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The Foot Well Module: functions, problems, solutions?

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The Foot Well Module: functions, problems, solutions?

  #26  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:13 PM
prowlerman99
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Thanks guys, what a great thread.
I had a tail light go out on my wifes 07, r56 recently and I found there was no voltage to the socket. The local shop gave me a price of $632. to replace the module and $432. to code and program. This thread gave me hope. Going to check all the connectors tonight!!
 
  #27  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:27 PM
miniuy
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prowlerman99, surely the FRM shutdown the tail lights output for any reason (short-circuit in example).

Please, check the following:

1 - There is no power to the tail lights
2 - There is all fuses related OK (I believe there is not fuses for the tail lights)
3 - There is not a short-circuit still present

If all 3 check are OK, I believe it is not necessary to replace the FRM module.
You need to code the FRM to enable the tail lights again. It can involve some complex jobs (reset counter, reset status, etc).

Good luck!
 
  #28  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:36 PM
prowlerman99
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Correct! No power to the one tail light, the other, (same side) works fine. I could not find any shorts. Checked the sockets with DMD, no fuses like you said.
So you think I should have them code the FRM first?


Thanks
Brian
 
  #29  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:41 PM
miniuy
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OK, then to restore the tail light you need to code it to start working again with Tool32 (you need to search for the procedure, since with Tool32 you should identify manually the bulb).

You can do this in the easy way (wizard) if you work with Rheingold software.
It will check all and will reset the status for your bad tail light power output line on the FRM.
 
  #30  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:43 PM
prowlerman99
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Thanks yet again!!! I will contact the shop where the car is presently waiting for me to pick it up to see if they can do this. It's a local shop that specializes in BMW/Mini. I personally don't have the tools to do this.
 
  #31  
Old 07-25-2014, 12:52 PM
prowlerman99
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A little more history. This is a base R56. The engine light came on and the car lost power. In fact it could not get out of its own way. The closest mini dealer is over 1 1/2 hours away so I decided to take it to a local shop that I have seen does a lot of mini work. They checked it out and told me it needed a Vanos solenoid, $1,300. Week later the called and said that did not correct it and that mini told them to replace the timing chain. While it was in the shop I asked them to check the tail light as I did not get any voltage to the sockets. $2,600 later for the timing chain and Vanos. Now over $1,000. to repair the tail light. Not sure a base 07 mini with 78K miles is worth much more;-))
 
  #32  
Old 12-09-2014, 10:13 AM
min4857
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Originally Posted by miniuy View Post
Chernobyl, this is the real situation:

No connection nor communication through: Rheingold, NCS, WinKFP, Tool32. (Unit not responding). Checked some minutes ago.

It is officially in the "brick mode".

It will be taken for a tech to test it, while waiting for a compatible used FRM that is on the way.
The situation could be worse, I could not have low beams nor brake lights. The car works and I'll use it just if really needed.

I believe I can tolerate a week of people insults for not using my blinkers

Thank you again for your time and help. I will update this thread with the final resolution for my incident.
Hello Miniuy,

I'm interested in your threads cause I have same situation here. Just disconnect the battery the lighting system is not working. Just turned on all the time once I engine turn on.
I wonder what was your final resolution and how much did you roughly cost?
Thank you~!!
 
  #33  
Old 12-15-2014, 01:50 PM
danimaltw
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Hi folks


Looks like I am having a similar problem. My 2009 Mini Clubman was dead when I went to drive it Saturday morning. Not totally dead (lights still work, doors unlock, etc. but not enough juice to turn the engine over.) Anyway, I put my charger on it for the day and was able to start it without any problem on Sunday. However, I got a trouble light (car on a lift) and the electrical system is all wonky. Things that I have identified...
Windows don't work, Turn signals don't work (nor hazards), and the little light inside the hazards light switch (button on the top of the dash) is always illuminated despite the actual hazards not working. (I figure this could account for the battery being drained, but am not sure.)
So after reading this post, I have a few questions...
1. Other than no turn signals, etc. does the FRM impact the operation of the car itself. If I drive it to the store before I get it fixed, should I be concerned about being stranded?
2. The battery is the original so it is going on 6 years. Is it possible that a bad battery is causing this issue?
I am planning to look at the connections tonight to see if anything jumps out at me...
Thanks
Dan
 
  #34  
Old 12-15-2014, 03:09 PM
danimaltw
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Hey guys,


I have a 2009 Mini Clubman with 80k miles and after finding this thread, I think I have a problem with my FRM. Saturday morning I came out to a (nearly) dead battery. The lights still worked, doors unlocked, etc. and the car turned over a few times before going dead. I put a charger on for the day and was able to start my car without problem on Sunday morning. However, after doing so, I got a trouble light (mini on a lift) and the electrical system was acting wonky. So far I have identified the following...
-No turn signals
-No control over headlights...low beams on while driving but cannot turn off
-No hazards
-Windows wont work
-In addition, the lamp in the hazards switch (button on top of dash) remains lit FULL time despite the hazards themselves not working. (I figure this could account for the dead battery.)


Couple questions...
1. Does the FRM impact the operation or the car's ability to drive (other than the obvious no turn signals etc)? If I use it run to the store before I get it fixed, do I need to worry about being stranded.
2. The car has the original battery so its going on 6 years. Could this be responsible for the problems?
3. Anything else I can do other than check the fuses the feed the FRM or take a look at the connections?


Thanks
Dan
 
  #35  
Old 01-02-2015, 12:04 PM
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MiniToBe
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let me share

Great information. Thank you all. Please allow me to share my findings with you. I have four mini coopers. 2 of them are 2008 clubman s manual, one 2010 HT automatic with turbo, and a 2011 clubman s manual.
two of which are flooded, one total wreck with good engine and tranny, the other needs an engine. So to focus on the BCM, I was able to use the one of the 2010 on the 2011 and the flooded 2008. The only issue was when I started either one, the xeon lights would flicker like a police car. I figured maybe becuase the 2010 does not have the hid option like the other two.
the BCMs are slightly different but you should note that if you want to replace it, make sure the HW and the SW numbers are the same and if the Part number is the same, then that is much better.
also, note the pins and the fuses if they are similar to yours.
I will update you when I replace the 2011 BCM and see if this theory holds. At least I will same $500 for parts let alone programming from the dealer.

Thanks
 
  #36  
Old 03-10-2015, 11:33 AM
rsplodge
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Fixed my FRM then it died again BADLY!

blank
 

Last edited by rsplodge; 03-12-2015 at 05:09 AM. Reason: will restore later
  #37  
Old 03-10-2015, 01:24 PM
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komet155
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That sounds scary! I'd be curious to know where the water was entering the car....it could be far from there and merely traveling along other surfaces, drop by drop.
 
  #38  
Old 03-10-2015, 02:06 PM
rsplodge
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Originally Posted by komet155 View Post
That sounds scary! I'd be curious to know where the water was entering the car....it could be far from there and merely traveling along other surfaces, drop by drop.

I found this: https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ml#post4054919


It says that water can come in from the sunroof and some sort of disconnected (?) drain. I'm trying to get more details.


..Roger
 
  #39  
Old 03-10-2015, 04:31 PM
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I'm glad I don't have a sunroof. I had one in my last car (VW GTi), the drains would get clogged and the water would soak my passenger side footwell.
Originally Posted by rsplodge View Post
I found this: https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ml#post4054919


It says that water can come in from the sunroof and some sort of disconnected (?) drain. I'm trying to get more details.


..Roger
 
  #40  
Old 03-14-2015, 10:12 AM
daveysew
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I can add to the gremlin list as my FRM was just replaced under warranty after being listed as the cause of the warning light indicating the parking brake was applied when driving away when it was released. Issue was corrosion deemed to be from drain tubes from the sunroof. According to my SA the tubes are not secured from the factory leading to kinks & separation. During the replacement of the FRM they also straightened & secured the drain tubes.
 
  #41  
Old 03-25-2015, 06:46 PM
miniuy
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FRM Footwell [My final resolution]

As Chernobyl anticipated, the module was burnt and running on brick mode runing with "engine" low beam, break lights and nothing more (I refused to accept it until I had to convince my self). Sorry for the delay in the response.

Resolution: replace the FRM module !

Steps:

1) Buy an used FRM module compatible with your car (today I have an used but newer FRM compatible module running).
2) Disconnect your baterry then, your FRM module.
3) Connect the new (used) FRM module and reconnect the car battery
4) Set your VIN number to the new (used) FRM module (Tool32)
5) Configure the FRM module with the EXACT VO configured on your currents CAS module via NCS Expert. I repeat: the EXACT VO on your current CAS module. A perfect way sould be by deleting all VO on the new (used) FRM module and to add in order all the VO configured on the CAS module.
6) Check your electrical car instalation is the same when the old FRM was working OK (remove any new xenon, lights, etc).
7) Check there is not short-circuit in the electrical car system
8) Start your car en enjoy the Mini World

LESSON LEARNED:

If you want to add xenon to your headlight, please, do not use wiring to your batery, relays, etc. You need to add the VO related to xenon support to both modules (CAS and it backup, FRM) and voilá! Your xenons will work perfectly (like my actual xenons). I don't remember if you need to remove the halogen support. I believe it is not necesary, it is by default.
Please, don't use halogen housing to run xenons. I was waiting 2 month for my Depo Mini housing with lens projectors and it are great.

Again, sorry for the delay on the response and special thanks to Chernobyl.
This is the only forum with people responding answers and it is very important for me.
 
  #42  
Old 03-26-2015, 11:43 AM
Zephyr1
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miniuy,
that is great info, thanks! That means that even though the FRM needs to be coded to the VIN of your car, you can actually do that via NCS, that is really good to know!
Out of curiosity: how much was the used FRM, and how were you able to get one with the confidence that it was fully functional?
Thanks!
 
  #43  
Old 03-26-2015, 05:41 PM
miniuy
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Originally Posted by Zephyr1 View Post
miniuy,
that is great info, thanks! That means that even though the FRM needs to be coded to the VIN of your car, you can actually do that via NCS, that is really good to know!
Out of curiosity: how much was the used FRM, and how were you able to get one with the confidence that it was fully functional?
Thanks!
Zephyr1,

I believe the FRM can work without problems with it original VIN but if you need to take your car to the official service (any reason), they can see that the FRM has a strange VIN. I prefer to keep all hardware with my car VIN registered (overwrited). VIN change was done with Tool32. VOs change (Vehicle Orders) was made with NCS. I could to find a compatible (and in a great condition) FRM module for under $ 250.
In this case you need a bit of luck vs. the truth.
In my case it was a 100% success until today.
 
  #44  
Old 04-04-2015, 02:30 PM
mdella
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Replacing an FRM on a 2012 Clubman JCW... painful

Ok, so interestingly enough, I have had a similar issue. In my case, the battery was drained while watching movies at a drivein (I forgot to start the car at intermission and between movies). Had to get a jump to get started. Immediately after the jump, I got the vehicle on the lift picture in the console display.

Symptoms were as above for many people:
- windows no longer worked
- turn signals inop
- headlights, running lights locked into "on"
- brakelights inop (except for blake light bar on top)
- hazard lights inop
- interior lights inop, overhead switches inop, etc

I ran for a week in this mode and discovered another problem... While the mini is in this mode, the battery is draining while the car is off faster than normal leading to sulfation of the battery which basically can destroy your battery if you don't keep it on a trickle charge while in this mode. Newer batteries won't see this immediately, but older batteries (like mine) will basically crystallize if you don't do something about it early. (dealer wants around $500 to replace the battery with the OEM BMW battery, reprogramming, etc)

Battery aside, looking over the shoulder of the tech and looking at the FRM module that they replaced (in my case $850 later plus the $190 "diagnosis" to tell me that they needed to replace the FRM), the VO is actually used to tell the FRM which "inputs" are connected to which "outputs".

If you are an electronic engineer or programmer, think of the issue like a car based FPGA (field programmable gate array). The FRM takes a series of inputs (switches, sensors, etc) and a series of outputs (lights, window motors, etc) and the VO identifies which inputs operate which outputs (ever wonder how mini has so many different combinations of controls, devices, etc? This is their switchboard connecting things together). This is why you need to program the FPM from default. Its also why when the FPM takes a dump, the outputs go into "failure" mode, either default on or default off. So anything that uses an FRM output is basically "dead" at that point.

I got my "broken" FRM back from them and basically powered it up on a bench and connected to the CAN and got it to reboot. Looks like mine just went into a default failure state and only needed to be reset. Sigh, very expensive learning lesson. Dealers don't want to spend time debugging things so its a "replace/reprogram" rather than dig into the problem. Since most people are under warranty, no one complains. But when you're at 80k and your warranty is gone, it gets very expensive very fast.

---

On one hand, playing with the FRM on the bench has been interesting. I don't know the codes yet to actually activate it or "order it" to do things (I did figure out the controls for the windows, experimenting with making one go up while the other goes down) but I only got that because someone else came up with the control sequence. None of the CAN ID's are published even though you can see them on a monitor as they are used. Reverse engineering the signals is not for the faint at heart (I got around 170k entries in about 60 seconds of operation... no way I'm going to try and figure them all out).

So, for those that aren't digging into signals, if you can get the FRM to both reboot and clear the error codes so that you can reprogram it, you win. But considering how dealers operate, its unlikely you'll ever get that from them. Cheaper for them to sell you an FRM at 400%+ markup and toss in $250 of labor to pull the 4 screws, 3 cables, plug the new one in, and start the automated programming sequence. You do however do get a total system firmware upgrade on your mini while they do that (they don't just reprogram the one device, they just do the entire system while they are there. Easier than figuring out which button to use).

Not including the battery (which is a different subject/fight), I limped away from the dealer with my pockets $1400 lighter all told. I think it was an expensive drive-in movie...

Marcos

P.S. For those that are "adding" options to your car, since you're adding new inputs to new outputs (or like the xeon lights, additional inputs like the leveler, etc), it will always require a little reprogramming to "programatically wire" the things together in the FPM.
 
  #45  
Old 04-04-2015, 04:29 PM
miniuy
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Very interesting story and experience mdella
I was always afraid to replace the FRM for myself, but when you know it's just remove two screws and carefully disconnect two wires, it is an easy job. But VOs programming is very critical and sensitive and you need to be very focused and undistracted to do it.

Your FRM is not just a driver for inputs and outputs it is also "THE" backup of your VOs (features and characteristics) which respond to your equipment. The main VOs list is under the CAS module.
The programming is needed because when installing a new FRM it must contain exactly the same list of VO that the CAS has, otherwise a conflict would be generated (or others worse things). Why taking the risk? There is not necessary.

To add Xenon functionality, you are right, you need to make a change in FRM hardware pins but when you install the OEM Mini Bi-Xenon headlights too.
In that case you need a voltage to bi-xenon bulb lights and a shutter that moves bi-xenon to the highbeam position. The shutter is on a different pin position than the highbeam halogen system output.

Adding VO to support Xenons, just add voltage stability for the highbeam, nothing else.

In my case I only needed to add the xenon support VO to CAS and FRM because I replaced my headlights with a DEPO aftermarket xenon headlights (non bi-xenon) then I have a stable voltage to the single xenon when low beam are on and when I moves to highbeam, the halogen output just moves (open) a mechanism inside the projector (insted of powering on a second filament in the OEM dual filament halogen bulb).

It was necessary to set the VO for xenon lights only because a voltage stability, otherwise, the xenon work only with the car turned off and then flickering and off when the car is turned on.

Total cost of change/repair: $250 (used FRM, not knowing if it would work and without any warranty).
Time spent: probably 30 times more than you was waiting for your car at the official service, plus a high dose of adrenaline, stress and large amount of sweat on the keyboard of my laptop while programming it

I know that it is not a cheap cost but if I'm not sure what exactly I'm doing and what I should expect as a result, I prefer to leave the car in the hands of someone who knows what he does.
For example, I never would touch the ECU!

 
  #46  
Old 06-17-2015, 08:44 AM
Saul Armendariz
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Footwell Module / LED Interior Lights

i have a 2007 328i and i replaced all the interior lights to LED and now the footwell module needs to be replaced the dealer is telling me is because of the LED bulbs, is this correct? can the footwell module be affected by just replacing the bulbs to led?
 
  #47  
Old 06-17-2015, 08:59 AM
Saul Armendariz
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i have a 2007 328i and i replaced all the interior lights to LED and now the footwell module needs to be replaced the dealer is telling me is because of the LED bulbs, is this correct? can the footwell module be affected by just replacing the bulbs to led?
 
  #48  
Old 07-08-2015, 01:20 AM
thundershine
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Problem with FRM Module

My BMW X1 2011 Car, had an attack by Mouse, it tampered some cables of water level sensor and a/c outside temperature sensor and i took it to an authorized Boche workshop and after they taping the cables the headlight was always on and the automatic windows and indicators were not working. It was all ok when i took it to the workshop. ( The Bosch software was showing Canbus communication error) They said the FRM Module is fried and asked me to change the FRM Module which would cost me a lot.

I just want to know whether their diagnostics is correct or is it any problem with other issue. or should i look at another issue! before changing the FRM Module. Please advice. My BMER is still in the garage ... So sad!
 
  #49  
Old 09-14-2015, 05:54 AM
Puggles
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This is a fascinating thread which has given me some hope!


I have a 2011 All4 S Countryman to which I recently fitted the genuine Mini DRLs.
Picture below:
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These earth in the engine bay, take a 12v feed from the engine bay fuse box and get a signal from the Footwell Module (you have to break into a wire going into the module). Image below:
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All was fine until I noticed last week that I'd lost my interior switchgear illumination.
At first I thought I'd blown a fuse but this seems fine.
Then I wondered if the connection I'd made to the footwell module for the DRLs was not quite fitted correctly. Mini provide a scotch clip style connector which I know are not the best so I took it apart and re-wired everything using a screw down connector.

A quick test and switchgear illumination appeared to be back. So tools went away and beer was drunk in celebration!
But annoyingly, the following day my switchgear illumination was not working again, and this now seems temperamental. Some days it's there, others not. I also lost the main beam headlight flash when I pull on the stalk and was getting lights on warnings when leaving the car, even though the light switch was in the off position!

So looks like it could be a poor connection in the 51-pin block connector. Will take this off again and push all of the connections down in the hope that one is just loose!

Also, does anyone know where pin 12 of plug X14261 comes from?
My assumption is that it comes from the left hand column lighting stalk. And when you switch the lights from OFF to either side lights ON, or dipped headlights ON it tells the switchgear illumination to come on and therefore is a signal to the DRLs to dim?

Any other thoughts?
 
  #50  
Old 09-15-2015, 06:59 AM
xanders_pty
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Windows, tail gate no function

Hello, id an pleasure participate of this Block,

I have a Mini Cooper R57 2010, and my car function all righ, but i disarmet the dash for reparir the LH door, them when i armed all the windws door, the tail gate, the roof not function, i bought the footwell module new, and the problem persist.

Please i need your recomendation

Thanks
 

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