I'm really disappointed how MINI is dealing with its marketing and dealers charging way way over MSRP.

First... the marketing. There are no TV commercials for the car. Many of the billboards for the car don't even contain a pic of the car. I know what they are doing... trying to make the car unique and creative a weird buzz about it. They've done that somewhat... but have FAILED MISERABLY to market this car to the mass US public. I would say 90% of the US population still have no darn clue what this car is when they see one on the road. I fault MINI/BMW for this. To me this hurts the car big time.

Second... dealers charging over MSRP are killing this car. Some dealers have 10+ MINI S models sitting in their lots because they want 30k+ for the cars and people would rather jump off a cliff than pay this high of a price. This works hand in hand with the marketing strategy they have... If ONE, it's overpriced by some dealers and TWO there is a major lack of advertising... how is this car going to succeed in the long run?

Yes, this car is just plain rad and yes I can't wait to get my "S" but this is all just a major joke with the advertising games and dealers jacking the prices. I truly hope those dealers stockpiling 30k+ priced MINIs never sell their cars and it hurts them. I'm truly wishing for a major change soon.

 

I definatley agree that the car has not been well advertized, but then again, at any dealer you go to there is at least a nine month waiting list to get one, so they must be doing something right. It is all about supply and demand, the supply is low for the first production year, and the demand is high, no need to increase the demand and waste money by putting ads on TV, which are expensive.

 

I do hope the MINI becomes a car for everyone and not just a
car for a select group of MINI fanatics (a group that I am member of)

 

I suppose those of us smitten by the new MINI would take comfort in knowing that BMW will, like some sort of mother hen, keep their selected dealers in check by making them adhere to stringent rules regarding pricing and customer service. And I think they have done that, to some extent.

Ever since I saw my first Mini, a tricked out, candy apple red, Topanga Canyon road race, I wanted one. About a year ago, I can't remember where, I heard someting about a new MINI that was to hit our shores in 2002. So when the Auto Show came to Chicago, I went, mainly to see the Cooper.

As soon as I laid eyes on the small group of MINIs on display, I knew these cars were something special. As I read the literature, inspected the cars, sat in the driver's seat, looked under the hood, I found myself getting excited about a new car for the first time since 1987 (I wanted a Buick Grand National). I new these cars would be a hit...BMW had hit a home run. Outta the park.

And I think everone who has seen this car up close knew the same thing.

I knew to that point in time there had been little media attention surrounding the car. That was good, because I feared there was little time before this car became hot, probably hotter than availability. I ordered my MINI S in early April, and almost went on the 2003 arrival list.

So, we have a great car, in high demand, with limited production. It seems BMW has offered its dealers some direction with regard to customer service and pricing issues. Many buyers are getting their cars at MSRP. But let's face it, auto dealers have never been known to be the gold standard when it comes to scrupulous behavior, and the situation is tempting. There are going to be dealers who want to cash in. And really, they should be able to, to a degree. From what I can tell,(except for the LA area, where price gouging should probably have been expected) the cars with the extras and the markups are the ones on the lots. If you want a MINI now, in a hot market, expect to pay.

When I ordered my MINI, the dealer definitely had an "If I don't sell this car to you I can easily sell it to someone else" attitude. I was trying to get him to put in writing that I would be paying MSRP upon delivery. He said three times that they could easily sell the car for $3,000 more than MSRP. The third time he said that, I called him on it, and he adjusted his attitude. No one wants to be at the mercy of the seller. It goes against the grain.

Hopefully, BMW will be able to continue to influence their dealers. Considering how hot this car is, I think they have managed to do that.

 

The new Austin Powers movie coming out this summer should provide planty of exposure. ...But why do you want to advertise and create even more demand for something that's already so rare that there is rampant price gouging? If you create even more demand for something that's already unattainable you may just frustrate the new customers and give the company even more of a black eye. So far BMW doesn't seem to plan to build up production to meet demand anytime soon a la Chrysler with the PT Cruiser. If you ask me they're right not to advertise any more than they are.

 

I agree w/ 55. Why should they spend more $$ on advertising thus raise the price of the cars to pay for it? BMW is not a non-profit company.

 

Hey and look at it this way.....
If they did more advertising...... People in MINIs wouldn't be turning as many heads.
I agree with the trend here..... It's selling faster than they can make them. Why would they waste money on advertising.
SW

 

I can think of tons of reasons MINI should be advertising this car:

1. Many dealers now have lots of these cars because the price is so jacked. Thus these cars are NOT on the road and in people's hands.

2. The PT Cruiser when it came out had a year waiting list in places, but it advertised anyways and the demand grew even larger. In response, Chrysler upped production.

3. Reselling this car (besides on ebay) is a real pain! For example, trying to sell a regular MINI in Seattle, WA (silver/black, sport/performance packages) and haven't got on single call on the car. People have no darn clue what it is... hear things like this while it is being driven... "Nice car, what is it? ... Oh, never heard of that. Where would I get one? Where would I find out more about it?" People just have no clue. Most people in Seattle think it is some sort of MOD car or KIT car.

4. Marketing 101. If you have a hot product and it sells itself, do you advertise anyways? Heck yes you do every darn time! is the answer. Advertising surveys have shown that this adds longevity to the sales numbers for the product.

5. All these waiting lists and long lines can be very misleading. Many people are on 5 or 6 waiting lists in hopes to get a MINI faster (I have 2 regular MINIs now and a S on the way... I was and still am on a total of 4 waiting lists). Many MINIs that have been bought are now sitting in USED car lots, exotic car dealerships, and other misc dealerships by dealers hoping to cash in on the car.

So look at it this way... 1/3 of the waiting lists could just be multiple waitings by people. And many of the MINIs already sold are sitting in second hand dealerships and NOT in consumer garages (Just look at how many MINIs are on ebay at any given time).

I'm sure there are things I've missed. I just think that MINI is missing the boat on this one. Things could be better.

 

Sounds like what really has you irked is you haven't sold yours yet....BMW isn't having any trouble selling theirs and won't any time soon. It was never BMW's intention for this to be a PT Cruiser type sales model. Part of this cars attraction is its uniqueness...sell 100,000 a year and that is gone very quick. Its difficult to be too critical of BMW's business plans when you consider that these folks have only been selling cars in the USA since 1975, and have grown to have a considerable share of the market in that short time. Business 101 says the idea in the end is to be profitable by making a superior product at a competitive price. That is exactly what the MINI is and that unlike the PT Cruiser, it will be a great car even when there are thousands on the road and everybody knows what it is...like every BMW.
Keep in mind that Chrysler did no TV advertising for the PT Cruiser, Viper, and Prowler and when was the last time you saw an TV ad for Ford's SVT Focus? I like the mystery surrounding the MINI I drive...but then I am not trying to sell mine.
:smile:

Joe

 

This reminds me of when the Miata came out. I don't think there was a Miata commercial until '92 or so (the mercy mercy me ad?)

I saw a mint yellow/white classic Mini wagon at a dealer this weekend

 

>>Sounds like what really has you irked is you haven't sold yours yet....BMW isn't having any trouble selling theirs and won't any time soon. It was never BMW's intention for this to be a PT Cruiser type sales model. Part of this cars attraction is its uniqueness...sell 100,000 a year and that is gone very quick. Its difficult to be too critical of BMW's business plans when you consider that these folks have only been selling cars in the USA since 1975, and have grown to have a considerable share of the market in that short time. Business 101 says the idea in the end is to be profitable by making a superior product at a competitive price. That is exactly what the MINI is and that unlike the PT Cruiser, it will be a great car even when there are thousands on the road and everybody knows what it is...like every BMW.
>>Keep in mind that Chrysler did no TV advertising for the PT Cruiser, Viper, and Prowler and when was the last time you saw an TV ad for Ford's SVT Focus? I like the mystery surrounding the MINI I drive...but then I am not trying to sell mine.
>>
>>
>>Joe

NO, this is not because I can't sell one of my MINIs... that has nothing to do with it as a whole.

and Yes, Chrysler DID advertise the PT Cruiser the first year it came out. Flashback... remember the commercials with the mom pushing the toddler in the stroller and then the toddler pointing to the PT and saying "what is that?"

...this was Chrysler's way of simply telling people what the car was... and it worked!

 

Something else to consider.....
It has been said before that MINI and BMW are not pushing to be associated.
If this is the case then It seems likely that the funding may also be seperated, to an extent. Thus a smaller budget for ad campaigning.

I would guess that the advertising campaign will pick up pace between June and July. With Austin Powers just over the horizon I would bet they will get the name out a little more just before the movie hits.

Just a thought.
SW

 

I definatley agree that the movie is going to generate a lot of buzz about the cars, and MINI would be smart to try to advertize a little during that time. People might see it in the movie and go, "I like that car, but what in the world is it?" And that definatley wouldn't help the mini any.

 

High Anxiety -- Just how many minis are you trying to sell??

 

>>High Anxiety -- Just how many minis are you trying to sell??

Oops, I should clarify myself here. I currently have 2 regular MINIs (silver/black and a red/white). I have a red/white S on order scheduled for late June build. Here's what happened... bought the silver one first, but really wanted the red one but couldn't wait. Then of course 2 weeks later a red one was available... so I was like, "oh why not, i'll take that too." Now of course I have too many. So the silver/black reg is now for sale. I NEVER EVER intended to buy any of these cars to turn a profit or anything... it's just a lack of patience I guess on my part.

Hopefully I'll be able to unload my silver/black soon and give the red/white reg to my brother once my S comes in. So, no greed on my part. Just insanity!

 

High Anxiety,

I get it now. Thankfully I am more than an hours drive from any dealers or I'd probably be in your same situation. You should try listing your mini online with recycler.com. They're a real good source for cars sales in so cal (and TX and NV) and if the price is riht you may just be able to sell the silver one quickly. People here know what they are and are looking for a deal. Good luck.

 

Back in '98 when the first new beetles came through. VW asked the dealers to "agree" not to mark up the cars. They all complied here in San Diego, so i bought one. The cars sold like hot cakes at msrp. Now, if you want a new beetle ( sport-special edition -turbo-etc.)be prepared to pay the mark-up. A full five years later too. I knew when I first saw this car back in 1999, that to own one there would be a mark-up. I budgeted and planned ahead. It will be harder for those of you who see me flyin' down the highway, and decide there and then, you want a new MINI. I wish BMW had the guts to do what VW did. But, for VW the New Beetle was a gamble, they needed it to float their new image and sales. BMW needs nothing from this car but to stuff their pockets full of our hard earned cash. For me it is all worth it.

 

Just like it was a gamble for VW with the New Beetle... it is definitely a gamble for BMW with the MINI. Not sure if most people are aware of this... but BMW is actually losing money on the MINI at only moving 10k MINIs to the US this year. This is pretty much the norm for ALL Euro car makers when first testing out the US waters. They hope the car goes over well... if it does (and duh, I think it's obvious it is), then BMW plans more MINIs in the future along with other types of MINIs... possibly wagon MINIs and stuff like that.

 

Hey guys,

So far in Canada I've seen 2 Mini commercials on TV. It shows some video of the car. As far as dealer mark up goes, I haven't heard of it north of the border. My dealer never even hinted at it. When I went in, he quoted me the exact price that was on the Mini Canada website. $24950.00 CDN for the base.

I take delivery of a base Cooper BRG next weekend

Cheers

 

PLease America wake up! This BMW talk is very disturbing esspecially if people talk about things they don't/cannot know! 1st Bmw had a serious chalenge in keeping the mini alive! They bought the Rover group with all it's crap. Sold Landrover/Rangerover to Ford, had to get rid off Rover and MG and at the same time plan the life for the new mini! Things in Cowley, where it is being build, were very poor, a factory that was producing (Rover)cars in a 55 year old factory. So clean it out completly from the in side and put up a new factory in the old building because there was no more time to go and do it different. So in order not to make the same mistake as VW did with the beetle they kept it hidden for as long as possible. So in 8 months production was up and running without major problems and yes even for a big company like bmw that is very amazing.Nomally that takes 14 to 18 months to build a new plant to assemble cars. Yes I have seen it with my own eyes, been there when it was the Rover group and been in the factory with the bord members of BMW. They did a lot off research on what people would expect from the new mini, it had to drive and handle similar to the old mini, sporty. It is very diffcult to put the drive of the old mini in to a new car and make it new in looks
and keep some of the old and make it worth the money!! Well they did.
They had no clue it would get of to such a wicked start there! You guys normally want it big with a V8 in it. So how in the hell did anybody think this would happen with a 4 cylinder in the states
So please the car has just been introduct in the states with the cooper and the S, if they would have known that they would have probably introduced it last year like in Europe with a mini one and cooper. We don't get our cooper S till oktober, The dealer intro is this friday. So I'm not asking to feel sorry for bmw but understand the life off mini. About the advertising thats where VW made it's mistake a lot of talk and very high expectations that were not met. BMW never advertise on tv in europe as far as I know, can'nt remember a commercial nor did mini do so I believe. I'm happy with bmw being carreful with the mini thing!

 

I totally understand all BMW had to go through to reinvent the MINI and reintroduce it to the states. You're right, it's a major to do for sure on their part. I totally know the history of the MINI... only being a second generation American with still 80% of my family in Wales... I have had tons of Welsh/English relatives over the years own the original MINIs. I love this car... that's why I am buying it.

In regards to BMW TV commercials... I see tons of commercials here for the BMW... mainly the 7 series new one right now. So I know BMW does advertise for sure.

 

I totally agree with you! I think the marketing for the MINI is very strange, unless people know what the MINI logo looks like, when they see it on a billboard they won't have a clue to what it is trying to advertise. Also, I have not seen one commercial for the MINI yet..? I wonder what they're up to??? The upside to this sketchy advertising is that the MINI can stay special, it won't become your everyday car that everyone has, which is nice. It will stay in the hands of those who love and cherish it, those are the people who are willing to wait the 9 + months to get it exactly how they want it. I really do hope that the mark up on these cuties goes down soon!



Jeanna

 

>>4. Marketing 101. If you have a hot product and it sells itself, do you advertise anyways? Heck yes you do every darn time! is the answer. Advertising surveys have shown that this adds longevity to the sales numbers for the product.
>>

Umm, I'm not sure what marketing 101 you had but I dont remember that from any of the marketing classes I have had. If you can sell every product you produce without advertising dollars spent, its foolish to spend the money. Advertising does not necessarily create longevity in a product. Right now Mini is using something called "buzz"(yes an actual marketing term) It has shown to be WAY more effective in image marketing than advertising. Mini is also using word of mouth, also much more effective than advertising, and both are relatively cheap, as opposed to ad campaigns which are extremely expensive. The key to longevity is not awareness but rather perception. If Mini was advertising right now and grew its demand by 50%, that many more people would go to the Mini dealer and not be able to buy cars either because of availibilty or price. These people would now have a poor perception of Mini and find another brand. If Mini is smart they will try to fuel demand once they are in a better position to meet it. Just my take on the whole marketing thing.

 

>>>>4. Marketing 101. If you have a hot product and it sells itself, do you advertise anyways? Heck yes you do every darn time! is the answer. Advertising surveys have shown that this adds longevity to the sales numbers for the product.
>>>>
>>
>>Umm, I'm not sure what marketing 101 you had but I dont remember that from any of the marketing classes I have had. If you can sell every product you produce without advertising dollars spent, its foolish to spend the money. Advertising does not necessarily create longevity in a product. Right now Mini is using something called "buzz"(yes an actual marketing term) It has shown to be WAY more effective in image marketing than advertising. Mini is also using word of mouth, also much more effective than advertising, and both are relatively cheap, as opposed to ad campaigns which are extremely expensive. The key to longevity is not awareness but rather perception. If Mini was advertising right now and grew its demand by 50%, that many more people would go to the Mini dealer and not be able to buy cars either because of availibilty or price. These people would now have a poor perception of Mini and find another brand. If Mini is smart they will try to fuel demand once they are in a better position to meet it. Just my take on the whole marketing thing.

When marketing a hot product... you do continue to advertise and market it even if it is selling very well. Of course you don't advertise as heavily as with a product that is not already selling well, but nonetheless you do continue advertising. It's not foolish to continue spending money (in a realistic fashion) as it continues to keep the product in people's thoughts and showcases the product to new audiences who do not know of the product. And there is ALWAYS a new audience out there! Companies bank on it.

Yes, I know MINI is using "buzz" or street level marketing. But they are also following traditional routes of marketing through print (magazine, billboard, newspaper) as well. So they are NOT completely looking for buzz alone. And BMW has advertised its HOT products on television before as well.

BMW is looking for MINI to be more than just the Cooper. The Cooper is just the first product in the works. They plan on releasing different models in the future. Possibly including sedans and things of that nature. So MINI has a TON riding on this product. If this fails... a huge merging market they are hoping for is dead. This is something they are heavily banking on succeeding. I don't think they want this to fail. Advertising more heavily is to their benefit.

Where did I get this nutty marketing knowledge from you say? A marketing degree for starters. Then real world experience running the West Coast operations for Atlantic Records which I mainly focused on Street Marketing and "buzz" marketing as you would call it. I later headed up the Vivendi Universal Interactive web division and was responsible for many web marketing and development campaigns. I continue to consult in these areas.

 

HighAnxiety,
Aquabat,
I'll have to say that I agree with both of you here......
Marketing is necessary..... even on a product that is hot. BMW is doing a great job IMO.... Marketing to true automotive enthusiasts. ie through automotive ads and such.
I also agree that there is no reason to spend an extravagant amount of money to bring in buyers that you can't even supply. (Autos are not something you can work an extra day in the factory to meet demand.)This, as stated before, will put a bad taste in potential buyers mouths.
And lastly, I also understand that the last thing you want to do is allow suppy to catch up with demand too quickly. Therefore you play a happy medium and chose your battles wisely. ie..... Auto mags now main stream later.

In two to three years the mainstream will be saturated and at that point MINI will have to take all that money they made and WOW us again. What a fun little game.

SW