OK, so you have a mid modded MCS used for the track and you find you have trouble keeping up on the straights (very common for the MINI and not really it's strength).

So your basic question is- "What can you do to improve on the track given your current setup"?
and
"Will upgrading (port and polish) the cylinder head and maybe adding a race cam help enough for track use given current mods"?
or
"Is there another upgrade that will provide what you want on the track"?
Like adding a turbo to the MCS or replacing the supercharger with turbo only.

The other rate limiting consideration is what is your budget over time and how reliable do you want this all to be? When you track a car you will stress it considerably more and your should expect a higher degree of routine maintenance.

Some questions-
Which Cat back exhaust do you have?
Which suspension mods do you have?
What alignment settings are you using?
Any interest in upgrading to lightweight flywheel, racing clutch and Quaife differential?
Any interest in upgrading to the shorter gearing of the 2005 or later MCS?
Any interest in loosing alot of weight and removing the interior/stereo etc since this could be a track car only?
Which wheels and tires do you use for the track?
Is your air filter worn and dirty or new and clean?
Do you really think that adding an exhaust header is going to make that much difference compared to some of the things I have listed above?

Anyone that drives on the track will come across the same concerns and similar experience as what you have noticed. When I drive I loose ground in a hurry to the Corvettes, Lotus Elise and BMW M3 and M5s on the straights but if I don't loose too much speed in the turns and I get on the throttle a little earlier coming out of the turns and keep a little more speed in the straights I can to pretty good given the limits of my MCS.

One size does not fit all and in fact doing research, identifying your own needs and priorities (like do you primarily drive on a single track or many different ones) and then working with a manufactorer to tune your upgrade for your needs but within your budget makes the most sense to me.

 

are you implying that most vendors in the mini community are not taking advantage of a unique market and gouging? like the doc said ;the machine shops that do heads are now within the consumers grasp . sorry if it hurts ... lower your prices .

 

I was asking you who you thought was, in your words, gouging; it's not the other way around. I also asked you other questions that you seem to have dogged. I am just trying to find out your thinking since you posted. Furthermore, machine shops have always been available to do Mini heads. But to find the right one with the right computer model, 7-axis CNC, and the right testing equipment is few and far between.

 

Some questions-
Which Cat back exhaust do you have? A. Borla
Which suspension mods do you have? A. H&R Springs, Bilstiens, H&R sway bars, K-mac rear control arms and Helix camber plates
What alignment settings are you using? A. -2 degrees, 1/16 toe out on fronts, -1 degree 0 toe rear.
Any interest in upgrading to lightweight flywheel, racing clutch and Quaife differential? A. have upgraded to Quaife LSD, stock flywheel/ clutch, redline dif. oil
Any interest in upgrading to the shorter gearing of the 2005 or later MCS? A. Maybe
Any interest in loosing alot of weight and removing the interior/stereo etc since this could be a track car only? A. rear seat removed for track events
Which wheels and tires do you use for the track? A. TD Pro 1 & OZ ultraleggara with 205/40/17 Toyos
Is your air filter worn and dirty or new and clean? A. Cleaned and oiled every 90 days.
Do you really think that adding an exhaust header is going to make that much difference compared to some of the things I have listed above? A. no not alone but I do think the MCS exhaust is a week point and if you going to go through the trouble to do headwork you might as well get a better header.

Anyone that drives on the track will come across the same concerns and similar experience as what you have noticed. When I drive I loose ground in a hurry to the Corvettes, Lotus Elise and BMW M3 and M5s on the straights but if I don't loose too much speed in the turns and I get on the throttle a little earlier coming out of the turns and keep a little more speed in the straights I can to pretty good given the limits of my MCS. Yup! I know what your saying and agree. I just want more HP.

What is your setup?

DJDport66


[/quote]

 

i think anyone charging 2 grand to do a mini head is gouging . there are heads offered on ebay from a clearwater company for 800.00 abacus does them much cheaper as well . sure theyve got 16 valves but i should think the work involved in doing 2 v8 heads ; including cleaning pressure testing etc. would be equal to or more . so why then are they cheaper ? labor is labor . guess were gonna have to diagree on this one .

 

I have to go with herbie on this one, MINI heads are just too ridiculous in price.
There is just no way to justify $1500-$2500 for a cylinder head. I don't care what you do to it.

I would rather just find a decent casting and have it Extrude Honed for a few hundred dollars. There is no way a human or a CNC can get into the nooks and crannys like the abrasive media of an Extrude Hone process can.

 

but there is also no way for the extrude hone media to intelligently decide which material to remove. and it does make a difference.

 

You're right it does make a difference, but is the difference worth $1500-$2000? I don't think so.
Of course, the abrasive media will only follow the contours of the stock ports, but after the process, the head will be better than stock. That is all I need for my application.

 

"Dr"

I like your wine connection.

The problem is that CHEEP wine gives me a headache

But all in all the one size fits all is a fact.
I have built heads (and engines) for drag and also heads for FAST long distance. and engines for rock crawling.

The cams / valves / carb (fuel management) are very different.

The cookie cutter "what is best" needs to be heavily questiond as to what the goal / use of the engine is.

 

ENDYN is an example of a CNC + hand ported option that is less than that price range.

 

astrochex, +1

 

Just asking, what info do you have that the difference will be better than stock after Extrude Honed?

 

I am the person who has been helping Clearwater Cylinder Head sells those heads! I know what goes into them and why they appeal to some Mini owners: perceived affordability. But there is a large difference between those heads and, for example, the Stage 1 heads that I sell from Wegner Motorsports ($1250). And what if you want good, but not the best valves? 16 valves at about $30 each is $480. Then add the remaining components: guides, locks, retainers, and springs...Want to go fast? It costs money. The term price gouging implies that vendors have an ability to forcibly inflict harm which they don’t. You are free to choose whoever you want to do a head. For a vendor to charge what the market will bear is no more price gouging than it is for a company employee to negotiate the highest salary he can get. Follow the Money. Here in America NASCAR is where the money is whether you like it or not. The technology that goes into the engines is expensive to say the least. I know first hand that the heads on a restrictor plate engine are different than those on a non-restrictor plate engine. So to think that there is a one-size-fits-all head is foolish. With extrude honing there is no way to control how much material is removed...just trying to educate.

 

As a whole all Mini stuff seems "premiumized" however the market place will eventually balance the price. Headers are a good example.

I think vendors are beginning to react -

DMH is pricing stage 1 at $1250 which warrants a seriously looksie considering he is a known vendor.
Clearwater on Ebay for $800. An unkown vendor (atleast to me) but who knows - at that price some NAMer will take the plunge.

I was considering it but have decided to wait.

 

After all my mods I have concluded there is only one rational way to make this kind of selection...... drum roll.....practical or not.

.....choose a few vendors that meet your "trust" criteria and make a arrangements to ride in or drive a car that is set up the way you want your car to perform..... don't buy a "suit" over the internet when you have no experience with the vendor.... if the vendors have been building engines etc they certainly can arrange for you to experience their work. I'm sure that most of the vendors have cars that are reasonably close to you..... possibly arrange meeting at the Dragon....post on NAM.... "does anyone have this or that config that would not mind if you visited"?.... I have personally posted this kind of offer for 62 cars......

the head and cam make too large of a dif and cost too much not to do your homework and make an informed decision..... you can not IMO do this from web sites and posts.....

 

With this approach you are bound to your local shop. That could be fine but what if it is not? An educated consumer is my best customer. And that is most likely why we do such a large track prep business.

 

[QUOTE=dmh;1390655]With this approach you are bound to your local shop.

absolutely NOT..... I flew to MN to evaluate a car.... as well as Miami.... plane fare is cheap.... you can drive to a destination.... does anyone have your products on the west coast?

to make this decision without comparison is not smart IMO

 

Affordability is an issue, right?

 

yes also there is "the old one"

 

again i'm not racing , just want some more h.p. and torque . but driveability. so big deal the valves are from nasa. my stock valves are still going strong after 75000 mls.. some porting and c.c.ing should be available at a better price to those who don't know where to go for it . but it seems most vendors are only interested in "loading " the options , much the way car dealers do .

 

and as far as gouging; just cause during a riot lots of people are running around looting cause they can ; doesn't make it right .

 

For most of us.

 

You get what you pay for when it comes to heads. Tuning issues crop up due to fuel that puddles and ports/clyinders that to not move air at the same rate and mixture. Buyer beware!

 

You definaetly seem confused.

 

right but as its been made clear im not alone . guess if i want to hot rod a car without paying a fortune i'll have to go back to v8s and try to deal with twice as many parts for half the money .