truck that had 127,000 miles on it.

I think the likelihood of encountering a problem with any new car is high. Many vendors are used for many different parts put into a car. Anyone in manufacturing today has one goal, make a product as quickly as possible at the lowest possible cost. Problems are bound to arise.

 

I think someone said it best at the beginning of this post...

The best cars in the industry have 1 problem per car at delivery... the MINI has 1.6

This is hardly a reason to despair, especially since MINI owners tend to be more fanatical to get the word out about their cars, and catalog every possible nuisance like a shorted out dome light, misaligned ashtray, etc...

Having said that, my wife and I own a 2005 MB E500. It now has 60K miles. It has had DOZENS of minor problems (stuck sunroof, shorted out hood safety light, NAV issues, etc...) and, more importantly, the left rear air suspension has completely failed 3 times. This stranded us for several days whilst traveling twice, and the one time it happened at home, the dealer had the car for over two weeks, trying to figure it out (it broke again less than a year later).

Though I don't have my MINI yet, anything less than the MB problems will be welcome, especially for a car costing 1/3 as much...

 

i have a hard time believing that mini has a worse biuld quality than ford, im sorry...

 

I have a hard time believing that VW's getting better initial quality than MINI. My '99 Passat had numerous in-warranty repairs, a couple of recalls or other items fixed due to TSBs, and plenty of out of warranty repairs (which doesn't say anything about initial quality, I realize). But when, within a year, the driver's seat heater shorted out - leaving it running on high - and ultimately drained the battery (after cooking husband during a 4-hour drive home from Tahoe).

Anecdotally, I was talking with a friend the other day who bought 4 VWs in succession: a 95 Golf, a 98 Cabrio, a 2002 Beetle, and a 2005 Jetta. He said that by far the BEST car was the Golf, and that quality noticeably declined over the cars, that they started to have problems earlier and earlier.

And this is supposed to be BETTER than my MINI? Doubtful.

 

Misaligned ashtray... now I'm pizzed.... I want a recall I say.. a recall



Mark

 

JD Powers is an initial quality survey...

and in initial quality control, Mini stinks.

I have to agree with the survey, I have bought 6 new porsches since I have been driving in 1988, and I can't think of any that had any delivery issues (i.e. problems that had to be fixed in the first few months). Yes I have had some issues down the line. My Cayenne S, had had every coil replaced after being stuck twice, and a new PCM nav unit. My current "eleven" had a new transmission at 4k because of a burl on a syncro that didn't feel right and of course the RMS as they all tend to have. My Boxster had a roof liner that fell on my head after a year or so and my 930 factory slant had headlamp rotation issues.

However these issues came after more than a year of ownership, something that JD powers initial quality survey does not cover...

An example of what they do cover...

The fact my 2 month old 2500mile mini cooper S, sunroof doesn't open when it's hot, the shift interlock doesn't work, I have rattles around the secret compartment and my tach pod wasn't screwed into the steering column. To name a few...

In the end, for an English built car, I count my self lucky... At least no lucas electronics to cause me any major issues....

 

I have to agree, the survey is to get an opinion of what people think of their new car for the first few months.

The problem is, a "misaligned ashtray" holds the same demerit that a sunroof issue holds accord to JD Powers.

The problem with that is, taking the car back because they need to realign the ashtray or properly connect the tach pod shouldn't be in the same class as a sunroof problem.

Those are minor, petty things that can be fixed/readjusted or replaced immediately and quickly.

Having a sunroof that doesn't open that Mini still has no clue on how to fix pulls a lot more weight to me in deciding if that particular car is a car that I wouldn't buy.

The problem is, JD Powers doesn't differentiate. To them, a problem is a problem and a car could get a low rating just because it has some minor little problem.

Hardly fair IMO.

Mark

 

The root cause of both issues is the same. Poor quality control at the plant. It does not matter that ashtray was misaligned, tach not attached correctly or sunroof is not working. Quality Control at the plant missed it.

 

I understand that and agree....

Having said that... if you were a potential buyer for a mini, wouldn't you want to differentiate when reading that score whether it was for a "misaligned ashtray" or the sunroof doesn't work when it gets hot??

To me, they both may be part of the 1.6 problems per car but one may stop me from buying a car, the other one I'd laugh.

I just think if JD Powers is going to print numbers on how many reported problems a car has out of the box from the factory within a few months, I think they should have some sort of rating system on the severity of the problem.

Emblems that fall off, doors that need to be readjusted, ashtrays that need reinstalled are annoyances but easily fixable. Getting stuck with a sunroof that doesn't open because of the weather isn't a "missed quality control" at the factory problem.... it's more of a POS design from the factory.

Mark