R50/R53 :: Hatch Talk (2002-2006) Cooper (R50) and Cooper S (R53) hatchback discussion.

R50/53 Oil consumption?

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Old Feb 23, 2021 | 07:28 PM
  #26  
steve05ram360's Avatar
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Originally Posted by Eurothrasher
Never had the need to introduce it into the engine in that manner.

244K miles on mine, still runs like the day I bought it but even better with JCW upgrades.
Perhaps that is true however it is not in the same state as when you bought it so its not really a good comparison. i say the same about my trucks engine as well but its known on the forum its far from stock. One of the best mods I ever did to it was to start tuning myself.

I can add this on a different subject relating to additives... having put 437k miles on my trucks engine I've seen a lot, watched it perform really well and then fade away as time went on. Around 280k I started using a mix of ATF & 2 stroke oil in the fuel, several were using it and reporting good results. My injectors rolled the finger out at me and and started rattling like crazy 100 miles into a road trip home. Tried everything I knew of to get it to stop and nothing worked. At about the 1500 mile mark I finally caved and retuned it... thru nearly 0.5* of timing at it to get it to behave. Tried a few more things on the return trip and nothing helped. Planned to take it to a shop for them to diag the fuel system and the morning I decided to do it, tossed in 16 oz of type f atf fluid to 1/4 of a tank and motored on to work (35 miles). Which is pretty high compared to what I use now. Drove it to work, returned the tune to stock, drove it to verify the rattle was still there and called the shop & a tow truck (easiest as a rental shop was next to work). Truck got there late & they did not get to it. The next day the tech fired it up and let it idle for about 30 minutes before getting to it. Took it for a spin, did some tests on it and shrugged... "call the customer". So I get a call stating they cannot find anything wrong with it and they ask me to go for a ride with the tech. Keep in mind I tired everything over 2000+ miles on that trip and nothing cleared it. Injectors had 125k or so miles on them, they last between 150~250k.

An hour later I was on the road with the tech. Got it all warmed up and nothing... nada.. zip, no rattle. At that point the tech suggested a valve adjust. 2000 mile trip and nothing cleared it yet 16 oz to about 8 gal of diesel did. Still shocked it cleared it and if I did not experience it first hand, I'd be skeptical. So, I did the valve adjust and found 3 valves tight which means there were actually 6 valve contributing to the tight numbers as the rocker hits a bridge between 2 valves (24v motor) to open it. Adjusted them to 0.010/0.020 and motored on home (was at daughters house). Saw no change on the way home as expected. I did not expect any change but was surprised the next day rolling on into work that it sounded different and seemed to perform better. Placebo effect... Let it go for 2 weeks and decided to re-adjust to a 0.012/0.022 spec and leave it at that. Again after the adjust, motor ran the same on the way home but had the same placebo effect on the way into work the next day. I concluded I had carbon on the valve seats and the 2 adjustments worked it free. Doesnt make sense that it would but thats what I experienced.

So, a week or so later on the next fillup I decided to do the ATF/2SO mix again in the fuel and to stick with it. engine performance improved and after about 300 miles was noticeably better. Shocked by this I had to go back and re-tune because now I had smoke out the exhaust, which was telling me that now I have more fuel on each injection event. Ultimately had to re-dial in the tune after about a 1000 miles as it "cleaning of the injectors" continued. Motored on for another 35k miles before ultimately swapping them out for a fresh set (the injectors). Had a compression check done at that time and it showed I had 2 hurt cylinders that had low compression. Now the current set of injectors is at that same point in time ~125k and showing no signs of any issues. Living their entire life on the ATF/2SO mix in the fuel.

This leads me into the Stiction eliminator part of the trucks story... at about 380k, truck was using that 3~4 qts of oil in 7k miles on a 10k OCI. Running Royal Purple 15w-40 in it for a couple of hundred k miles at this point, with a 10k OCI. Was reading a thread about the SE and started doing some research on it. Seeing it was for Ford oil fired diesel injectors I was skeptical. Users on the forum reported nothing to write home about but recommended anyways. So after more research I gave it a shot. I figured I was due for a rebuild anyways and had nothing to loose... but more oil (jk). So on the next oil change I thru in 2 quarts (13 total used in this motor) and motored on. Monitoring the oil level along the way it dropped a couple of quarts in approx 5k miles and then slowed down gradually after that. It stabilized at the 1~1.5 quarts over 7k. Today there is 9k on the oil and I've had to add just 1 quart.

I figured I had stuck rings which was leading to the oil loss. Researching others experiences mine mirrored theirs for reducing oil loss... so... its been getting 1 quart ever since.

Now with the Engine Restorer, I would be skeptical again as well. Did some quick searches on it and found the Project Farm guy tested it, an unbiased evaluation of everything he looks at. He tested it on his tractor diesel engine. He stated it was not starting unless it was pretty warm out. What this tells me is the block has enough heat in it to allow the compression ignition to occur on that motor. We see the same thing on the older Cummins engines however in our case its injectors. (I've never had any starting issues on my truck btw). When it gets cold out, engines dont fire and we see a wave of people seeking advice. Ultimately we tell them to plug in the block heater which gets it warm enough to fire, then tell them they need injectors. We always recommend the ATF/2SO mix at that point as well, some it helps, others not so much.

With my trucks engine up there in miles (500k was my goal before needing to tear into it), the engine restorer might be an OK thing to try. Going to go research it some and decide soon as the oil change is coming due in less than 1k miles.

Sorry for the long winded post but details in personal experiences are sometimes good...



 
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Old Feb 24, 2021 | 11:05 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by steve05ram360
Yes, I did a seafoam on the motor recently, I get a ton of smoke each time.
People got smoke out of a brand new motor using seafoam. I don't think smoke equates to seaform working.
 
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Old Feb 24, 2021 | 11:07 AM
  #28  
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OP, worried about oil burning, you can do a leak down test. That'll give you a good idea of the health of your engine (or at least where you might have some leakage).

And do oil analysis... they are amazingly good at telling you how your engine is doing, in regards to oil use.
 
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Old Feb 24, 2021 | 11:15 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by AngryScotsman
People got smoke out of a brand new motor using seafoam. I don't think smoke equates to seaform working.
And I got no smoke out of one of the trucks I had.. 5.9 gasser running Chevron every tank.

In the near future I will be doing a compression test to compare against numbers I took a few months back. will post up numbers in the thread I started.
 
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Old Feb 24, 2021 | 12:03 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by steve05ram360
And I got no smoke out of one of the trucks I had.. 5.9 gasser running Chevron every tank.
Cool. However, there have been plenty of "myth buster" type of videos and experiments of people debunking seafoam where they got plumes of smoke from brand new engines.

In the near future I will be doing a compression test to compare against numbers I took a few months back. will post up numbers in the thread I started.
Compression Tests are good for a very basic health check-up. I always ask for a leak down test for used vehicles... paints a more complete picture of the engine health.
 
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Old Feb 24, 2021 | 01:49 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by AngryScotsman
OP, worried about oil burning, you can do a leak down test. That'll give you a good idea of the health of your engine (or at least where you might have some leakage).

And do oil analysis... they are amazingly good at telling you how your engine is doing, in regards to oil use.
Yes had a oil analyst done 5,000 miles ago and was good. Showed a trace of copper if I remember right. Yes I’ll do a leak down test shortly. Thanks
 
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Old Mar 1, 2021 | 05:35 AM
  #32  
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Any updates on your issue? Still considering the Restore for the rams motor...
 
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Old Mar 1, 2021 | 09:41 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by steve05ram360
Any updates on your issue? Still considering the Restore for the rams motor...
Well I checked the oil two days ago and so far it was pretty good. Maybe an 1/8 th down on the stick so topped it off and took very little. So maybe it’s working. I also checked my oil catch can and about fell over seeing how full it was. Just about to the top and I’d say 50% was water and 50% was milkshake?
 
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Old Mar 1, 2021 | 10:44 AM
  #34  
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From: Northern MA, USA
Just curious & I'm not sure if it's relevant, but is your car coming up to full temperature?
Just for reference, mine runs around 96C according to the on-board hidden/secret menu option & it's been that way for the last 5 years or so.
It takes about 5 miles to reach 96C & fortunately I do very few shorter trips. I've never seen any signs of condensation.
I wonder if it's worth checking the thermostat?
 
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Old Mar 1, 2021 | 10:55 AM
  #35  
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Just for comparison...my JCW has 185K miles on it, and it burns around 1/4-1/2 quart of oil at every 5,000 mile oil change. It's done it since I got it with 80K miles on it...so I'm pretty sure that's normal.

 
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Old Mar 9, 2021 | 06:44 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by alconk
Well I checked the oil two days ago and so far it was pretty good. Maybe an 1/8 th down on the stick so topped it off and took very little. So maybe it’s working. I also checked my oil catch can and about fell over seeing how full it was. Just about to the top and I’d say 50% was water and 50% was milkshake?
Any updates on this? There is a guy over in the truck forum that is using both Restore & Hot Shots Secret Stiction Eliminator in his engine and seeing results. His had poor idle and white smoke (unburnt diesel).
 
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Old Mar 9, 2021 | 07:09 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by alconk
I also checked my oil catch can and about fell over seeing how full it was. Just about to the top and I’d say 50% was water and 50% was milkshake?
There are other issues afoot....
What did leak down test reveal ?
 
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Old Mar 9, 2021 | 09:36 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Eurothrasher
There are other issues afoot....
What did leak down test reveal ?
I haven’t had time but checked the dipstick last night and was only down a 1/8” so the Restore is doing something. I have a few hundred more miles to go to a oil chance and will pour in the Hot Shots then.
 
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