OK here goes...I have spent the last hour or two searcching old threads and researching vendors sites to see the differences in heads being offered and what i can expect from them. However my situation is a little different as I plan to add the head to a twin charge setup.

I have read tons of posts and arguements over who has the best flow, M7's secret recipe, puddling effects and blah blah. But what I cannot find is anything to do with a Twincharge or straight turbo MCS setup.

Here's a breakdown of what the vendors offer:

Cosworth:$1599 ported only. Core charge of $1200 WTF!!

Cosworth Big valve: $3400+?? ported with "big valves?" No core charge

Webb: $1875 ported with upgraded intake and exhaust valves. I believe it includes a "webb" cam, core charge of $600

Mini Madness: $1099 ported only. Core charge of $799

Mini Madness Stage 1: $1798 ported with +1.25mm exhaust valves. Core charge of $799

Mini Madness Stage 2: $1998 Same as above w. +1.25mm intake Ferrea valves

DMH Head: $1750 Ported w. +1.25mm intake and +2mm exhaust Ferrea valves no core charge info available

DMH / Wegner: $2325 ported with 1mm intake and 2mm exhaust Manley valves plus includes race locks and guides Core charge of $350

Endyne: Cannot find price, ported with +0.5mm intake and +1mm exhaust valves. Cannot find core price

Pilo Street: $1000 ported only, cannot find core info

Pilo Race: $1450, ported with larger intake and exhaust valves, no core info

Pilo Race 2: $1900 same as above with lighter and stronger exhaust valves, comes balanced and blueprinted, no core info

Heres a few other questions or concerns:

Will head work negatively affect boost response (laggy??)

Why are only some heads decked, balanced and blueprinted?

Knowing the head is going on with a Twin charge kit should I change my head gasket or just use another OEM?

Input on a Schrick cam please, again how well would this work with a Twin charge kit?

I did not read very much info about upgraded springs on a lot of vendors sites while i was researching. Are they not an important part to "beef up" especially if your planning a cam?

Thanks and sorry for the huge post!!

Seann

 

$950 for basic Port/polish
$250 for 0.5 mm larger intake 1.0 mm larger exhaust
Upreved springs and retainers I don't remember, but I'll post when I come across the reciept.

Don't know core.... I bought one off eBay.

Matt

 

I have spent about 6k on the motor stuff including puley's, bypass valve, TB's etc.....looking back I should have gone TC with the Firballed kit. The money would have been the same and I would have 260whp instead of 216whp and if I wanted more I would just change out the pistons and add more boost. I love my car and it has made a huge transformation but its still not enough power, plus I love the sound and the thought of having a twincharged car.
If I had the twincharged today, I wouldn't have lossed to the Vette this morning.
M

 

sorry even 300whp will not beat a vette! i have a mini-s and a vette and a 525hp wrx. i think i should know.

 

Depends on where you drive . A vette can't even begin to play in our yard

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

In the case of ENDYN, no core charge listing means the customer supplies the head and must wait until the work is performed on that head; well worth the time required.

When you decide on who to do the job discuss those questions you have with the provider, that person is in the position to give you the best guidance.

In my opinion, non-OEM retainers, springs, and other valve train components, are not needed unless redline is raised by a large margin. The exception would be larger valves; I believe larger valves are worth it (I have them on my modified head).

Head studs are a good idea; ARP head bolts at least, although examples of success without them are plenty.

The OEM gasket is adequate; I’m using a Cometic because of its excellent track record. The two have similar construction, but if you bore the cylinders and go for different pistons a custom is necessary.

 

That's what tricklex and I was telling you from the start After you drive the TC or Turbo setup, everything feels slow and sluggish. Well, you can always sell those parts and start over.

 

But I think a lot of people end up here! You start modding for "just a little more". Then each bolt on really seems like a small step. Next thing you know you've spend a bunch more than a head cost, and don't have the power bump the head would have provided. Hindsight is 20/20, and it becomes appearent that one should have started with the head, and added on to that.

I did a bit of the same thing. Finally I threw in the towel (I didn't hit $6k in engine mods, but had done my fair share) and got the stuff for the head, and matched intake, and a real header. Start with a good foundation, and go from there.

Matt

 

what do you run in the quarter with yer wrx.... and I run 12.2s but that was then... things have changed

safia... I have not done the head to achive my 400 HP... so this is a small issue.... when the m600 went 10.6 in NJ it was with a stock head.... the fireballed head out flows most that i have seen... and is consistent cause it's C&C.... the head made 41 for mario... and 60 on the turbo cars... TC or T only

 

With a stripped mini and 300whp you will have no problem with a c5 corvete. However the C6 ZO6 is a different story. It takes a little more power to pull on.

 

heh heh.... werrrd

 

I concur... I spanked many c5 vettes!

 

the dif is that the $ comes a little at a time.

 

YEP

 

I guess my biggest question is will head work affect boost response? I wouldn't mind doing some head work now...even if its just porting if it will benefit thesetup. At the same time though I have read that head work is better for top end which would lead me to believe that it may add a little more lag.

Sorry if that sounds stupid

Seann

 

Hi,

I think that as bad as the Mini head is...... which is bad.... if you have the $ it all should start there...... larger valves make a big dif to the 62..... turbos live in a world of there own Tuls and the guys are hugely successful with the stock head (scratch my head) but the 62 (for example) tq curve is "pretty" flat and my head is a +1 on both I/E......


Bob

 

What you'd most likely find is that a new aftermarket cam with your ported head will shift the torque curve to the right. Headwork could do this, too, but it's hard to say from a dyno sheet because most people get a different cam added at the same time. All aftermarket cams for these MINIs (that I've seen) are made for high rpm power...they just don't hit their sweet spot until later. IMO, that loss isn't anything huge, but it is noticeable.

As far as the TC goes, damned if I know. Hopefully one of "those guys" (much love Tuls, how ya been!?!) could say.

 

are you talking about a regular C5 or a C5 ZO6 which is equal to a regular C6. When I raced yesterday is a a regular C5 350hp one.
M

 

I didn't notice any lose on the bottom end, with new head. To me the Mini has always been weak off the line anywhays. One way I help the low end is getting the Detroit bypass valve and the lighten crank pulley. My boost is set up to come on quickly but dies off near 7k rpm.

 

I raced a c5 zo6 from a roll with my previous twincharge setup (closed course at a local air strip) which was 315whp. The zo6 had full length headers and exhaust. And a CAI. I think it was making north of 400whp. I barely inched on him.

But the best part was after we pulled over and he checked out my ride. His girl wanted to go for a ride in my car.

 

Call Eric at Helix. Earlier this year he had a Webb head on the way to try on his Turbokompressor Mini. I haven't had a chance to ask him how it ran. I'm afraid of the answer ($$$).

 

This thread seemed to get off track and the information about the Wegner head is incomplete.
I recommend doing head work before any serious engine modifications such as twin-charging because that is where the restriction resides. It improves engines performance; it doesn’t hurt it. The Shrick cam is fine but not optimal; it is very mild and is not a race cam as advertised. Valve train work is just as important as the porting especially if you are planning on upgrading the induction. But it is not worth doing unless you are using at least 2mm oversize exhaust valves. You also ought to port and match your intake as well.

Stage 1: CNC ported with stock valve train
$1000
Stage 2*: CNC ported with CHE guides & retainers; PSI valve springs & locks; Manley custom 5.5mm valves, +1mm/+2mm, & locks
$2325
Other high performance options are available.
*Money back guarantee: If our Wegner Motorsports Stage 2 cylinder head with does not deliver a performance improvement compared to the current head you are running (any cylinder head) send it back for a full refund within 30 days. Cams must be comparable. Excludes shipping and handling chargers.

 

[QUOTE=Tüls;12523
the head made 41 for mario... and 60 on the turbo cars... TC or T only[/QUOTE]

60hp more on the tc? I would buy that! Who do I call?

 

Thanks for the input Don...

Hey Tuls can you either PM me or throw up some pricing and specs for the different types of heads you guys offer.

Seann