R50/53 The Great DSC Thread (merged)
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
This is particularly for those people who said they can feel the difference between LSD and regular differential. Or those who want to comment, as I find so many of you to be such nice people on this forum 
1. Did you feel the difference with ASTC and DSC off?
2. WHAT is this difference felt? Explain it as best as you can.
3. What road conditions were there when felt the difference? (not just dry or wet, but like crappy concrete, chunky asphalt, badly shaped roadways)
4. Does LSD noticably work with astc and dsc on? Or is it masked? (or is that an improper / less informed question?
5. Does LSD offer any additional safety features in bad weather when combined with DSC and ASTC?
6. Does LSD to a non professionally trained driver impede their traditional understanding of cornering/taking a sharp turn? (hard to get used to or feels "strange")
7. Does "powering" into a turn mean: dropping to 2nd and hitting the gas to whip around when talking about how LSD helps? Would, in this situation, asct and dsc hamper or enhance the execution of such a manuever?
8. Someone mentioned horsepower drop when using LSD. Does it create more drain on the engine at lower rpms or is it a heavy machine that the engine has to deal with? or like does it provide a slight outlet for energy to be dissipated into heat or accelerating its own system and therefore some loss of raw hp/torque?
If the above is answered, that would put the nails in the coffin of the question of LSD or no LSD?
Let's all drop some lsd!
Oh Footnote to above conversation with Dennis M. of Hassel Mini: He said it was highly effective in track situations and in getting the car to do really advanced cornering techniques. I sorta killed the man's explanation of its necessity or non necessity by mixing in my own understanding of FWD differential systems. Do not fear! he is a lot more knowledgable than I made him seem! (no salesman has him beat that I have met)
1. Did you feel the difference with ASTC and DSC off?
2. WHAT is this difference felt? Explain it as best as you can.
3. What road conditions were there when felt the difference? (not just dry or wet, but like crappy concrete, chunky asphalt, badly shaped roadways)
4. Does LSD noticably work with astc and dsc on? Or is it masked? (or is that an improper / less informed question?
5. Does LSD offer any additional safety features in bad weather when combined with DSC and ASTC?
6. Does LSD to a non professionally trained driver impede their traditional understanding of cornering/taking a sharp turn? (hard to get used to or feels "strange")
7. Does "powering" into a turn mean: dropping to 2nd and hitting the gas to whip around when talking about how LSD helps? Would, in this situation, asct and dsc hamper or enhance the execution of such a manuever?
8. Someone mentioned horsepower drop when using LSD. Does it create more drain on the engine at lower rpms or is it a heavy machine that the engine has to deal with? or like does it provide a slight outlet for energy to be dissipated into heat or accelerating its own system and therefore some loss of raw hp/torque?
If the above is answered, that would put the nails in the coffin of the question of LSD or no LSD?
Let's all drop some lsd!
Oh Footnote to above conversation with Dennis M. of Hassel Mini: He said it was highly effective in track situations and in getting the car to do really advanced cornering techniques. I sorta killed the man's explanation of its necessity or non necessity by mixing in my own understanding of FWD differential systems. Do not fear! he is a lot more knowledgable than I made him seem! (no salesman has him beat that I have met)
5th Gear
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 931
Likes: 14
From: NW Georgia, USA
Ok, I'm gonna do what I can to help answer your questions. Dr Obnxs (or however you spell it) is really the right guy to chime in. He's a professor of physics. I'm just a mechanical engineer. Maybe he'll chime in and help out some. Just scroll down and look for my comments within your quoted post.
Rawhyde
Rawhyde
Originally Posted by El_Jefe
This is particularly for those people who said they can feel the difference between LSD and regular differential. Or those who want to comment, as I find so many of you to be such nice people on this forum
1. Did you feel the difference with ASTC and DSC off?
Somewhat moreso. One instance where you'll really feel the LSD difference is when you really spin the tires hard. (Can't do that with ASC+T on). Since BOTH front wheels are spinning, it really feels strange through the steering wheel. If you're really cornering HARD, and you get on the gas HARD to exit the corner. The LSD car will accelerate much better than the non-LSD car. Think about it. Imagine a hard left turn. The car is leaning to the right, therefore there is less weight on the left tire. When you hammer the gas, that "unloaded" tire will tend to spin. In a non LSD car, once it breaks loose, one of two things will happen (both bad): 1. ASC+T kicks in and the car falls on its face; or 2. The unloaded tire spins like mad, makes noise and smoke, and the car falls on its face. With LSD, BOTH front wheels are trying to pull the car. There may be SOME wheelspin on the unloaded tire, but the one with the extra weight will be pulling as hard as it can. You'll carry more speed out of the corner. I hope that helps make it make sense!
2. WHAT is this difference felt? Explain it as best as you can.
When you burn off the tires, it just feels funny...like a strange vibration. When exiting a corner at maximum warp speed, I can't say I FELT anything different.
3. What road conditions were there when felt the difference? (not just dry or wet, but like crappy concrete, chunky asphalt, badly shaped roadways)
4. Does LSD noticably work with astc and dsc on? Or is it masked? (or is that an improper / less informed question?
The car will pull until a tire spins more than the threshold programmed into the computer. The LSD car will tend to pull harder up until the point when it tries to spin BOTH front tires (if you have enough power to do so). ASC+T will kick in sooner if the car's tendancy is to spin only one tire.
5. Does LSD offer any additional safety features in bad weather when combined with DSC and ASTC?
Yes, no, maybe. LSD will allow the car to pull itself better. This applies to pavement, wet pavement, mud, snow, etc. If you're cornering WAY too hard and you get on the gas WAY too hard, you'll spin BOTH front wheels. Once this happens, there is no available traction to turn the car. (Ever seen a RWD car do a donut? FWD cars will try to go straight if you overgas them in a corner. Moreso with LSD, just like a LSD RWD car is more likely to do a donut than a non LSD RWD car.) Down South, regarding powerful RWD cars with LSD, we say "That thang will write Coca-Cola in the road and throw you in a ditch if you ain't careful!"
6. Does LSD to a non professionally trained driver impede their traditional understanding of cornering/taking a sharp turn? (hard to get used to or feels "strange")
LSD just makes it accelerate better out of corners. It also helps drag racing because BOTH wheels are pulling. I haven't had any training, and I appreciate being able to pull harder out of corners.
7. Does "powering" into a turn mean: dropping to 2nd and hitting the gas to whip around when talking about how LSD helps? Would, in this situation, asct and dsc hamper or enhance the execution of such a manuever?
Not my area of knowledge, so take this with a large lump of salt. Typically, you power OUT of corners, not into them. Do the braking, begin the turn, after you pass the apex of the turn, get on the gas.
8. Someone mentioned horsepower drop when using LSD. Does it create more drain on the engine at lower rpms or is it a heavy machine that the engine has to deal with? or like does it provide a slight outlet for energy to be dissipated into heat or accelerating its own system and therefore some loss of raw hp/torque?
I'm sure there is a slight weight difference, but it's very very slight. I've never disassembled the transaxle on a FWD car, and I don't want to. It isn't more of a drain on the engine. I stand my my original comment. LSD makes a car 2 wheel drive. Non LSD cars become ONE wheel drive as soon as the tire with the least amount of traction breaks loose.
If the above is answered, that would put the nails in the coffin of the question of LSD or no LSD?
Let's all drop some lsd!
Oh Footnote to above conversation with Dennis M. of Hassel Mini: He said it was highly effective in track situations and in getting the car to do really advanced cornering techniques. I sorta killed the man's explanation of its necessity or non necessity by mixing in my own understanding of FWD differential systems. Do not fear! he is a lot more knowledgable than I made him seem! (no salesman has him beat that I have met)
1. Did you feel the difference with ASTC and DSC off?
Somewhat moreso. One instance where you'll really feel the LSD difference is when you really spin the tires hard. (Can't do that with ASC+T on). Since BOTH front wheels are spinning, it really feels strange through the steering wheel. If you're really cornering HARD, and you get on the gas HARD to exit the corner. The LSD car will accelerate much better than the non-LSD car. Think about it. Imagine a hard left turn. The car is leaning to the right, therefore there is less weight on the left tire. When you hammer the gas, that "unloaded" tire will tend to spin. In a non LSD car, once it breaks loose, one of two things will happen (both bad): 1. ASC+T kicks in and the car falls on its face; or 2. The unloaded tire spins like mad, makes noise and smoke, and the car falls on its face. With LSD, BOTH front wheels are trying to pull the car. There may be SOME wheelspin on the unloaded tire, but the one with the extra weight will be pulling as hard as it can. You'll carry more speed out of the corner. I hope that helps make it make sense!
2. WHAT is this difference felt? Explain it as best as you can.
When you burn off the tires, it just feels funny...like a strange vibration. When exiting a corner at maximum warp speed, I can't say I FELT anything different.
3. What road conditions were there when felt the difference? (not just dry or wet, but like crappy concrete, chunky asphalt, badly shaped roadways)
4. Does LSD noticably work with astc and dsc on? Or is it masked? (or is that an improper / less informed question?
The car will pull until a tire spins more than the threshold programmed into the computer. The LSD car will tend to pull harder up until the point when it tries to spin BOTH front tires (if you have enough power to do so). ASC+T will kick in sooner if the car's tendancy is to spin only one tire.
5. Does LSD offer any additional safety features in bad weather when combined with DSC and ASTC?
Yes, no, maybe. LSD will allow the car to pull itself better. This applies to pavement, wet pavement, mud, snow, etc. If you're cornering WAY too hard and you get on the gas WAY too hard, you'll spin BOTH front wheels. Once this happens, there is no available traction to turn the car. (Ever seen a RWD car do a donut? FWD cars will try to go straight if you overgas them in a corner. Moreso with LSD, just like a LSD RWD car is more likely to do a donut than a non LSD RWD car.) Down South, regarding powerful RWD cars with LSD, we say "That thang will write Coca-Cola in the road and throw you in a ditch if you ain't careful!"
6. Does LSD to a non professionally trained driver impede their traditional understanding of cornering/taking a sharp turn? (hard to get used to or feels "strange")
LSD just makes it accelerate better out of corners. It also helps drag racing because BOTH wheels are pulling. I haven't had any training, and I appreciate being able to pull harder out of corners.
7. Does "powering" into a turn mean: dropping to 2nd and hitting the gas to whip around when talking about how LSD helps? Would, in this situation, asct and dsc hamper or enhance the execution of such a manuever?
Not my area of knowledge, so take this with a large lump of salt. Typically, you power OUT of corners, not into them. Do the braking, begin the turn, after you pass the apex of the turn, get on the gas.
8. Someone mentioned horsepower drop when using LSD. Does it create more drain on the engine at lower rpms or is it a heavy machine that the engine has to deal with? or like does it provide a slight outlet for energy to be dissipated into heat or accelerating its own system and therefore some loss of raw hp/torque?
I'm sure there is a slight weight difference, but it's very very slight. I've never disassembled the transaxle on a FWD car, and I don't want to. It isn't more of a drain on the engine. I stand my my original comment. LSD makes a car 2 wheel drive. Non LSD cars become ONE wheel drive as soon as the tire with the least amount of traction breaks loose.
If the above is answered, that would put the nails in the coffin of the question of LSD or no LSD?
Let's all drop some lsd!
Oh Footnote to above conversation with Dennis M. of Hassel Mini: He said it was highly effective in track situations and in getting the car to do really advanced cornering techniques. I sorta killed the man's explanation of its necessity or non necessity by mixing in my own understanding of FWD differential systems. Do not fear! he is a lot more knowledgable than I made him seem! (no salesman has him beat that I have met)
5th Gear
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 931
Likes: 14
From: NW Georgia, USA
Originally Posted by powerband
"Non LSD cars become ONE wheel drive as soon as the tire with the least amount of traction breaks loose."
And, from my understanding, a ONE-wheel drive on the wrong wheel.
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And, from my understanding, a ONE-wheel drive on the wrong wheel.
-
Rawhyde
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
Blam. adding on Limited Slip differential. It cannot hurt, and, in a drag/fun run, it will make it rock out.
I can see LSDF being a thing that more and more I would rely upon in country driving fun vs dsc/astc button being on. This goes along with the comments people make about LSD. The longer someone drives cars, the more their comments on LSD being neat increase. Normally, it is the other way. Gimmicks tend to die off the list of recommendations.
500 dollars is 135 dollars a year for 5 years if i dont pay off the loan sooner. eh. probably kinda cool to get. at least I know i maxed out the car.
I can see LSDF being a thing that more and more I would rely upon in country driving fun vs dsc/astc button being on. This goes along with the comments people make about LSD. The longer someone drives cars, the more their comments on LSD being neat increase. Normally, it is the other way. Gimmicks tend to die off the list of recommendations.
500 dollars is 135 dollars a year for 5 years if i dont pay off the loan sooner. eh. probably kinda cool to get. at least I know i maxed out the car.
3rd Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
From: NorCal
Originally Posted by El_Jefe
Blam. adding on Limited Slip differential.
Because of financial reasons, I'm passing on the DSC. I just hope my car doesn't skid sideway off the mountain road and over the trees.
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
Originally Posted by powerband
From reading the responses in this thread, I think you and I made the right choice to add LSD.
Because of financial reasons, I'm passing on the DSC. I just hope my car doesn't skid sideway off the mountain road and over the trees.
Because of financial reasons, I'm passing on the DSC. I just hope my car doesn't skid sideway off the mountain road and over the trees.
3rd Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
From: NorCal
I have to remind myself that, in addition to the optional DSC, many other safety devices come standard in the MINI. This, from www.newcartestdrive.com :
"The brakes are equally impressive Brake hard at speed and the Mini feels sucked to the earth and stops quickly. The four-wheel disc brakes (vented in front) come with four-channel ABS, Electronic Brake-force Distribution (EBD), and Corner Brake Control (CBC). EBD distributes front-to-rear brake forces for improved stability and shorter stopping distances. CBC evens braking forces side to side, important when braking in the middle of a corner (usually a driving faux pas). Optional Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) applies the brakes at individual wheels and reduces engine torque when it senses you're skidding or not traveling on your intended path."
"The brakes are equally impressive Brake hard at speed and the Mini feels sucked to the earth and stops quickly. The four-wheel disc brakes (vented in front) come with four-channel ABS, Electronic Brake-force Distribution (EBD), and Corner Brake Control (CBC). EBD distributes front-to-rear brake forces for improved stability and shorter stopping distances. CBC evens braking forces side to side, important when braking in the middle of a corner (usually a driving faux pas). Optional Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) applies the brakes at individual wheels and reduces engine torque when it senses you're skidding or not traveling on your intended path."
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,284
Likes: 1
From: Middle Earth
Originally Posted by powerband
I am "reaching" to buy the MCS, so I need to keep the price as low as possible. At $500 each for DSC and LSD, I can save a grand, which significantly reduces the down and the monthly payment. (This is helpful since I already own an '06 car of another marquee.)
My questions:
1) Since the Mini is such a light, go-kart-like car, does it really rely on these systems? I can see them as useful safety devices on heavier cars like a BMW 3 series or 5 series, but on a little car like the mini I wonder if they're often triggered.
2) Although I don't intend to track the MCS, I would like to drive the mountain twisties aggressively. I have taken driving courses in the past and will add a few more driving courses, so I don't think my skill will be limiting; taking this into consideration, will I skid off the mountain roads and over the trees if the MCS doesn't have the DSC and the LSD?
I know that if I can afford them, I should add them (I can hear the recommendation now). But I would like to avoid their purchase and I am wondering if I will still be ok driving the car aggressively on occasions.
Thank you for your imput!
My questions:
1) Since the Mini is such a light, go-kart-like car, does it really rely on these systems? I can see them as useful safety devices on heavier cars like a BMW 3 series or 5 series, but on a little car like the mini I wonder if they're often triggered.
2) Although I don't intend to track the MCS, I would like to drive the mountain twisties aggressively. I have taken driving courses in the past and will add a few more driving courses, so I don't think my skill will be limiting; taking this into consideration, will I skid off the mountain roads and over the trees if the MCS doesn't have the DSC and the LSD?
I know that if I can afford them, I should add them (I can hear the recommendation now
). But I would like to avoid their purchase and I am wondering if I will still be ok driving the car aggressively on occasions.Thank you for your imput!
You also do not mention what other items you are spec'ing you car with. If you are choosing leather then you can certainly afford the DSC and LSD. If you are spec'ing a bare bones MCS then I would still say get the LSD and DSC.
They did not offer the LSD in '02 so I only had the DSC and it saved my bacon more than once. Usually not for something I did but for that unexpected situation where someone pulls out in front of you. It also is amazing when you encounter sand on the road at the apex of a blind corner. ( OK, I shouldn't have been driving that fast, but it did it's job and saved my bacon )
My '06 MCS has both and the difference is startling. Because of the LSD the DSC/AST+ does not engage nearly as much. It maintains traction from a standing start even over wet paint lines on the road. Agressive corner exits are a piece of cake. Winter traction is amazing.
All of the driving courses in the world are no substitute for DSC and LSD. They can react in a fraction of the time of even professional drivers. DSC can do things even the best drived could never do and that is to selectively brake with only one wheel at a time to correct a skid. The best thing preformance driving schools teach people is that fast driving is best done on the track.
DrObnxs has it right: "This is just flat out BS! the reaction time of these systems is faster than the human, and the ability to brake each wheel independantly is a control option not even avialable to the driver. Many times, the system will save your *** before you have time to pucker! Also, for spirited driving on the street, I've never seen a windy road with corner workers towarn of that spot of gravel right around the blind turn.
What it all comes down to is this. These two features give each and every driver additional benefit in certain situations. There is no driver in the world that can't be helped by these system.
Look at the Ubersports cars. They have these systems, and now they are coming out with variable system (from grandma to hang out the tail a bunch before intervening). There will be more of this, not less, and our cars will be better, and safer for it. (and it does all come down to programming. The Minis system slows the car around a lap, some of the other cars can be driven faster by almost all driver with the systems....)
I find it better to think about these things like insurance deductables. Sure the car is cheaper with out the options, but down the road you may pay more as you get in trouble that could have been avioded with the options. Each answer is based on each individuals particular situation and preferences.
Figure out your own cost/risk tolerance, and act accordingly.
FWIW, I will never leave an option like this off a street driven car, if it's available. Track car might get a different answer.
Matt"
I'll never own another car without DSC and LSD.
P.S. AWD would be nice also BMW/MINI if you are reading these. I understand that Getrag has a nice little system already to install. Hint hint!
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
I do not see YET where LSD would help you as a safety feature.
in snow, astc stops wheel slip right? I watched that u-tube tv show where it explains all but LSD. Asct makes the tires slow down enough that they grip the ice and snow and can accelerate the vehicle without breaking friction.
I agree 100% about the DSC. it is the best option on a mini to buy.
I am still wandering on LSD however. I have a couple of more days to decide before I would delay my car being recieved.
I do not like wasting money. I am under the understanding that LSD's limit of slipping will not really show up if I have asct and dsc enabled. True, untrue?
in snow, astc stops wheel slip right? I watched that u-tube tv show where it explains all but LSD. Asct makes the tires slow down enough that they grip the ice and snow and can accelerate the vehicle without breaking friction.
I agree 100% about the DSC. it is the best option on a mini to buy.
I am still wandering on LSD however. I have a couple of more days to decide before I would delay my car being recieved.
I do not like wasting money. I am under the understanding that LSD's limit of slipping will not really show up if I have asct and dsc enabled. True, untrue?
Originally Posted by El_Jefe
...I do not like wasting money. I am under the understanding that LSD's limit of slipping will not really show up if I have asct and dsc enabled. True, untrue?
My view - if you don't know what LSD is, you most likely don't need it. It WILL come into play if one tire hits gravel or another slippery surface. Otherwise it's all about performance.
Do you have a FWD car now? Do you ever spin the inside tire when accelerating out of a turn? If not, you probably don't need it.
Are you going to be increasing the power level (JCW/pulley, etc.) or leaving it stock?
I'm with Bilbo - I'd get 'em both. But that's me. Then again, I also have five cars
, so consider the source.
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
Originally Posted by Eric_Rowland
Untrue. The LSD will help prevent the wheels from spinning at different rates, thus help delay the onset of ASC+T cutting the throttle.
My view - if you don't know what LSD is, you most likely don't need it. It WILL come into play if one tire hits gravel or another slippery surface. Otherwise it's all about performance.
Do you have a FWD car now? Do you ever spin the inside tire when accelerating out of a turn? If not, you probably don't need it.
Are you going to be increasing the power level (JCW/pulley, etc.) or leaving it stock?
I'm with Bilbo - I'd get 'em both. But that's me. Then again, I also have five cars, so consider the source.
My view - if you don't know what LSD is, you most likely don't need it. It WILL come into play if one tire hits gravel or another slippery surface. Otherwise it's all about performance.
Do you have a FWD car now? Do you ever spin the inside tire when accelerating out of a turn? If not, you probably don't need it.
Are you going to be increasing the power level (JCW/pulley, etc.) or leaving it stock?
I'm with Bilbo - I'd get 'em both. But that's me. Then again, I also have five cars
, so consider the source. 
I wont be modding it much. I will be babying it much. However, I do love a good drag when I feel it's needed. I called up Dennis Miniero and gave him a voice mail to tag it onto the total
Now, the sucker is maxed out mechanically for what I can afford.
5th Gear
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 965
Likes: 0
From: Charlotte, NC
You already received some very good advice from some about LSD. You really need to read up on the basics of how it works and what it does. Then make your own decision.
Originally Posted by El_Jefe
I do not see YET where LSD would help you as a safety feature.
in snow, astc stops wheel slip right? I watched that u-tube tv show where it explains all but LSD. Asct makes the tires slow down enough that they grip the ice and snow and can accelerate the vehicle without breaking friction.
I agree 100% about the DSC. it is the best option on a mini to buy.
I am still wandering on LSD however. I have a couple of more days to decide before I would delay my car being recieved.
I do not like wasting money. I am under the understanding that LSD's limit of slipping will not really show up if I have asct and dsc enabled. True, untrue?
in snow, astc stops wheel slip right? I watched that u-tube tv show where it explains all but LSD. Asct makes the tires slow down enough that they grip the ice and snow and can accelerate the vehicle without breaking friction.
I agree 100% about the DSC. it is the best option on a mini to buy.
I am still wandering on LSD however. I have a couple of more days to decide before I would delay my car being recieved.
I do not like wasting money. I am under the understanding that LSD's limit of slipping will not really show up if I have asct and dsc enabled. True, untrue?
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
Originally Posted by mikem53
You already received some very good advice from some about LSD. You really need to read up on the basics of how it works and what it does. Then make your own decision.
The usefulness of it as a safety tool is limited to the degree ASCT allows it work. I got it anyways as the idea of easier pull on the car on a drag is a great thing to have. I also did not want to have asct kick in when I pull out of a shopping center onto these busy sidestreets.
Initially I was like, "hm, the dsc/asct would kick in and then render that agressive wrenching move useless. But, the asct and dsc are safety features that I would want on 95% of the time...."
then it dawned on me that around town I have never ever spun out or plowed in my huge cars. I dont think then I would bother keeping both on when im driving for enjoyment in dry weather, so , that means LSD would be in full use for the majority of my driving miles. Really, it takes a lot to explain the whole thing. There are 6 systems at work, ABS, EBD (the variated breaking on cornering thing), ASTC, DSC and LSD. and, the regular differential for the FWD that is quite complex in and of itself. That's a heck of a lot to weed through knowledge wise
I am SOOO glad I asked the questions I did, I would have not even gotten the MCS if I couldnt be convinced of its safety features.thanx all, car is complete and on its way... october :(
6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,072
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by Jeremy1026
What do each of them do? I have DSC in my MC, but don't understand what it actually does, and when I should turn it on and off.
If you tried a search on the above terms, you would find some really useful information.
5th Gear
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 931
Likes: 14
From: NW Georgia, USA
ASC+T is plain ol' traction control. Keeps you from burning off the tires. It can be too agressive on occasion. If you take off and hit gravel or a slick spot, the car will lose all power. Can be disconcerting at times.
DSC is a system to help out when the car begins to skid, slide, or otherwise break loose. There are wheel speed sensors all around, yaw sensors, and steering angle sensors. If the car begins to skid, the system can brake individual wheels, reduce power, or even increase power via electronic throttle control to help keep the car on its intended course. It allows for plenty enough agressive driving, but autocross courses are a good place to de-activate it. Anytime you WANT the car to skid, rotate on its own axis, or do a 4 wheel drift; dsc needs to be off.
Somebody with better knowledge than me will chime in soon enough and tell you more. There'll also be some people who claim to have better reflexes than Clark Kent and Wally West combined who'll tell you how horrible the whole concept is...
Do some searching on the subject and keep an open mind. DSC saved my MINI (and me) in its first week, and I wasn't even showing off. A moron pulled out in front of me. I've posted the story in another thread on the subject, so you'll find it easily enough.
DSC isn't perfect, but it is a helpful thing to have.
Rawhyde
DSC is a system to help out when the car begins to skid, slide, or otherwise break loose. There are wheel speed sensors all around, yaw sensors, and steering angle sensors. If the car begins to skid, the system can brake individual wheels, reduce power, or even increase power via electronic throttle control to help keep the car on its intended course. It allows for plenty enough agressive driving, but autocross courses are a good place to de-activate it. Anytime you WANT the car to skid, rotate on its own axis, or do a 4 wheel drift; dsc needs to be off.
Somebody with better knowledge than me will chime in soon enough and tell you more. There'll also be some people who claim to have better reflexes than Clark Kent and Wally West combined who'll tell you how horrible the whole concept is...
Do some searching on the subject and keep an open mind. DSC saved my MINI (and me) in its first week, and I wasn't even showing off. A moron pulled out in front of me. I've posted the story in another thread on the subject, so you'll find it easily enough.
DSC isn't perfect, but it is a helpful thing to have.
Rawhyde
Coordinator :: Alabama Motoring Society & South East
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 10,170
Likes: 2
From: Burning-Ham Alabama
Unless you have a specific reason to turn it off (performance driving situation, stopped at a light facing uphill, etc), you might as well leave it on.
Today, while driving through a rain storm on a rutted highway, the ASC/DSC kicked in quite a few times as I hit unexpected puddles at highway speeds. It is really amazing how these systems keep the car going in the right direction when road surfaces and water depth can change faster than a human can react (even a nearly perfect human like myself!)
Today, while driving through a rain storm on a rutted highway, the ASC/DSC kicked in quite a few times as I hit unexpected puddles at highway speeds. It is really amazing how these systems keep the car going in the right direction when road surfaces and water depth can change faster than a human can react (even a nearly perfect human like myself!)
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,285
Likes: 19
From: Merrick, NY
Yeah, when you are heading in the direction that your wheel is not being turned, DSC kicks in and clips ONE wheel so that you spin around on that for a brief few hundreths of a second. it can right a car doing 60 mph in the snow from spining out of control, but more than that, it allows you to fully control a car in bad road conditions almost exactly like you can in dry. (also gravel)
asc is great for climbing over ice and snow without wheel slippage.
asc is great for climbing over ice and snow without wheel slippage.
6th Gear
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,218
Likes: 9
From: Milford Mass
some confusion perhaps as to turning DSC on/off.....if your DSC light is on that means DSC function is off---when DSC ight is off means DSC function is on
that being said, I leave the DSC function working all the time(DSC light off) except in some snow situatinos: if you are trying to rock the car out of a snow bank the DSC may rob some power so I hit the switch to turn it off(light on) and rock myself free, then hit the switch again to turn DSC back on(light off)---occasionally, I'll shut it off if I am at a dead stop on a snowy,slippery intersection and I want to be able to pull out fast, because if the wheels lose traction, the DSC kicks in and causes a major hesitation......has anyone stilll have this problem or is there some software fix for this?
that being said, I leave the DSC function working all the time(DSC light off) except in some snow situatinos: if you are trying to rock the car out of a snow bank the DSC may rob some power so I hit the switch to turn it off(light on) and rock myself free, then hit the switch again to turn DSC back on(light off)---occasionally, I'll shut it off if I am at a dead stop on a snowy,slippery intersection and I want to be able to pull out fast, because if the wheels lose traction, the DSC kicks in and causes a major hesitation......has anyone stilll have this problem or is there some software fix for this?