Please read and help.

Well, this is my first manual car, and of course I had to learn how to drive manual in it. The dealership never told me anything about what is the right or wrong way of operating the clutch. I assume I drive normal with a little jerk left in my shifts. So yesterday, I decided to remedy the jerking motion. I went out to an empty parking lot and practiced starting from first gear. After about 10 minutes I felt the clutch didn't engage properly. I got out the car and it let off a burnt smell. I figure the clutch was worked a little hard. So I let it rest for a while and things seem like it was back to normal. Today I called the dealership and they told me to bring it in. The service manager at first told me that it was due to abuse and that it was not under warranty. I did not know what constitutes abuse of the clutch, but as far as I knew, I was just learning how to drive. The car have only 1,500 miles on it. And he says that it's too soon for the clutch to go. It's garanteed at 100,000 miles. I told him that this was my first car and that I was learning how to drive in it. Now he tells me that he's going to see what his boss can do and that I may or may not have to pay for the whole thing. Maybe just some of the cost. CAN YOU ALL PLEASE HELP ME! I do not know if it's really my fault (I was learning to drive), but I didn't know that a clutch could go bad like that. I need any advice that would help. Thank You. :???:

 

YIKES...

This sounds like their classic classification of "DRIVER ERROR" which is determined by a MINI Tech Rep... not from the dealership, but a specialist...

Cost is going to be about $2500

that is mostly labor.

I would call miniusa, don't push the issue that you were "learning" to drive manual... that is the kiss of death.
I would badger, bug, ***** and moan that since THEY guarantee the clutch at 100,000 miles (not sure about the facts) That It SHOUDL withstand Normal Traffic conditions and the occassional slip. Tell them you are very upset and that there is no way they can legally blame you for destroying your own clutch...

Scream to them - That a clutch burning out UNDER 2000 Miles is UNACCEPTABLE and that you will consult some outside professionals.

Now , I do not know if this will work out for ya... I offer no guarantees.

But... It worked for me. Then again, my clutch going out was determined to be THEIR fault... even after they tried to peg me with "Driver Error" It was a fight between me, my accountant, the service dept and MINIUSA. They came back with a "good Faith" replacement to cover it with warranty... BS coverup.

Good Luck and from what I know of the situation, and my own experiences, you're going to need some.

 

I would say that while learning to drive the car isn't really your fault, I surely would not expect a dealer to consider someone learning how to drive as a warrenty issue...could you imagine someone learning how to properlly brake on ice trying to get a warrenty claim? that said though...in just learning to drive the car - unless you learn by doing clutch drops or hold the clutch half way in all the way through the rpm band - the clutch should not have these problems this early on...this screams to me a manufacturing defect...I have many of a times pushed my S under acceleration from a stop which to really go fast a certain amount of clutch slip must be used to keep the rpms in the powerband...even to the point to where i can get a bit of burnt smell from the clutch but I have had NO problems what so ever from my clutch.

one side note - your honesty with the dealership is very promising...many people wouldn't have mentioned that they were learning to drive a std for the first time and skewed the truth just to make the dealership pay for something they don't want to...kudos for your honesty!

 

What is the ongoing problem? Sometimes if the clutch is a little over worked I think it will have that smell. But I would assume you couldn't have abused it in 1,500 miles, that would be an awful lot of abuse to constitute a replacement. If all of that milage was racing or something maybe.? So, what is the problem exactly? I'm no expert but tell us how you use the clutch.


Peter

 

Maybe I missed something in your post, but I didn't seem to read that you had any problems necessitating a clutch replacement. Why did you go to the dealer and why did they think you need a replaced clutch??

I frequently get the "burnt clutch" smell, but that in of itself means nothing. Just means you slipped it a bit much and it heated up. It will cool and run just fine. Doesn't mean you did ANY lasting damage or wear. Now, I wouldn't advise slipping it regularly, but practicing driving in a parking lot for a hour or so off/on should be fine. Probablly smelled a bit funky, but will last and last. Heck, I've dropped my clutch a few times and smelled that pretty good in MANY cars and never had any clutch issues afterwards. Again, don't do it regularly, but occasional sniffs of the "cooked clutch" shouldn't be problematic.

R

 

Hmmm...not sure where to go on this one.

As posted, it didn't sound to me that you think the clutch needs to be replaced. When the clutch finally cooled down, was it working as it should? The following day, did the car drive normally?

On the one hand, the dealership has a point in that the manufacturer or dealer isn't responsible for your learning curve and how that may affect the clutch.

However, if the car drives fine as it is now, it may be that you simply overheated the clutch a bit, and once cooled down, you'll be fine.

You may have shortened the life of the clutch, but unless you really, really heated it up to extremes, it may not need a complete replacement.

Which dealer are you working with?

 

I know I’ll get flamed but here goes. I don’t see it as the dealerships responsibility to teach you how to drive a manual transmission. There is a certain assumption that if you are buying a manual transmission you know how to use one. Driver’s licenses are not like pilots licenses as they don’t have an endorsement for clutch operation. Whereas it certainly is not the norm, with enough abuse a clutch can certainly be destroyed in 1500 miles. Whatever happened to taking responsibility for your own actions? Unless BMW decides to grant a good will repair or it is proven (highly unlikely given the circumstances) that it was a defective clutch, I would say learning to drive a manual transmission was a very expense lesson.

 

Hummmm. This is one of those "can't win" posts. While I too applaud your honesty, the fact is that you've probably toasted your clutch. It certainly is possible to destroy a clutch in less than 2000 miles (Remember Jay Leno's stunt on the Today show several months ago? Story is that he killed the clutch on one of those MCS's when the car had less than 100 miles on it. ). Intentional or not, that may well be what happened to you. Unfortunately none of us can verify this without seeing your car or your clutch.

Hopefully you have a honest dealer. If so, they can tell whether your clutch was cooked due to "driver error" or some mechanical flaw. If it's the latter, then they'll replace it for free. But if it's the former...as I have a feeling it is...then you owe them about $2500 for a new one.

But I also agree with Davbert's point...what exactly leads you to wanting to get the dealer to "check it out"? Does it still work? If so, then drive it as long as you can before shelling out the bucks to replace it. When it's really gone, that will be pretty obvious.

Sorry... Next time (of course, there won't be a next time now that you've learned), find a "friend's car" to practice on before getting your own.

 

a few more points

1) Can you ruin a clutch in a few thousand or hundred miles - YES

2) From what it sounds like he did to his clutch could you ruin it in a few hundred or thousand miles - NO

3) Sounds like he wasn't aware that this smell was just due to the clutch heating up too much and wanted to make sure everything was a-okay.

4) jerrygee - i don't believe he is trying to rip the dealer off - i believe he is just worried and was a bit unsure what to do.

 

Wow that really sucks.

Does reassure me that my choice of the aoutmatic CVT was the right one though.

Really true that you ought not to mention that you were learning to drive in it, thus you will give them an avenue in wich to shift the blame and responsibility to you, thus getting them off the financial hook.

 

I have to agree with alot of what has been said. Clutches are considered wear items (like brakes, tires and belts) by most car manufacturers and that means when it goes it is something that you have to replace. I wouldn't expect that just learning to drive it would burn the clutch out, but that is why whenever anyone asks me to teach them to drive stick I say "Not in my car". Maybe MINI will help you out alittle as far as the cost goes, that is if you do need a new clutch. But if you plan on having the car for a long time, plan on spending money down the road (hopefully around that 100000 mile mark) to have it replaced.

 

ok, let's pretend the clutch is trashed (albiet not likely) $2,500 for replacement is straight up highway robbery! It cost me $900 to change out the clutch in my BMW last year (which had 90k on it), so almost three times the costs is totally unacceptable in my experience.

I do agree with Casey, and Davbret on this one; one case of toasty-clutch smell won't kill it, and since you're saying you only smelled it once, I'd say no fatal harm done.

Keep driving it, but please minimize your clutch-pedal-riding from now on. Practice in a friends lowly Cavalier or Neon

Good luck,
Ryan

 

Sorta off topic - Tip for you - since you are new to a manually a little tip that Ryan hinted at that alot of newbies have problems with...there is a reason the dead pedal is there...you need to use it...when driving around down rest your foot on the clutch even though you think it isn't pushed in at all...it can cause it to be depressed slightly and you can get excessive clutch wear from this...when not shifting move your left foot to the dead pedal.

Cheers matey and best of luck with your new MINI
Casey

 

Thank you everyone who has responded. In full honesty, I do not think I abused my clutch in anyway, intentionally. I took it very easy during the break in period because I couldn't really get the shifts right. I Never, Never intentionally dropped the clutch. And I do not race my car. I would consider my daily driving normal with just a bit of jerk (don't know if that has anything to do with the clutch). I do agree that it is stupid to learn to drive standard on my MINI, but I never thought it would cause the clutch to burn out. The clutch was fine before yesterday. It was slow at the restaurant so I took her out in the lot to sharpen up my skills. I practiced going from a dead stop in first gear, never lettting the rpms pass 3K and letting go of the clutch. After about 10 minutes the clutch wouldn't engage properly. I just figured I worked the clutch too hard, so I let it cooled down. I think it drives normal now, but I'm just worried it may not be the same. The only reason why I was so concerned was because of the smell. I could still smell the same smell today, but I think it got better this evening. I'll drive her around some more to see if it gets any better. I just think the clutch overheated, that's all.

And, I am not one to lie about things if they were my fault. I never drove my car like i stole it so I don't see why the clutch would malfucntion at only 1,500 miles. If it was my fault, I'd step up to it. If it turns out to be my fault, then I will shake it off as an expensive lesson. But as I have stated, I do not abuse my clutch knowingly, so I did get upset that the service guy would tell me it was my fault. Thanks everyone. :smile:

 

Minipoo...

Sounds like the clutch will be fine. If it drives normally, then you shouldn't have any real problems. Keep an eye...and nose...out for anything that seems odd for the next few days, but if it works okay, you should be in the clear.

Clutch's can and do overheat from time to time, and they will let you know about it with smells and slippage.

Good Luck.

 

Hey Minipoo... sounds like you're just suffering some angst over your new toy. I refined stick driving on my MCS and even burned 'er up a bit backing out of a steep gravel driveway. Add to that the 1.5 hours spent with my friends son, teaching him to drive stick after he got himself trapped on a bit of an incline, and I'd say that if anyone's clutch would be rotten, it'd be mine. But it's fine. You won't break your car--and I'm sure you didn't. It probably would have been less hassle for you to contact a stick-friendly friend and ask them about the clutch smell, but you know what they say about hindsight... If the dealer tries to convince you that the clutch needs replaced, I'd get a second opinion. It just doesn't sound right. And if there really IS something wrong, then I'd definitely fight for it to be done under warranty--there's no reason you should have killed your clutch after 10 minutes of technique refinement.

All that out of the way... is it possible that you have the dreaded stumble, and that THAT is causing your jerkiness, rather than user error. I'd have the previously mentioned stickwise friend take it for a spin just to see--you could be banging your head off a wall for nothing.

G'luck!

 

I think the clutch just overheated yesterday, but I still can't explain why it still smelled so strong this morning. Everything is in working order now and I thank you all for your inputs. At least I have a peace of mind now.

 

Don't know if this will make you feel any better or not, but for the first few thousand miles there is a "new engine smell" from several different areas. I have tended to notice it more often in the exhaust, but I think it could be everything getting set. You've barely broken your car in. The smell may or may not be clutch-related.

Anyone else have "new engine smell" thoughts?

 

For newbies I also would suggest searching the net for some tutorials on how to properlly shift and use the clutch...the friend method is nice but it also tends to just pass on their bad habits to you....a combination of both is best

 

My favorite term in the Trucking Industry is "Driver Abuse" Same thing as Driver Error with out the happy nice middle man. I've had the Pleasure of working around trucks for almost the last 10 year and man, have I seen the funniest stuff when it comes to "Driver Abuse". I've seen guys burn clutches in the time it takes them to back out of my shop. I've also seen Clutches that mechanically fail before we even give them to the customer. My guess is pretty much the same as everyone's here, you didn't do anything really bad. I tought at least 6 people how to drive stick in my jeep and its clutch lasted 100,000 that includes at least one trip the Califoria desert where I'm pretty sure the clutch was acctually on fire.

That being said, I have to disagree with you about you intentions. I can't imagine you would set out to destroy the thing on the first try, however, Intentions don't really matter when it comes to mechanical abuse. Not knowing how to operate a machine properly can be abuse. It's like punching a really stuipid little kid in the face and saying, "I didn't intend to abuse him, I just wanted to smarten him up".