I imagine road feel is very subjective. Personally, I have an extreme dislike for the feel of run flats. I run the same Conti you do on both my Minis and love the feel at 34 psi. Different strokes for different folks.

 

 

There are three Continental models with "ExtremeContact" in the name. One (DW) is a summer only tire with better grip than most any runflat. DWS has a soft sidewall for a great ride but less grip. The DWS 06 is a newer version reported to have a bit better dry grip.

Many a person has gone from runflats to the DWS only to complain of loss of the MINI "gokart" handling.

I went from Continental ContiProContact run flats to the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 and gained a lot of grip in both wet and dry. Not to mention my Hankook R-S3 extreme summer autocross tires.

 

 

Your manual calls for 38psi below 100mph and 41psi above 100mph.
Low pressures aid acceleration and hurt cornering.

 

 

Sorry, I can't recommend runflats for performance. Give the DWs a few days at 38. You might like going faster despite the less stiff sidewalls.

 

 

 

50 miles driven on tire

It can take a couple of hundred miles to wear off the mold release. Find some rough surface pavement and scrub them in.

 

 

20 years of motorsports.

 

 

There's one simple explanation for why you're experiencing what you are. Sidewall stiffness. The runflats have an extreme sidewall on them (part of the reason you can get a puncture and still drive 50+ miles on them), which increases ride harshness because there's no give on bumps. Unfortunately, this also means you get a sense that the tire is handling better because you feel more of the road.

With any non-runflat tire, and especially on the Continental, the sidewalls are much softer and have more give to them, so they ride much better, but you lose some of the initial turn-in crispness. Notice I said initial. The main benefit to having a non-runflat tire, such as the Conti DW, is the handling limit before the tire loses traction in the corner is at a much higher threshold than the run-flat, so when you're canyon carving in the hills of LA, the initial turn-in may seem lazy, but you'll hold the corner better and at a faster speed than before.

This is simply a by-product of the type of tire. The Conti DW is an exceptional tire for the money and I would advise you to keep the tire and let it scrub in. 200 miles on tires is still too new to really determine much of anything. Going back to a run-flat is a stupid decision and a waste of money, unless you just have it sitting aside to burn. The next time you get tires, I'd recommend getting either the Michelin A/S 3 all-season or the Pilot Super Sports, as they are non-runflat, but have a stiffer than normal sidewall, which may give you some of that feel back. That aside, the initial turn in will feel softer with any non-runflat tire simply because that's the way it's supposed to feel. That's where having confidence in the tire and the car come in to get past that initial few degrees you turn the steering wheel.

 

 

Nice write up AG.

I'll check out the Michelin and the Pilot Super Sport. Although I'll probably go runflat again. I don't trust stiffer sidewalls in tubeless tires. Obviously I have to wear in the tires because I'm stuck with them. And no I haven't attributed unlimited capital to the whims of my JCW motoring. hahaha


There's zero performance gain to going to a runflat, but that's your prerogative. Btw, I'm pretty sure all automotive tires are "tubeless".

The firmer sidewalls with runflats make sense. Not sure how you broke down entering a turn that initially feels loose but has a higher threshold for holding the turn.


I never said the tires felt loose upon turn-in. I stated the responsiveness is a degree or two less upon the very first movements of the steering wheel off center as you enter the corner. And the tires have a higher threshold because the compound of the rubber if grippier than a run-flat, all things given.

If it feels weak going into the turn, guess what? I'm backing off. Not pushing the tire.

Getting a sense a tire is handling better is all you got when you drive. We don't get a gauge for this other than road feel through steering.


I read your comment several times. It's just non-runflat double talk to me. Which is unfortunately how I got into this tire. Listening to some old guy in our car club. hahaha


Sometimes a hint of wisdom goes a long way in life. My comments regarding tire differences is based on what I have read by reputable experts and what I've experienced in several different cars with several different tire brands/compounds. You are free to dismiss it as "double talk" but I can guarantee it's far from that.

You say "better ride" but then admit you "lose some of the initial turn-in crispness". Well that just reaffirms what I've been saying. It's a simple equation. Handling trades off with comfort. Stiffer sidewall, better handling. I could care less about road noise, comfort. Buy a Lexus if that's your goal in life.


I'm glad you can care less about all that stuff. The points you quoted were establishing the difference between runflats and non-runflats. You can have just as harsh a ride with racing slicks as you can with runflats if you want to talk extremes. And having a stiffer sidewall is not a guarantee that you'll have better handling, but that's a lecture for a different time.

OK the DW are not crap tires. Just not what I need in a tire. But I'm stuck with them unless someone wants to make me an offer.

 

 

The chassis engineering has been designed to run RF for handling on the JCW. There is nothing to re-invent for the ultimate performance of this car. Follow recommendations as per the manufacturer or you may be in trouble.

They may be stiff but they do their job and there is no space to put a spare. It is a sports car or at least some sort of so security and peace of mine are my priorities when driving.

RF with no questions as far as I am concerned.

 

Sorry to disagree, but I highly doubt the chassis was engineered to be used solely with runflat tires, nor was it done so to make sure ultimate performance was only gained through runflats. Why else would the JCW GP come with grippy Kumho V710 instead of runflats? The car came from the factory with runflats as an option because of the lack of running a spare. There were several times however that you could option the car with summer (i.e. non-runflat) tires.

 

 

 

In England all MINIs are built with non-runflats unless an additional cost option of runflats is specified.

Your JCW has a standard stock suspension unless an optional factory installed sport suspension was ordered or a JCW suspension was installed at the port of entry or by a dealer. All of these suspensions were available on the Gen2 base, S, and JCW models. Runflats and sport/JCW suspensions are not compatible with rough pavement which requires flexible sidewalls to maintain grip. Runflats will skate.

BMW offers non-runflat Michelin Pilot Super Sport as an option on 2 and 3 series models. I believe they are standard on the M3 and M4. All of this is easily verifiable at BMW and MINI company websites.

If you like the slow speed "gokart handling" and/or the convenience of extended mobility offered by runflats go for it. No type of tire is better than another at everything, they are all compromises.

 

You may be right but at least we agree the handling is well adapted to the stiff RF and make the car on rails.