Heh... I found a source I can get them from, but it's pricey! Always open to buying a "used" set in excellent condition.

 

Certainly the vehicle wheel weight contributes a bit, but the IC and injectors are not bottlenecks. I've seen no data on stock versus JCW exhaust. IMO that's not a bottleneck either. And unless anyone has the data, it's their opinion that it is a bottleneck.

 

The reason your '04 was much slower than the GP is that you had gearing as tall as the empire state building. You are comparing apples and oranges. When I swapped out to an '05 tranny, it gave a bigger boost in performance than my earlier upgrade to a full JCW tune kit.

It's clear that the GP is synced well, but it could use a tune and a pulley as well.

 

Works gill? Whazzat? Even if you meant to say Works grill, there was no such thing for the R53. Did you mean the aero grill? If so, it was never made or sold as a JCW accessory for the R53.I never said they were "bottlenecks", but they are factors that potentially (or definitely, I'm not the expert on them) contribute to the overall performance.

My point was that you seemed to be grossly oversimplifying the "performance part" differences between the stock R53 MCS and the GP (or even a regular JCW R53, for that matter).

Everything plays a role, even if it is very small. I can't speak with any certainty to the direct benefits of the IC or exhaust (although I don't think they hurt), but I'd be very surprised if the injectors made absolutely no performance difference.

Oh... and BTW, the wheels are not the only weight difference! Trailing arms, rear seat delete, etc. Can those be done to a regular R53? Of course! But we were talking about stock, the last time I checked.

Again, I was only trying to correct what I saw as oversimplification.

 

Oh, man, you are going to make me have to get out the spray gun again. That is Sherry's main gripe about the GP, the fact that there are so many of them around. We got used to the Daisy car and the Flame car being one off vehicles.

I have been wanting to put Kosei 15" wheels on it.

 

Nice find on the orchid Corvair! Yes, that's what I have in mind, but not metallic.

Edge, no way I can give up those wheels! For one thing, Fuzzy called dibs long ago:

 

DARN!

 

Hmmmm, I love the metallic Chevy color (also the same as Pontiac's Iris Mist - also from 1965), but I don't know that I'd like it non-metallic. Might look too much like poi.

 

I was considering the trailing arm/ seat delete in the vehicle weight (typo: left out "and" between vehicle and wheel). The 380 injectors are not needed to provide the additional power generated by the JCW or the GP. They merely provide an additional safety margin from running lean at high rpm.

Powerplant differences between JCW and GP:
................................JCW..........GP
1) Flash 7 hp
2) IC__ 0 hp...............10 fin......12 fin
.........= 7 hp

Certainly, 99% of difference between the power of the JCW and the GP is in the flash. The difference between the stock (same as JCW) IC and the GP has no impact on the dyno. I know, I've done it.

Powerplant differences between JCW and MCS:
...............................MCS.........GP
1) Flash .....?
2) Pulley.... ? ............... 0%.........13.8%
3) Head .....?.................160 cfm.....170cfm
4) Injectors ?..................340cc.......380cc
5) Exhaust .?
............= 40 hp

As the head on the JCW/GPs has a very mild porting, it does flow marginally better. That that would be over come by upgrading the MCS with a 15% rather than a JCW pulley. The 340 injectors, though operating in the upper end of the range are not restricting the fuel requirement in the lower 200 hp range.

Check out the tunes that LDG is doing with nothing more than a 15% pulley and a flash on MCSs. 190 WHP. Pretty close, if not dead on GP numbers.

Oh yes, do shed those pounds.

You are absolutely right though about the GP being a well balance system. Mixing and matching a bunch of bolt-on parts from different vendors who may or probably don't have a significant R&D budget is not going to yield the same overall driving satisfaction as selecting a series of parts that BMW has engineered as a system. The pulley and the flash fit into the tuning category which the manyfacturer has to compromise on to meet EPA requirements. That's not to say you can't generate more power or torque at various engine speeds, but you are far more likely to end up with driveability issues. Have you noticed all the posts about tuners with OBC issues, blown engine, etc.?

My 2cents, some fact, some opinion. My statement may have been oversimplified, but the thought process was not.

 

well you obviously dont know wut you're talking about, you have dinan MINI parts on your car. lol.

are you the type of person that will let things of historical significance be destroyed by people that dont know any better? im guessing you are.

 

I hate to say it but.... you cant make a stock R53 faster than a GP, for less than it cost for the GP.

 

*grabs popcorn and sits back*

 

Heh.

camelpilot, I am not going to get into the nitty-gritty on this (I'm sure lhoboy will do that), but think you might have made too bold a statement. Take a totally bare-bones 05/06 MCS (i.e. no options, except maybe LSD), rip out the rear seats and any other "extras", and spend a little money on appropriate suspension, brakes & engine mods, and I am quite confident it will outaccelerate, outhandle and outbrake a GP... for less than $31,500 or whatever the final GP price was.

however...

I doubt the end result will have anywhere near the "complete package" smooth refinement that the GP gives you, not to mention the exclusivity/cache.

That's the one thing I love about my JCW... it's smooth as butta... and every modified MCS I've driven hasn't reached that "refined" feel, even though some of them were faster. Is it all in my head? Maybe... but I just love how my JCW drives. The GP is the same... and then some (yes, I've driven one).

NOTE: "Refined" feel is in terms of R53s. R56s need not apply, they are a totally different feel altogether (for better or worse, depending on your preferences).

 

OK, here's the offer: At my own expense I will have your R53 ('05 or '06) tweaked for less than the difference in cost between the R53 and the GP. If I fail, you have a much faster car. If I succeed, your car is mine. How do you want to measure: drag strip, dyno or road track? Butt dyno doesn't count.

That will determine where and how I spend my money.

 

dont make me add up the parts in your sig, then drive up there for second part of the evidence

 

I'll bet you can you would have about 6 or 7 grand to play with, thinking about I'm sure you could.

 

hey thats a mighty fine offer....

But my 2004 MCS that I paid $25k for, already has the following mods: sprot, prem, cold packages. other mods: wms pulley, alta intake, wms head & cam, jcw exhaust, jdm uss, jdm under floor wings, ipod :P. STOCK suspension. Cost of mods, i aint telling. But over 5k if I add up with the labour.

Now I'm not sure who you will get to tweak the car, but stay realistic about it, and count labour at $100 per hour for all your tweaking.

Also include the additional tweaking involved for the tooner crap that dont work or run right. lol.

 

yeah ... thats what I thought before I started....

 

You don't think so? Just quickly thinking about it seems easy if you spend the money well.

 

Sure you can... Buy a used one for 15K and modify it.

I went to Puerto Rico on vacation and saw a heavily modified 04 R53 spank the caca out of a GP on straights, turns, uphill, downhill, pretty much all over the track, and NOT a full race car by the way. At the end of the day, the GP owner trailered his car and the R53 owner bolted his plates back in place and drove home . Is just a matter of finding the right combination and do a lot of tuning. With just the regular bolt ons is pretty much impossible, but once you go inside the motor, that's a different story.

 

I beleive it! But ask the R53 owner how much and what it took to get to where he is....

Even buying used at 15 is pushing it (good idea btw)

 

MY car surely wouldn't beat a GP. It's basically just an all JCW MCS with a different exhaust and springs, and it's not running at peak form right now anyway.

I wasn't disagreeing or agreeing with your statement. I just thought it would be sure to generate.... er, discussion.

 

discussion, sure! i know your kind! trouble maker! besides, takes one to know one

only diff is sometiems when im bored i like to make my own popcorn

 

play nice kids...
Anyway - CamelPilot doesn't drive his GP - its just a garage queen

haha

 

oh noes, it's le shark! another trouble maker...

you mind your own busyness. dont u have some hot brawd you have to buy dinner for tonight? give her a ride on your little red crotch rocket.