R50/R53 :: Hatch Talk (2002-2006) Cooper (R50) and Cooper S (R53) hatchback discussion.

R50/53 Keeping up with a S2000

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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 09:27 AM
  #51  
martinb's Avatar
martinb
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From: Silicon Valley
Originally Posted by SniperDetailing
S2000s actually repsond extremely poorly to modifications unless you throw a supercharger or tubro on there
That's why Mini did exactly that. A supercharged S2000 would be awesome.

And similar results can be optained on the Miata. There was one guy I worked with who supercharged his Miata. It was VERY quick. And another friend turbocharged his and ended up with about 260 HP. That thing was unbelievably fast. Like you needed a Z06 or a Viper to beat it.
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 09:30 AM
  #52  
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martinb
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From: Silicon Valley
Originally Posted by nom nom
I have an '03 AP1 and an '09 factory JCW. The AP1 is technically faster, but the JCW FEELS faster in most situations and is more fun to drive.

It's certainly fun. Every once in a while, I'll suck some sporty driver into a corner and then nail it on the exit. It's fun to look in the rear view mirror and watch them fade behind me in a clould of my tire smoke. 'Not the fastest way through a corner, certainly, but it's just plain fun to light up both fronts for a good ways.
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 01:45 PM
  #53  
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submitaweasel
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From: LOLhio
Originally Posted by martinb
That's why Mini did exactly that. A supercharged S2000 would be awesome.

And similar results can be optained on the Miata. There was one guy I worked with who supercharged his Miata. It was VERY quick. And another friend turbocharged his and ended up with about 260 HP. That thing was unbelievably fast. Like you needed a Z06 or a Viper to beat it.
Problem with adding forced induction to an S2K is it is already a "built" naturally aspirated engine...you run BIG risks boosting an engine like that unless you're willing to build the bottom end as well...
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 02:31 PM
  #54  
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dannyhavok
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From: Vancouver Island, Canada
I miss my CBR.



Originally Posted by submitaweasel
I learned from my CBR that even though you can't feel the torque delivery...it is there...an entire 40 ft lbs but it can hit triple digit speeds faster than my mind can comprehend...
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 02:34 PM
  #55  
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From: LOLhio
Originally Posted by dannyhavok
I miss my CBR.

I don't think I've ever seen an F4 before...I thought Honda went straight from the F3 to F4i...Ive got a 2006 F4i and love it
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 06:07 PM
  #56  
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pjdaustin
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From: Austin
NO WAY ! I also own an s2000. Different car class all together. FAster than a Porsche Boxster and very reliable too. My favorite car of all time.
 
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Old Aug 31, 2012 | 06:38 PM
  #57  
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dannyhavok
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From: Vancouver Island, Canada
I'm not positive, but I believe the F4 was just 1999 and 2000... they went fuel injected in 2001. It was a really great bike, incredibly reliable, just needed oil changes. I'm ashamed to say I did not take excellent care of it. I opened it up after winter storage, and the airbox was FULL of bees, dead moths, and god knows what else. I can't believe it still ran so good with so much crap blocking the air filter

I'd love to get another one. I've been thinking about it a lot lately!

/end threadjack


Originally Posted by submitaweasel
I don't think I've ever seen an F4 before...I thought Honda went straight from the F3 to F4i...Ive got a 2006 F4i and love it
 
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Old Sep 1, 2012 | 06:19 PM
  #58  
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SniperDetailing
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From: Shorewood, WI
Originally Posted by martinb
That's why Mini did exactly that. A supercharged S2000 would be awesome.

And similar results can be optained on the Miata. There was one guy I worked with who supercharged his Miata. It was VERY quick. And another friend turbocharged his and ended up with about 260 HP. That thing was unbelievably fast. Like you needed a Z06 or a Viper to beat it.
Yeah turbo/supercharged miatas are awesome, but the supercharger is proven to be faster around a road course or autox course because of the linear power delivery and the low-end torque. Everyone knows if you want to go ludicrously fast in a Miata though you should throw an LSX engine in it. Definitely a great budget sleeper those cars.
 
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Old Sep 1, 2012 | 09:38 PM
  #59  
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From: LOLhio
Originally Posted by SniperDetailing
Yeah turbo/supercharged miatas are awesome, but the supercharger is proven to be faster around a road course or autox course because of the linear power delivery and the low-end torque. Everyone knows if you want to go ludicrously fast in a Miata though you should throw an LSX engine in it. Definitely a great budget sleeper those cars.
or drift it with an LSX
 
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Old Sep 1, 2012 | 10:33 PM
  #60  
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s2000 is a superior sports car, not girly at all! Talk to any track junky about an s2k and ask what their opinion is. Strong HP, high revver, rwd, great handling, etc..

BUT, if you are talking light to light, you may keep up as TQ numbers are low in the s2k and the real HP numbers come up at high revs. If you are looking for straight line, light to light runner, get something with a v8.. LOTS of FUN!
 
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Old Sep 2, 2012 | 10:31 AM
  #61  
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GPToyz
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Originally Posted by busyguy8
s2000 is a superior sports car, not girly at all! Talk to any track junky about an s2k and ask what their opinion is. Strong HP, high revver, rwd, great handling, etc..

BUT, if you are talking light to light, you may keep up as TQ numbers are low in the s2k and the real HP numbers come up at high revs. If you are looking for straight line, light to light runner, get something with a v8.. LOTS of FUN!
My lady friend has an s2000 and I, of course have the r53 mcs.

The s2000, on paper, is very fast and is one of the most out of the box ready track cars. great suspension, lsd, 6 speed, pretty much maxed out hp, pretty much as lightweight as a car is gonna get and super unpractical.

Throw some hankook r-s3 or dunlop z1 star specs and a set of HAWK or Carbotech brake pads on the s2k and it's ready to have fun at the track. The only problem with the s2000 is that it needs a lot of skill to maximize all of its potential to drive fast.

#1 snap oversteer - the car has been engineered for the most nimble handling that's why the suspension is setup for the quickest response. If you don't pay attention to what the tires, suspension and steering wheel are telling you and are ready to countersteer - you will be thrown into a spin faster than you can blink. The ap1 (2.0 i4) was the most notorious, in the ap2 generation (2.2 i4) the tq increase and softer suspension helped alleviate this a little and the CR definitely inspires more confidence with aero and bigger tires.

#2 most people including myself cannot focus on both the line and driving the car to redline in each gear. Your mind and ears tell you that a car is not suppose to rev this high and the vtec sounds like it's about to throw bits of top end all throughout the engine. BTW, this comes from a guy who has raced and tracked all sorts of motorcycles (125 honda rs 2 stroke, 600cc supersports, 1000cc built vtwins and 1000cc built i4s). I don't care what anyone says, but if they can watch the track and a stock location tach, then you must be going too slow. In order for anyone to drive fast, 100% of your eyes needs to be focused on looking out at the track and not glancing at your gauges. Your mind needs to recalibrate from the pedestrian level redlines of almost any other car to the 8000 rpm redline of the ap2 or 8800 redline of the ap1. The s2000 is definitely one of those cars when you are not driving in the power band the car feels sluggish, slow and unresponsive, but when you are driving in the power band (6k-8k+) the car feels right.

#3 tire pressure - again never have i met a car so sensitive to tire pressure. Most other cars, if the tire pressure isn't right, you'll feel a little sluggish if its too low and if it's too high it get's a little fun and exciting with some little slides that don't make you wet your pants. If the s2000's psi isn't right, especially, if it's too high, you make a nervous car even more unsteady by reducing contact patch.

#4 mental fatigue - In the s2000 you spend so much effort energy keeping the car from going into unrecoverable slide, frantic countersteer or making sure you are in the power band on top of what ever other driver is concerned about (turn in, breaking markers) that you are just mentally fatigued much sooner than say driving a mini cooper. So over the course of 1 lap, the s2000 might be faster, but bc the mini is a more forgiving car, the average track driver maybe able to sustain a higher level of performance for a longer duration of time in the mini vs s2k.

The mini cooper, is not track ready out of the box and definitely needed some cash thrown at it to make it reliable on the track. Now this is not to say it is a bad track car, but the chassis is so easy to drive fast, that most people can probably start pushing their car after the basics of tracking are learned. On the track, one with minimal straight lines, say Streets of Willow, my mini cooper is more than capable of slicing and dicing with s2000s.

last point, with the mini coopers flatter more broader power band, it's also easier to drive a defensive line that the s2000 cannot over come, so sacrifice a turn, go in hard and ugly and do whatever you can to get in front of the s2000, at that point you can fend off the s2000 from a defensive position using the fact that they need to carry speed through a corner whereas we can point and shoot from corner to corner.

At the end of the day, when you are going good in the s2000 you know it was you controlling the car. The only other modern car I can say that about is a mazda miata (no power steering, brakes, traction control or any other funny electronics). At the other end of the spectrum is the Nissan GT-R. While in the s2000, you need to control the car, the GT-R is really you sit in the car, you turn the wheel left and right, move your feet left and right, make sure to have a good time, and the computers will keep you from killing yourself. The s2000 is an extremely rewarding car to drive, I never ever find myself asking man I wish I had better suspension, or I wish I had an LSD or I wish I had this go fast part or that one. For most people, the s2000 out of the box, the only thing you will really wish for is....I wish I had more cojones to drive this car faster.
 

Last edited by GPToyz; Sep 2, 2012 at 10:36 AM.
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Old Sep 2, 2012 | 11:59 AM
  #62  
fergy016's Avatar
fergy016
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Originally Posted by submitaweasel
Problem with adding forced induction to an S2K is it is already a "built" naturally aspirated engine...you run BIG risks boosting an engine like that unless you're willing to build the bottom end as well...
Not as much as you think. Just keep in mind the high compression, but the internals are forged from the factory allowing you to stress the engine a bit more than stock and get quite a return. I have had an eye on s2k's, mcs, and the like for quite some time. My gf has a 2012 mcs and it is a blast to drive in all levels, slow/fast/regular pace, and the s2k doesn't meet all that.
 
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Old Sep 2, 2012 | 12:18 PM
  #63  
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From: Louisville , KY
If you want to keep up with it just make him shift at your red line.
 
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