No offense, but it's clear you have little understanding how business works for relatively small MINI vendors. I talk to them all the time, I do, and I have great empathy for the stuff they have to put up with regard to unrealistic expectations from customers. You're applying macroeconomics to microeconomics, and the two are apples and oranges. I'm am DEFINITELY done with this now, as this seems to be getting personal.

The end result is: Way will be fine. He's had more POSITIVE comments in this thread than negative. He came out ahead in most of our eyes.

Have a nice day!

 

[joking]

LOL, I never realized that MINI vendors have their own very specific way of doing business! I must look into this and it might actually make a great dissertation if I decide to pursue my PhD in management.

I'm also glad that a winner could be determined by the amount of positive posts in a thread! Yet another interesting way to determine the success of a business model.

[/joking]

To be fair, I actually tried to cut this off with you earlier, however, you continued. Seeing as how I have actually both studied business and managed in business (both large and small), I think I have a fairly decent grasp on how it all works.

Oh, and please look up the definition of micro and macro economics. At no point did we discuss any governmental entities etc; simply a business decision which would fall in microeconomics. Yes, they are very different, but I am not sure how I was "applying" them together.

You are the one that keeps taking what I say to the very extreme. I'm sorry you feel this is personnel. I'm not taking anything you say personal, we simply have different views. Have a great day and I'm glad that you believe in Way that much. It is good to see he has supporters. Ciao!

 

Can we put this to bed. Everyone has the choice to buy from this vendor or not. The vendor has the choice how he wants to run his business and if the vendor makes wrong business choices then the vendor may go out of business!!

 

Is it bothering you that we are/were discussing it? I mean, that is what a forum is for right?

 

You are right that is what a forum is for, I am just saying everyone has stated their points and know let's move on

 

I agree. I was just coming back to remove the post because I thought it was a little crass. Thanks for keeping it light!

Have a great weekend!

 

I have delt with Way for a bit now. I like them. If you are going to buy a part and are not sure of thr fitment, then you did not due your due diligence.
IMO this upgrade was not thought out well if appearance is your concern

 

+1

 

I would just like to say that Way has always been decent to me and everyone that I know personally. He is a small businessman and shop owner. He can not make all the people happy all the time.

But I recently placed an order and received it in a very timely manner and am very happy with the product and price.

 

Does anyone have any fitting instructions for these?

Mine have just arrived in the UK, and I want to get them on the car?

Loctite is needed I have heard? How about torquing them down?

 

Turner Motorsports has a pdf on lug installation, including torque specs, which I forgot. They recommend red Loctite. Lugs have been known to fail, I'd definitely follow Turner's instructions.

When you install them, go slow, the heads strip easy (I have the APR studs, which IMHO are the best for the track, they aren't for looks though; mine are 75mm and stick out much further than the OP's). You want to periodically check them, especially if you track your car, as they can come loose, even with Loctite. I haven't had that happen, but I've seen it happen, and it's not pretty. Also, make sure if you buy the nuts and lugs separately (if you bought both together, and most people do, it's not a worry), that the thread pitch matches--if it doesn't, that's an even bigger disaster. One of my favorite youtube videos is of an RX-7 with all four wheels coming off at an autox because of mismatched lugs/nuts).....

 

Torq down to 15 LBS with Red Locktite, and then torq your wheels to factory spec. For me and my R56 it is 103 Lbs.

 

Checked Turner, it's 16 lbs, so 15-16 is fine for either the R53 or R56. Torque specs for the nuts are 88 for the R53, 103 for the R56.

 

Remember....
You can use two nuts...back to back.(on the stud)....locking each other on in a locknut arrangement, so you can use a wrench to put the studs on/off.....the just remove the two nuts when done. Makes installs and removal much simpler.

 

Attempted to install the studs today - got the 1st set of 5 installed on the hub and the wheel mounted (they looked great too)

Then on the 2nd hub, and the torx bit I was using to drive the studs into the hub decided to shear inside one of the 'bullet noses' of the stud :(

So off came all the studs, and I've had to put the wheel bolts back on :(

I now need to attempt to drill the sheared bit out, or order a new single stud from America.

Pissed off is an understatement! :(

 

You can order a single stud through Turner, they're cheap. Just get the same length, I'd also by the nut from them too to ensure the pitch is correct, unless you're absolutely sure on the pitch. Whenever I order lugs/bolts, I always order a couple extra, in case there's ever an issue installing, or if one ever needs replacement. Probably not an issue if you don't change tires much, but I change them a zillion times for the track, and eventually the threads can get beaten up, so I always have extras.

Zippy's way works well, and if you're having problems using the torx bit, use the two bolt method to roughly the right torque, then use your torque wrench with the torx bit to finish it off to ensure proper torque. It's much less likely to strip the head or shear doing it that way. Most studs are pretty soft on the head, and are easy to strip--it's not a very large torx size to begin with. I've done it all the way through with the torx bit, but it's probably easier and safer to start with the two locked bolts and finish with the Torx, that's how I do it now.

Although you can install with a torque bit, the ONLY way you can remove a stud is with the two bolt method, unless you're incredibly lucky.

 

My nuts are from H&R and are M12x1.5 - they threaded fine onto the studs?

 

That's the same thread pitch as the APR studs, so if you buy a replacement stud from Turner, nuts will fit just fine (that just sounds so wrong... ). So if you can't get a single H&R stud, you can order from Turner and they'll fit perfectly.

 

Yup...the Allen head is soft...that's why I suggested using jamnuts....been there...done that.

 

I theory I can still use all the studs I have, using the two nut method to install them

The stud itself is not damaged - it just has the torn bit buried inside its nose! Thing is though, knowing its there will really bug me.

I'm hoping it can be drilled out.

 

When you remove them....you will find you will need to use the two but method, usually with a bit of heat of soften the locktight....the center of the stud is just way to soft to take the tourqe needed to uninstall....even the install is iffy if the threads are not perfectly clean....
Best thing about using two nuts/jsm nuts, you can use a socket for the install, and it goes VERY FAST....faster than an Allen wrench...then it lets you check they are tight with a tq wrench....
To be honest...not sure WHY studs Have an Allen head machined into them...just does not work well.

 

Agreed on the Allen heads, they strip way too easy. I did use the Allen heads last time I installed these to do the final torque check, I wasn't 100% convinced that using the lock nuts was going to get the torque right, but that's just my OCD.

 

Red locktite needs heat to release it. If you track your car, remember those brakes & hubs get hella hot FWIW. Check those studs periodically.

I can understand using studs on a race car that gets frequent & fast tire changes. For a street car I don't understand it, maybe it's one more bling thing for the beloved MINI.

Someone has said there are problems with lug bolts. Lug bolts are just fine. Been using them for 178,000 miles split between 2 MINIs. Never had a problem with them. I torque them to the value called for & they do their job.

As far as easier changing goes, buy some wheel hangers they really do help.

 

It's nice if you're constantly swapping wheels or adjusting suspension and whatnot. It's also helpful if you use spacers.

 

At the track, I run 9 inch wide tires up front, 8 in the rear. 1.5 cm spacers up front, 8mm in rear. Need 75mm studs for those...

There is nothing wrong with bolts though, other than without hangers, it's PITA to quickly change wheels, especially at night.