R50/R53 :: Hatch Talk (2002-2006) Cooper (R50) and Cooper S (R53) hatchback discussion.

R50/53 DT BPV Destroyed my gas mileage

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Old Jan 8, 2016 | 12:02 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by Filmy
2004 R53, 105K...
My experience is from a dead stop in daily driving: since it takes a split-second longer (than a N/A engine) for the S/C to spool up power, I have to delay dropping the clutch more than I normally would - same with most upshifting. If I do let out the clutch too soon or too rapidly from a stop, it slows the engine too quickly and the engine can't recover fast enough to counter the bear, so the car falls on its face - and then back to where I started with no forward motion. I had always felt that this was a BPV issue - the valve not staying closed to build S/C pressure - but I did the spring check (with my fingers) and it seems to be closing quickly and firmly.

I would change out the BPV if I thought it was the problem, but the "test" makes it seem like it's working fine. The Mini drives great with no problems or codes, it's just this one niggling annoyance...
No, that has nothing to do with the BPV……that is just how a small little inline 4cyl motor feels when you are at low RPMs, especially a 4cyl motor with a supercharger that’s bogging it down even more at low rpms. If you look at a dyno graph for just about any MINI S, you will see that at low rpms (under 2000rpms) they are only making around 40hp and 70 ft/lbs of torque…. They will always feel doggy and underpowered until you get the rpms up around 3000 or so and the supercharger starts making decent boost, and actually starts pulling its own weight as far as HP improvement to the motor vs. how much HP it’s robbing from the motor in order to turn it.

It took me a long time to get used to driving my mini after being used to driving cars/trucks with big V8’s. The power and torque they have right off of idle is amazing compared to a mini……you just have to get used to keeping the rpm’s up higher to have power on demand……and get used to feathering the clutch pedal a little when taking off. My mini is honestly one of the most tricky stick shift cars I’ve ever driven…..as far as taking off from a dead stop. They have absolutely no power or throttle response down low at all.
 
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Old Jan 8, 2016 | 12:04 PM
  #27  
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I agree with iq, very little power down low needs boost to get anywhere.
 
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Old Jan 9, 2016 | 09:47 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by bavmotors
I agree with iq, very little power down low needs boost to get anywhere.
Yea that is a better way to look at it. Especially when you have the heat or AC blasting the car seems to not want to move from a stop haha
 
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Old Jan 9, 2016 | 10:56 AM
  #29  
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I totally get the gutless engine thing at low RPMs, I just thought it more severe than it should be - the way the car just falls flat on its face in that case. I have also had to learn to feather the clutch better but I don't like doing it on load as it heats up and wears the disc more than I'm comfortable with. I pride myself on making clutches last.

I also resist throwing parts at cars just for grins or because it's over 100K miles. While I don't think a new (DT or OEM) BPV would hurt, that's $100 I could spend on something the car really needs. Like a pulley, belt and tensioner, LCA bushings, engine mount...
 
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Old Jan 9, 2016 | 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Filmy
I totally get the gutless engine thing at low RPMs, I just thought it more severe than it should be - the way the car just falls flat on its face in that case. I have also had to learn to feather the clutch better but I don't like doing it on load as it heats up and wears the disc more than I'm comfortable with. I pride myself on making clutches last.

I also resist throwing parts at cars just for grins or because it's over 100K miles. While I don't think a new (DT or OEM) BPV would hurt, that's $100 I could spend on something the car really needs. Like a pulley, belt and tensioner, LCA bushings, engine mount...
Agreed, I am starting to look at my MINI with 130k the same way
 
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Old Jan 9, 2016 | 06:04 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Filmy
I totally get the gutless engine thing at low RPMs, I just thought it more severe than it should be - the way the car just falls flat on its face in that case. I have also had to learn to feather the clutch better but I don't like doing it on load as it heats up and wears the disc more than I'm comfortable with. I pride myself on making clutches last.

I also resist throwing parts at cars just for grins or because it's over 100K miles. While I don't think a new (DT or OEM) BPV would hurt, that's $100 I could spend on something the car really needs. Like a pulley, belt and tensioner, LCA bushings, engine mount...

As long as you BPV snaps shut with some force when you pull the lever open with your finger and then let it close on its own...its ok. When they go bad, the spring breaks, and it wont snap shut. That's when you know its time to replace it. If it snaps shut.......its fine, don't replace it.
 
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Old Jan 10, 2016 | 10:12 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by IQRaceworks
As long as you BPV snaps shut with some force when you pull the lever open with your finger and then let it close on its own...its ok. When they go bad, the spring breaks, and it wont snap shut. That's when you know its time to replace it. If it snaps shut.......its fine, don't replace it.
Yea my stock one I took out is fine I made the mistake of buying a new one and not seeing it in the closet.. oops
 
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Old Jan 10, 2016 | 10:33 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Steffen.Johnson
Yea my stock one I took out is fine I made the mistake of buying a new one and not seeing it in the closet.. oops
not necessarily, the spring weakens and won't hold boost properly. It can still close with decent force and not seal like it should.
 
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Old Jan 10, 2016 | 06:09 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by bavmotors
not necessarily, the spring weakens and won't hold boost properly. It can still close with decent force and not seal like it should.
Well I am glad I ordered a new OEM one then!
 
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Old Jan 10, 2016 | 09:57 PM
  #35  
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It is typical to see a decrease in mileage as the engine stays under boost longer when you let off the gas, and because it closes sooner.

I just use the stock bypass valve but always adjust the stop so it is 100% closed because off the shelf they always have a slight crack in them open.
http://www.waymotorworks.com/oem-min...e-r52-r53.html
 
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Old Jan 11, 2016 | 04:57 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by WayMotorWorks
It is typical to see a decrease in mileage as the engine stays under boost longer when you let off the gas, and because it closes sooner.

I just use the stock bypass valve but always adjust the stop so it is 100% closed because off the shelf they always have a slight crack in them open.
http://www.waymotorworks.com/oem-min...e-r52-r53.html
If I was to order one from you guys would you adjust it or is it something I can do myself?
 
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Old Jan 11, 2016 | 09:45 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Steffen.Johnson
If I was to order one from you guys would you adjust it or is it something I can do myself?
Yes we adjust all them closed before we ship them out
 
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Old Jan 11, 2016 | 09:50 PM
  #38  
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Since I bought my R53 used last year (from 2nd owner), I have little information about any upgrades or repairs from the past three years. Is there any way to tell if my BPV has been replaced; further, if it's been replaced with a DT? Everything's still on the car, so I'm sure I'll have to pull the TB assembly, but is there an obvious differentiation?
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 05:06 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by WayMotorWorks
Yes we adjust all them closed before we ship them out
Ok awesome! I will let you know before I place the order thanks. Does the 100% closed adjustment effect the gas mileage?
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 06:10 AM
  #40  
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is this adjustment easy to do? I am wondering if mine isn't closing all the way. I was at 16 psi last year in the heat, now im roughly at 15 in the cold, and don't get to 15 until 4200 rpm
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 12:10 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Saltysalt
is this adjustment easy to do? I am wondering if mine isn't closing all the way. I was at 16 psi last year in the heat, now im roughly at 15 in the cold, and don't get to 15 until 4200 rpm

You should be making more boost when the air is colder...and denser.
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 01:04 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by IQRaceworks
You should be making more boost when the air is colder...and denser.
How are you guys checking boost numbers?
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 01:07 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Steffen.Johnson
How are you guys checking boost numbers?
I use an Autometer mechanical vac/boost gauge.
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 01:57 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Saltysalt
is this adjustment easy to do? I am wondering if mine isn't closing all the way. I was at 16 psi last year in the heat, now im roughly at 15 in the cold, and don't get to 15 until 4200 rpm
very easy it's like one screw if I remember correctly
 
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Old Jan 12, 2016 | 05:46 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by IQRaceworks
I use an Autometer mechanical vac/boost gauge.
Is this a hard gauge to hook up?
 
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