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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 11:06 AM
  #701  
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Originally Posted by benjam83
I was thinking about who might be a good substitute. I don't think MS will get put in the car. Everyone says it won't happen. I think there's some sort of rift between him and Montezemolo.

Bourdais is looking for a ride, but I don't know if Ferrari would be willing to put up with his crap. Piquet is probably going to be without a seat pretty soon, but I just don't think he's good enough.

Alonso might be able to drive for them in Valencia, lol! For those who haven't seen, Renault is suspended for the next race for sending Alonso's car out in an unsafe condition. http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headline...26194313.shtml They're apealing the decision. I don't know why they would penalize the whole team. Why not just keep Renault from scoring points? No sense in penalizing the drivers too.

I was thinking Valentino Rossi would be a stand-in. But he's only 25 points ahead of Lorenzo.

Bruno Senna is waiting in the wings. That'd probably make the Brazilian folks happy. But Ferrari aren't usually ones to throw someone in the car that doesn't have F1 racing experience. And if he was the stand-in and did a crappy job, that'd probably be the end of his F1 career.

Georigio Pantano is out there. He was the GP2 champion last year. An Italian in an Italian team? Is he just too over-ripe?

Ferrari could probably get just about anyone they wanted and not have to pay them much, because they'd be getting such an opportunity as a driver.
Sebas will not see a red cockpit. Success in American open-wheel does not necessarily translate to success in F1, and Ferrari knows that. Piquet is a backmarker. Ferrari won't be interested. Senna or Pantano are more likely.

Massa is almost certainly out for the season, if not his career. If the Renault ban stands, I can see Alonso with an out on his contract (due to lack of team performance) -- or breaking it -- to drive for Ferrari starting at Valencia. It has already been rumored there will be a Monza announcement about his switch to Ferrari.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 11:20 AM
  #702  
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They have time to think about it since there's a month before the next race.

Read somewhere that Schumacher doesn't have a Superlicence anymore but that's probably a simple fix. I think the main thing that would stop Schu from sitting in is he'd not want to look foolish. After all, if the big multi world champion comes back to great expectations and doesn't do well it won't matter whether it's because of the car or his abilities, he'll still leave again under a "has been" cloud. I figure he'd do better than that, but I bet the scenario is on his mind if he's even considering it.

If Renault lose their appeal and have to sit out the Valencia race, both the FIA and Bernie would love to see Fred in a red car if only to get the Valencia organizers off their respective backs for banning Renault and thus affecting ticket sales (remember the Spaniard racing in Spain connection). Yes, he probably has an out clause in his contract based on car performance, but he might also have a clause that says they have to give him a race seat for EVERY race, which might allow him to go just for Valencia if not the rest of the season. Even if Massa is out beyond Valencia (likely), it would give them a chance to "test" Fred and then put someone else in the seat from Valencia on.

I'd say they'd just go with Gene, but they have a habit of overlooking their test/reserve drivers, plus Ferrari are known for doing the unexpected, even when it seems like it's just for the media attention. Whatever they do though they'll not likely trade good performance expectations for spectacle alone.

Fun to speculate when my own money isn't on the line.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 06:59 PM
  #703  
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Originally Posted by benjam83
I was thinking about who might be a good substitute. I don't think MS will get put in the car. Everyone says it won't happen. I think there's some sort of rift between him and Montezemolo.

Bourdais is looking for a ride, but I don't know if Ferrari would be willing to put up with his crap. Piquet is probably going to be without a seat pretty soon, but I just don't think he's good enough.

Alonso might be able to drive for them in Valencia, lol! For those who haven't seen, Renault is suspended for the next race for sending Alonso's car out in an unsafe condition. http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headline...26194313.shtml They're apealing the decision. I don't know why they would penalize the whole team. Why not just keep Renault from scoring points? No sense in penalizing the drivers too.

I was thinking Valentino Rossi would be a stand-in. But he's only 25 points ahead of Lorenzo.

Bruno Senna is waiting in the wings. That'd probably make the Brazilian folks happy. But Ferrari aren't usually ones to throw someone in the car that doesn't have F1 racing experience. And if he was the stand-in and did a crappy job, that'd probably be the end of his F1 career.

Georigio Pantano is out there. He was the GP2 champion last year. An Italian in an Italian team? Is he just too over-ripe?

Ferrari could probably get just about anyone they wanted and not have to pay them much, because they'd be getting such an opportunity as a driver.
You're almost talking yourself into Schumacher! Yes, there's a rift (at least I've heard it, too), but he knows the car, he knows the tracks, and he knows something about driving...

Who else?
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 07:42 PM
  #704  
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Great news (except for the part about his eye):

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/270720...ator-coma.html
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 08:14 PM
  #705  
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I would love to see Schuey back in the Ferrari racing in Valencia, but it won't happen.

I think it will be one of the test drivers, probably Gene. I mean that is one major reason why the test drivers take the job in the first place. I think Gene has filled in before for Ferrari, hasn't he?
 
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Old Jul 28, 2009 | 10:45 AM
  #706  
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I think he might have filled in for an injurred Rubens or Irvine. I'm not sure though. And it only would have been for a race or two.

If he could fit in the car, alex Wurz would be a good stand-in. He seems like a super nice guy with a great attitude. He's always just seemed to have an average or worse car. He was great fun to watch race when he was younger. But I think he kind of lost the fire after being a test driver at Mclaren for so long. His podium in Canada a few years ago with a rear wing end-plate missing was awesome!

There are also test/reserve drivers, that have F1 experience on other teams to think about.

Christian Klien. He was quick on occasions. He was having a good race in Monaco in Red Bull before his car let him down. Coulthard was nice enough to collect his third place for him though, lol. That was when they were sponsored by the Superman movie and DC wore a cape on the podium.

Pedro De La Rosa for Mclaren always seemed to pretty consistently bring home points when he had to stand in for someone.

I think I already mentioned Liuzzi.

The great thing about going with some of these reserve guys or young guys, is that you could pay them peanuts to drive. They just want to get into a race seat and show the world what they can do.
 
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Old Jul 28, 2009 | 06:21 PM
  #707  
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Looking better:

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/280720...l-10-days.html
 
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Old Jul 28, 2009 | 06:46 PM
  #708  
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There's so much speculation about who it will be that it seems like someone should start a pool. Actually, I'm sure people are already betting on it somewhere.
 

Last edited by kurvhugr; Jul 28, 2009 at 07:05 PM.
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 05:33 AM
  #709  
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BMW is quitting F1, at the end of 2009.

Bernie took F1 out of North America, BMW and Honda's largest markets. I wonder much of that is too blame for their decisions to quit.
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 09:58 AM
  #710  
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I bet those are factors, but I wonder if they'd be dropping out if they were doing as well as everyone expected before the season started. Of course the FIA weenies pounced immediately on the opportunity to put out a neener neener statement claiming it's because they opposed the cost cutting measures.....
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 10:54 AM
  #711  
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Looks like Schumacher is jumping in:

Schumacher to make F1 return in Spain
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 12:26 PM
  #712  
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That is crazy...

...and awesome

Alright!!!

First Lance comes back and now Schuey!

My sporting heros are back!

Is BMW going back to Sauber?

I guess Kubica is available now. Hint...Ferrari?
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 12:31 PM
  #713  
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I think Schumi returning is pretty lame and hope he fails miserably. But then it all falls right in line with F1 being a big joke anymore. What a circus it has become, all of it.

Here's to BMW's success in sports- and touring-car racing. I can't wait to see the RLR M3 GTRs again at Petit Le Mans.
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 02:22 PM
  #714  
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The Silly Season, wooo hoooooo!

I think Kubica, who I believe is managed by Flavio, could replace Alonso at Renault. I think he might also replace Nico at Williams. That's the thing that sucks when you pull out of the series, you kind of hang your drivers out to dry.

I think Nick could end up at one of the other new teams. That is the good thing about 3 new teams in line to race next year. Plenty of places for familiar faces to go, as well as new faces to come into the sport.

I'm curious to see how MS does. I never liked him when he was in the sport. I knew he was a great driver and conceded that, but he wasn't sporting at all and always had a smug douche-bagginess about him. I think it will be exciting, because he's not at the front of the field but he'll be trying desperately to get there.
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 04:08 PM
  #715  
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Sorry you guys aren't happy--I'm personally thrilled. And think of it--3 world champs on the track at the same time (2 next race). What could be better?

I hope this doesn't mean that Alonso will go to Ferrari, but with Kimi going out, sooner or later, and Massa a big if, sooner or later, it doesn't look good. They're going to have to figure out a real good, but definitely subservient replacement. And that's what I hate about it.

I'd much rather see Kubica instead. Even Heidfeld. He might surprise everyone with a better ride.

As for Michael being a douche-bag, I dunno. Granted there were some bad incidents, but no worse than Alonso holding his own teammate back in the pits. Team orders had to have been at the heart of some of these maneuvers. And you can be a little smug if you're the best.

BTW, bet you didn't know that he's probably the most generous of all of them, with a long history of donations and work for a variety of organizations. At the time of the tsunami, for example, he immediately donated $10,000,000--more than many countries. There's more at the end of this article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher
 

Last edited by daffodildeb; Jul 29, 2009 at 04:18 PM.
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 04:54 PM
  #716  
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Originally Posted by daffodildeb

As for Michael being a douche-bag, I dunno. Granted there were some bad incidents, but no worse than Alonso holding his own teammate back in the pits. Team orders had to have been at the heart of some of these maneuvers. And you can be a little smug if you're the best.
You mean like when Schumi tried to deliberately crash Villeneuve out of a race, and got DSQ'd for an entire season for it, or parking his car during Monaco qualifying to block Alonso's flying lap?

Come on, we all know Schumi is known for being very aggressive and not always being a good sportsman about it. Ferrari was his perfect team. Win whatever the cost.
 
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Old Jul 29, 2009 | 06:14 PM
  #717  
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Originally Posted by RaceTripper
You mean like when Schumi tried to deliberately crash Villeneuve out of a race, and got DSQ'd for an entire season for it, or parking his car during Monaco qualifying to block Alonso's flying lap?

Come on, we all know Schumi is known for being very aggressive and not always being a good sportsman about it. Ferrari was his perfect team. Win whatever the cost.
I never said that he was a racing saint. You can't tell me that Monaco bit wasn't team orders, though. It was just poorly executed.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 03:24 AM
  #718  
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I don't think Schuey always behaved well either. His way of slashing across at the starts was annoying too. I admire the totality of his career. There are so many great moments etched in my mind that demonstrated his greatness. The ironic thing is that he did not need to do some of the crap he tried to get away with. Some things esp. early in his career with stupid penalties assess against him, he had to try extra hard to overcome. Even if you don't like him, this is going to be interesting.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 03:49 AM
  #719  
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Given the fact that Ferrari was beginning to compete with current top teams Red Bull and Brawn, Schumi's return might be an interesting thing to watch. Let's see if he has still some tricks to teach to Kimi, Jenson and co
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 10:02 AM
  #720  
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Originally Posted by daffodildeb
Sorry you guys aren't happy--I'm personally thrilled. And think of it--3 world champs on the track at the same time (2 next race). What could be better?
What could be better? 4 World Champions! Oh....wait. We will have four.

Originally Posted by daffodildeb
I hope this doesn't mean that Alonso will go to Ferrari, but with Kimi going out, sooner or later, and Massa a big if, sooner or later, it doesn't look good. They're going to have to figure out a real good, but definitely subservient replacement. And that's what I hate about it.
I don't think it will change anything for who is in the car next year. Ferrari are pretty practical when it comes to substitutions for injuries. They aren't going to take a risk on someone inexperienced possibly not bringing the car home in one piece. And they want somone to bring it home in the points. MS is known for doing this, even in 98? and 2005 when the red team was uncompetitive.

They're the same way when it comes to contracts for drivers coming into the team. Schumi, Kimi, Massa and (if reports are accurate) Alonso all signed deals as much as a season in advance before even joining the team.

Originally Posted by daffodildeb
As for Michael being a douche-bag, I dunno. Granted there were some bad incidents, but no worse than Alonso holding his own teammate back in the pits. Team orders had to have been at the heart of some of these maneuvers. And you can be a little smug if you're the best.
Alonso holding Ham-bone in the pits wasn't dangerous. The time MS wrecked Damon Hill to win the championship. The nearly identical stunt to steal the championship from JV. The numerous times he tangled with DC. He even ran his own brother off the road in spectacular fashion. The crap he's pulled doesn't even compare. Plus, it's easy to be the "best" when you've got the FIA in your corner.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 11:06 AM
  #721  
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Originally Posted by RaceTripper
BMW is quitting F1, at the end of 2009.

Bernie took F1 out of North America, BMW and Honda's largest markets. I wonder much of that is too blame for their decisions to quit.
Well now, looks like Ferrari will have some choices to make at the end of the season! Either Bob or Nick would make a good replacement for Phil if he can't come back in full form.

Originally Posted by kurvhugr
Looks like Schumacher is jumping in:

Schumacher to make F1 return in Spain
Train wreck.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 11:31 AM
  #722  
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Originally Posted by Gromit801
Train wreck.
That is an apt description for Formula 1 these days.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 12:27 PM
  #723  
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Originally Posted by benjam83
Alonso holding Ham-bone in the pits wasn't dangerous. The time MS wrecked Damon Hill to win the championship. The nearly identical stunt to steal the championship from JV.
You do realize, of course, that you are referring to events from the mid to late '90's, don't you?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher

And again, who is to know what role team orders played, since they don't exist. A mean, sinister, and unethical streak? "Normal" competitiveness? Team orders? All of the above? None of the above? Brain damage? Who knows.

At most there are 1/2 dozen races where there were questionable tactics, created by whatever force(s), out of 249 starts. That makes him the most horrid racer on the planet?

Originally Posted by Gromit801

Train wreck.
Could be. Could also be a rebirth of sorts, with a reshuffling of teams, drivers, and machinery. I'd love to have a crystal ball to see what will happen when Bernie leaves. He will, eventually, after all. Will he take F1 with him? Doubt it, although it WILL probably change.

F1 started in 1950. Bernie got it in the '70's. He'll probably be gone by 2010, or the teams will form their own series. Then we'll really have a chance to see.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 05:29 PM
  #724  
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Originally Posted by daffodildeb
You do realize, of course, that you are referring to events from the mid to late '90's, don't you?
Just illustrating a pattern of vehicular assault when the best thing you can come up with against Alonso is he blocked Ham in the pits after he didn't adhere to team orders. No biggie.

It'll be exciting though. I would think though that he'll try to be humble, kind of like Lance Armstrong (humble for Lance anyway) was this year at the Tour. Furthermore, I think he'll end up playing a supporting role to Kimi. That would be the smart thing to do from a team standpoint. But who knows. Since this season is wasted, they may well just go and try to get whatever they can and turn both guys loose. That'll be good fun to watch.
 
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Old Jul 30, 2009 | 05:38 PM
  #725  
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Originally Posted by benjam83
...I think he'll end up playing a supporting role to Kimi. That would be the smart thing to do from a team standpoint....
I doubt that...supporting Kimi for what? His boredom with F1 until he finishes out his contract and goes to WRC? Schumi will go for wins if he can. Ferrari is likely to give Schumi the better equipment and support.
 
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