I've been a voyer here for years, but I'm thinking of finally pulling the trigger as my Tahoe is getting old.

I know the spec differences between the S and JCW, but why should I or why did you decide to go with the S model rather than the JCW? Is it easy to make up the hp difference aftermarket? Was it just price? Or is the JCW like other "top of the line" cars and the dealer rapes your wallet with markups?

I like the specs of the JCW, but can the S be just as good or better?

Thanks!

Brian

 

The JCW will have a better resale value. I purchased an S, if I had to do it over again, I would buy a JCW (Aero Kit). Plus a modified JCW will be faster then a modified S. The JCW come with a slightly bigger Turbo.

I say if money is not an issue, Go for the JCW. You won't regret it. Either way, they are both excellent fun vehicles.

 

If my wife could drive a manual I would have got the JCW, but I'm still with our MCSa! Planning on modding to JCW levels of power in the near future.

 

The factory JCW comes with different turbo, pistons, and clutch that cannot be done aftermarket. The exhaust and ECU and of course wheels can be done aftermarket. Those are the differences between the factory JCW and the S. The factory JCW does not include the aero kit nor the JCW suspension (those are available on the S also). I think the JCW is worth the extra money, I am considering one next year, but the nicely equipped S is a great car too.

 

If you can, get a JCW. Simple. An S is a fantastic car and can later be modified to about 225WHP for $1500 or so. I couldn't find a JCW, so I ended up with an S. I don't regret it!

And I think the only difference with the JCW is the turbo and the clutch. The pistons are the same as in an S. The rest, brakes, wheels, exhaust is a direct bolt on.

 

I went with the JCW partly because the last time I faced a decision like that was years ago. It was either save money and get an Integra GSR or get an Integra Type R. I went with the GSR and had ITR envy and regret for years. So this time around, I went with the JCW. I ordered mine 3.5 weeks ago, but am still waiting for it to go to production. :( Supposedly they only build them once per month, and I needed an April production unit since I wanted aero kit with the new factory installed price drop.

 

I would get the JCW if money's not an issue, but an S can be made just as fast, if not faster than the JCW because of its' higher compression. People have put the JCW turbo (with a tune) in the S for about $2500-3000 I think, and they're making way more power than a stock JCW. You do get an upgraded clutch and some other things that you wouldn't get with an S. Plus a lot more stock, warrantied power.

 

Several replies have said JCW over S especially if money is "no object". For me cost / value was part of the picture. A JCW equiped in a similar fashion as my MSC would have been $6K additional. For me, the cost / value equation just didn't work for the JCW, especially considering the performance gap between the S and the JCW was narrowed with the 2011 upgrades. Granted, I have not driven a JCW, but I am more than happy with the S. The real world difference between the Justa and the S is huge in performance and yet the cost difference isn't much, whereas the real world performance between the S and the JCW is much less yet the cost difference is pretty high, at least in my estimation.

So, there you go, a vote for the S over the JCW. Ultimately, only you know your finances and desires. You can't go wrong with either choice.

Keith

 

Don't forget the Big 13" Brembo brakes! JCW comes with them, it's over $2000 to add aftermarket. If you don't need an automatic I would go with the JCW.

BTW, Highlander709... You really need to drive a JWC. I think your position would be drastically different.

 

All great replies everyone! Of course a few thousand will be a factor, but the envy I think would outweigh that...

 

JCW. We have both and the JCW is always the one to get all the attention :P

 

So true it hurts. Back in 2004 I purchased a WRX. I wanted the STi. I thought I could modify it to STi levels of performance. When all was said and done it wasn't quite an STi. For the money I spent between parts and dyno time not to mention time I spent working on the car; I should have/could have purchased an STi from the word, "Go."

Never again.

I want a MINI. It will be a JCW. Buy nice, or buy twice.

 

(I have a 2010 S)

Pop over to the Alta Access Port post. Read along to where it finally says in the past few weeks, yes indeed cracking the 2011 S is not easy, and there is no estimate of when (or if) that will be figured out in a practical way. Lots of folks with S's from before 2011 can draw the pretty easy conclusion that S + AP = stock JCW for basic power/performance (more or less). Save thousands of $$, though of course no fancy brakes and a bunch of other things (though gen 2 stock S brakes = gen 1 JCW brakes already). Thus if you want a fair percentage more power in 2011 specifically and were noodling on easy end arounds, not so easy. Score 1 for JCW.

Where's the JCW kit so far for S's for 2011? If not there still, another minor JCW score. I didn't go there BTW, instead going Access Port married to JCW factory exhaust (somewhat different than the kit one) and JCW kit intake. Saved some $ still and > = to JCW kit performance step up.

Meanwhile if you want to up the HP on a JCW, happens that the AP still works for that motor in 2011. Given its core bigger turbo, stock to stock or modded to modded, JCW still prevails on powr potential. Another point for JCW.

BUT, yes the S to JCW performance gap has narrowed w/ 2011's. So, value of these points is arguably lower. And, given Mini/BMW has incrementally upgraded the Justa and then the S motor to fully variable cam timing, and has upped the performance incrementally along the way, you can connect the dots to figure out that could happen to 2012 JCW's, or maybe another end of generation run like the prior GP. Or, once the initial excitement wanes on CM, maybe a way to spike follow on year sales (a JCW model that is, and more attractive with a "new and refined" motor). Pretty classic car industry model life product management, though hard to know if they would plug the motor into an end of life model if it has to be recertified w/ the EPA for the other bodies distinct from the R60. Net, there could be a higher performance JCW motor before long, while the S presumably is now locked in for the rest of the gen 2 life (a few more years). Following the pattern though, that computer will be locked down, so may have no easy electronic tuning path like the 2011 JCW still has. This is all futures and speculative though, if you care.

There's really no bad answer in here--buy at your price point (assuming a 6 speed; if it's an automatic of course you have only the S choice).

 

I think the JCW with options has lower resell than the S and costs quite a bit more upfront. It is a damn nice car, but it's in need of some updates. If you have to get a 2011, I'd go for an S with the JCW package and maybe get a tune or the JCW tuning kit later. Maybe next year the factory JCW will be better value or at least have some of the '11 engine improvements.

If you have to have a BBK for the bling, wait till the factory maintenance is over and get some used JCW calipers or some Wilwoods or something for a grand.

 

When you get into the $30K+ market there are a lot of great sports car to buy both new and lightly used. Not sure I would spend that much for a Mini, even if it is an utterly ferocious one. For instance, I saw a Z4 M coupe, asking price $38K and only 8K miles on it. But to each his own. Also, my wallet isn't overflowing with cash. I guess if I could I would, but I can't so I'll slum it in my Cooper S.

 

Why would a JCW retail for less than an S....this makes no sense to me. It's like saying an M3 retails for less than a 335i.

 

It makes no sense because it isn't true. The factory JCW costs roughly $6.5k more than the MCS. You get brakes, exhaust, turbo, pistons (?), clutch, and wheels. Not an extreme amount of extra power, but at a premium of about 25% not an extreme amount of extra money either.

 

I meant as a return on investment the % you get back after X years is much less.

 

One post mentioned resale value of JCW vs MCS and indicated the JCW is less than the MCS. I doubt that, but I certainly find the more expensive vehicle, whether a JCW or a highly optioned MCS tends to depreciate at a higher rate both on a dollar and percentage basis than the base MSC with few options or the Justa. This is common with most vehicles. The extras, whether it's horsepower, leather, electronics, just tend to not hold their value in the resale market.

 

JCW Everyone who has bought one so far loves it!!!

 

The answer is simple for me, I want the automatic this time.

 

I think it would cost between $10-$12,000 to upgrade an "S" to approximate a JCW. The parts alone are over $7,000 before you add installation, then you need to consider the big turbo.

Besides... a JCW is just so much cooler than an "S"!

 

Coming from a 400hp STi I should have gotten an JCW instead of an S. Not to say the S doesn't put a smile on my face, but I do want more power. If I had to do it all over again, I woulda kept my STi regardless. It's a much more reliable car. But in return I have a fun car and a very happy fiancee with a HUGE ring. lol

 

Being on my 4th mini in less than 4 years and my last one being a JCW, I can only tell you that I wish I had gotten the JCW the first time around.

The extra power (especially with a good tune) and great brakes, I wouldn’t trade my JCW for anything else.

In either case, you’ll have a smile on your face.


Mark

 

For the money that the JCW is going to cost, I would not mind getting an '11 STI hatchback. Unfortunately thee are three issues with the STI: 1) Why the hell doesn't Subaru see fit to equip the Limited trim on the hatchback, 2) inam sure insurance is going to cost more, 3) gas will cost more, 4) (bonus) the interior is typical crappy Subaru. #4 would be alleviated somewhat by the Limited trim on the hatchback. Alas, issue #1 makes issue #4 that much worse.

Gas and insurance are not that big of a deal considering what I drive now.b It's just that if all I am looking for is something with four wheels, not entirely slow, handles well, and gets good mileage, I think a JCW is hard to beat.