Hi.
I am new to NAM, this is my first post. During my reading of the many posts, I noticed a couple of things... (1) The R56 automatics generally show lower ETs than the 6 speed (huh?) and (2) Several references that 60 ft. times need to be better (a couple of guys posted that their top speed showed potential for lower ETs, but they needed to work on the 60 ft. times).

I am not a racer, but I thought that the manual trans should outperform the auto. I do know that with big blocks with scads of torque, an auto will launch better, especially with a high stall speed converter, but that is due to the torque multiplication of the converter. This is not generally seen with low torque engines.

The R56 engine employs BMW Valvetronic technology to provide better efficiency (fuel mileage), and it works well. However, the Valvetronic works as a throttle by varying the intake valve lift from Between .008" - .386" (approx) by using an electric motor to turn a cam, which effectively changes the "rocker ratio" (for lack of a better term). The R56 has a throttle body, but is used (closed) only when starting, to provide initial vacuum, and when something happens to the valvetronic actuator, and the engine goes into "limp mode" whereby the throttle body is used to control engine speed. Normally, the throttle body is fully open at all times when the engine is running.

The Valvetronic actuator is controlled by the ECU, in response to input from our friendly little electronic "drive-by-wire" throttle. In Sport mode, the gain is increased on the input from the throttle, so it takes less throttle movement for the ECU to see full throttle.

This does not change the response of the Valvetronic actuator itself, which requires approx. 1/3 second (300 mS) to go from idle to full throttle (full valve opening). Some have felt this as turbo lag, but the R56 turbo, due to its twin-scroll design, gives full boost at about 1400 rpm. This is not turbo lag, but Valvetronic lag.

When an R56 manual trans MCS is on the line, the intake valves are open very slightly, just enough to maintain one's launch rpm (2500-3500 is what I have read in the posts). I have read a couple where they either bogged the engine, or the engine reduced rpm to about 1400 at launch.

The engine did pick up, but the 1/3 sec. delay for the intake valves to open fully, I believe, is the culprit responsible for the high 60 ft. times.

When an R56 auto is on the line, the brakes are held(?), and the throttle is held fully open, and the engine works with full power against the torque converter and the brakes. That way, at launch, there is no Valvetronic lag, as the intake valves are already fully open.

I may be all wet, but this is how I envision it.

If this is the case, the Valvetronic lag could also be a factor in road racing, but could be compensated for by a good driver's feel.

Seeing that the R56 has a useable throttle body w/butterfly, maybe a savvy ECU tuner could program a "race mode", which would enable the throttle body for throttle control, while the Valvetronic actuator holds the intake valves fully open.

On the other hand, maybe someone could figure out a better launch procedure to get the Valvetronic actuator more closely to fully open just before launch.

Whady'a think?

I will post again later to formally introduce L'il Red.

 

only regular coopers (N12 engine) have valvetronic. Cooper S (N14) engine have Vanos, but no Valvetronic.

 

I guess I'm all wet, then! Oh, well, it ain't the first time, and won't be the last! What is Vanos?

 

variable valve timing. On the S it is only on the intake valves. It beats the hell out of my why they didnt put the Valvetronic and DUAL vanos on the Cooper S motor. That would really have been one heck of an engine. Maybe the bean counters got in the way, who knows?

I like your thinking on the Valvetronic topic though !

 

welcome to NAM by way. Is 'Lil red a Cooper S ?

Watch out, once the MINI mod bug bites you, your hooked like a crack addict.

 

Well.... thanks for the compliment on the concept. I was wondering if I was gonna get flamed 'cuz I didn't know what I was talking about. At least now I know a little more, thanks. I looked up the VANOS on wikipedia, I have to agree that the whole enchilada (dual VANOS and Valvetronic) would be a cool, high tech engine.

Say, I read that the Valvetronic engine, due to its multitude of extra thingys, was not able to safely rev much more than 6k or so. Seein' as how the N14 doesn't have this particular limitation, how many revs could the S engine stand, with additional breathing capabilities? Since I have added the Alta CAI, I have noticed definite improvement in breathing at higher revs. I have a self-imposed rpm limit of 6k, but the engine seems to want more. Before the intake swap, it was running out of juice about 5500.

 

The variable valve timing that our cars have, specifically with the Cooper S, is what helps to make that awesome amount of torque we have, so I would think it only helps with 60ft times....plus the MINI is a drag racer, it's meant for the road courses.

 

Thanks for the welcome! L'il Red is an '07 Cooper S. I got on NAM, and got the bug quick, especially after going to Alta's website. I ended up buying the whole enchilada. I have everything except for a red turbo intake hose (backordered because the mfgr. broke the mandrel, and I didn't want a black one) and the PnP ECU (should ship in December, I'm about #50 on the list). I have already removed the Bonnet Stripes and replaced them with a black 14" racing stripe. Also removed the scoop grill, and dremeled out the openings. This weekend I installed the CAI, and enjoyed the phhhhttt. Everyone notices it, and so far, everyone thinks the sound is cool. I will install the turbo-back one night this week. I am trying to stretch it out so I won't run out of mods. The boost tubes will probably be Saturday. I will probably wait a couple weeks to install the FMIC. I am trying to figure a good way to do a good job of hand engraving the shift pattern on a red snooker ball, for a shift ****. As soon as I figure that out, I'll do that. I also want to do a rear seat delete, and make my own little platform, with hatches and stuff for storage. I'm not planning to go too wild with the exterior mods, I like the sleeper look. I am sure I will find more mods to do later. I sure do enjoy it. The first week I found that L'il Red is a chick magnet! I have started going to some cruise-ins, and so far I have had the only Cooper. It gets lots of attention, tho'. He is like my own little HotRod. It is wonderful having a cool car. I have the only one in my town!

 

Yeah, the torque is what sold me! That and the quality of engineering. I was in the market for a car, now that I am commuting to Charlotte, 40 mi. each way. I always wanted a Mustang GT, considered buying one. But the whole purpose of buying a car was to rest my F-150, and to be a little more ecologically responsible. My web research led me to MINI, went to Flow MINI in Winston-Salem, NC for a test drive. That's all it took. L'il Red was on the lot, slept on it, bought him. I had a good experience at Flow, I recommend them highly. I do not regret not buying a 'Stang, even tho' I am a dyed-in-the-wool Ford man. The MINI pulls like it has a V8 under the hood, and it sounds good, too! I was impressed! I don't drive hard, I just like to have an occaisional run thru the gears to feel the butt dyno. And, better yet, I think L'il Red will soon be capable of better butt dyno figures than a 'Stang, without the appetite!

 

'Lil red is going to be a MONSTER ! The R56 has soo much power from the factory I cant even imagine what it's going to be like with all those mods. From the videos I have seen of the Alta Exhaust its gonna sound amazing.

About the shift **** thing, I wonder if one of those mall stores that engrave party favors and such could do it?

 

I had no problem launching with the manual in decent summers for autocross. 3-3.5k rpm drop left me good controllable wheel spin in the sport mode. Granted not drag strip like friction, but I think the manual MINI would do just fine in a drag.

 

I haven't heard of such a store, got a name, maybe? Right now I'm thinking of using a bored tube as a template to make the shift pattern lines be a geodesic, and making a depth stop on my engraver to do the lines. As far as the numbers go, I was thinking a modified drafting template. I'm gonna get a couple extra ***** to practice on. When I get it right, I can fill in the engraving with black paint.

 

I don't have trouble spinning the tires from standing still. TC off and just go.

 

This is where the 60 ft times for the auto are better as the wheelspin is kept under better modulation than the manual.
My first Mini was an 03 with the jcw package and an aftermarket lsd and I made 40-50 runs on the 1/4 mile with it and found it easier to get the lower ET by smoking at the launch BTW I was using Kuhmo R compounds for traction so too little revs and bog would occur the best run was in the 14.20's when I hit it just right and modulated the wheelspin to where althought the tires were spinning they were not hazing the surface just enough to keep the rpm & torque up. this combined with the just after dark 55 degree air beat my best prior time of 14.50's by a fair amount. That said the 60 ft time didnt make half of the improvement I saw.
I have an o5 STi now and have had a best 60 ft time of 1.73 on an all stock car except for an axel back exhaust so I feel I have a good feel for how to launch a car
Looking at another Mini (will be #3!) as I am driving 120 miles a day and gas is just at about 20 mpg in the STi It seems at 80 mph on the interstate there is enough boost to drive mpg down by about 4 as I can get around 24 if I drive around 65 mph.

 

Hmmm..... I have a normally aspirated R56, and had a VANOS replaced recently. The tech swapped intake/exhaust solenoids, to isolate which VANOS was at fault.

So, does this mean that us low-powered weenies have both Valvetronic and dual VANOS? Or did I misunderstand the repair paperwork?

 

Where did you read that the Cooper S has VANOS?

Also does it have Dual VANOS or just VANOS.

THX

 

Whalen Shift Machine can help you with the shift **** if you run into trouble.

 

http://www.psa-peugeot-citroen.com/d...1103281940.pdf
Press Release on the Prince engine

 

Yeah it clearly states the n/a motor is VALVTRONIC, but does not say that the turbo 1.6 is either VANONS or not, could be another variable valve timing.

I guess it does not really matter

 

I'm basing this on totally vague memories, but I thought that the packaging requirements of the engine just wouldn't allow for BOTH direct injection and valve-tronic. They both take up a lot of space in the head.

I think the 10.5:1 compression ratio means that you really need direct injection to keep the turbo motor from detonating... so I guess they left valvetronic out.

Kinda neat - the NA motor apparently doesn't have a throttle body.

 

diesel motors do not have a throttle body either.

These motors are very close to diesel motors, just running on gasoline. They are high pressure direct injectors (120bar) which are 10x lower then diesel but still way higher then normal gasoline.

 

The NA motor, according to the PDF, doesn't have direct injection (it says multi port intake manifold injection).

I think the Turbo motor must have a throttle body

Anyhow, these two engines are definitely two of the more interesting motors on the American market right now.

 

High-performance turbocharged engine with direct gasolineinjection.Displacing 1.6 litres, the direct-injection high-performance gasoline enginewith exhaust gas turbocharger and intercooler develops maximum output of105 kW/143 bhp from 1.6 litres engine capacity at 5,500 rpm and maximumtorque of 240 Nm/177 lb-ft from 1,400 rpm maintained consistently all the wayto 4,000 rpm.

 

I guess I'm not sure what your point is - I said that the NA (normally aspirated - aka Cooper engine) wasn't direct injection.