I've come to the realization that finding someone local to do this job is darn near impossible...

After reading tons of information, tonight I found a forum where a guy did it himself by using Techline Coatings:

http://www.techlinecoatings.com/Exhaust.htm#Coverage

Further reading reveals that this stuff is pretty good, and actually many coating shops use these products...

50 bucks would give me plenty (12 ounces) for our little 4-banger header, and if that went well, the remainder would probably coat a good portion of the rest of my exhaust system...

If anyone has ventured down this road before, kindly share your experiences. Thanks much.

 

Well haven't ventured down this road, but I'll be watching closely...

 

Coatings work well but wrap works better... Either way you need to remove the header.

 

Really? I was just about to pay $250ish CDN to have mine coated....

Can you explain a little


Seann

 

Excellent question Tony. I had found them and a few other sources while looking coatings up for the insulating the CAI thread currently going on.

The hardest part wold be prepping the header. It'd probably still be best to pay to have it cleaned by a professional. Ultrasonic and maybe a mild surface abrasion.
You would also have to be quite careful during assembly since it cures best when heated to it may be pretty fragile until you run it in well.

Just a few random thoughts I came up with while considering the same thing.

You go first

 

I read in another thread that wrapping can reduce the life of your header... would coating it cause the same issue?

Thx

 

"I read in another thread that wrapping can reduce the life of your header... would coating it cause the same issue?"
( IMHO ) No on both. On steel you might, ( I have wrap on a TT header that has been on my Triumph since 1989 - it's steel ) shorten the life of the header but on SS you may not be able to drive by the time its life is over. No race application, go kart to GT1, worked as well as wrap. Even motorcycles benifet from wrap. If anything, the coating will extend the life of the header. Best case, do both.

 

Guys, really busy at work... I'll chime-in later...

 

would you have to clean the header if you bought it new and never put it on? i might get this when get my header, its cheap and looks reliable

 

because you just don't know what's on the surface.... I think this is the poor man's way to get it done (sorry, Tony, that means you have to stop! ) But a lot of these coatings are spray on. Don't know how many coats, or what, does the best, but scuffing the surface will surely help.

Go for it Tony! I was cheap and didn't coat my header, but if you find it's an easy job, I may just brake down and do it myself too.

Matt

 

Guys, I got an email back from this company... plus I'd like to comment on some of the above... Getting slammed at work!!!

 

Sorry to interupt but I thought coating was better than wrap...hence the extra bucks?! Is doing both overkill on our cars? How would you wrap all the individual primaries?

Thanks


Seann

 

Seems to me that with coating, you get a more even application and could coat both inside and outside. With wrap you're going to get some missed spots, where the primaries join the collector(s), etc. This difference alone would account for the price differential, and then there's labor...

cheers,

 

Finally some time...

As I shared before, I've done my share of research off and on the past couple of weeks. Let me do a brain-dump, hopefully in some kind of order that makes sense...

I grew-up when header wraps didn't really have any viable competiton, so that was my first avenue of inquiry. From reading various car forums, and quite a few websites, the ceramic coatings are the way to go. I couldn't find one source that said wrap was better. Believe me, with wrap being so cheap, and Summit Racing's speedy delivery and great service, I was hoping to find otherwise...

As said earlier, wraps are only external, so the heat, at least some of it, has already migrated through the metal. Wraps come-off, and as one person said, I think in a Corvette forum, they look "butt." I assume that means bad by the context . Also, and on a more serious note, if there were to be an oil rupture with oil spewing onto the header, the wrap essentially becomes a torch. I guess this has happened more than a few times...

Holding-in heat has its merits, and I think those have been touched upon already. From what I have learned, just coating or covering the outside is not the most ideal. Too much heat can crack the metal, and in the case with a wrap, holding-in moisture also, making for premature failure.

Coating the inside, typically a different coating, or at least a thinner one is the way to go. This will aid in preventing the heat from escaping in the first place. A thicker outer coating further keeps-in the heat and in doing so, makes for lessened surface temps, which are great for our engine bays, and what are intakes consume...

I have learned that header prep is important, and the reason I started this thread:

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ht=header+prep

Sand-blasting is a good way to go, namely on a used header. However, it should be coated fairly quickly. If not, I heard that coating it with a light oil is recommended. Just degrease it when ready....

It seems that Jet-Hot and HPC are the most popular places to get this done. If I understand correctly, they will do inside and out, and will charge a bit more for prep'ing. Swaintech in NY seems like really good stuff, but they are strictly external. Oh, I have heard of a few folks wrapping a coated header, but the additonal gains I don't know. I suppose it couldn't hurt, besides looking "butt."

So, after all of this, I find Techline Coatings, for which I provided the link in the first post. I had 3 email exchanges with them today, and Leonard there was very responsive. Here is what I got back, only his repsonses to my questions, which you can quess:

"It is not recommended that you coat the inside, as the coating requires a minumum of 750f and a maximum of 950f to full cure. On the exterior this typically is not a problem. On the ID, it can actually get too hot too fast and burn the resin before it cross links. It is designed for spraying which makes it impractical for the ID as well."

"We have two coatings for the ID, but both are available to shops only."

"It can be poured, sponged or sprayed with special tools."
=============

So, for me, this product is no longer an option, at least for the header. I might consider doing the ouside of my system with it though, if it gets hot enough (750-950) to cure properly.

Also since all of us have stainless steel header, these do hold-in heat better than normal mild steel. So, some just might be content knowing that, and avoid this option. However, 304 stainless, which most of us have (the cheapest), is not the best ss at dealing with heat. Just coating or wrapping the outside could shorten its life as it will see more heat. Again, coating from within seems like the way to go...

It's late, and I think I forgot a thing or two, but if I remember, I'll chime-in again...

Oh, finding someone local to me (CA - Bay Area) has been very hard. One guy just told me that he can do it, and after speaking with him, he would just ship it to Jet-Hot on my behalf. He shared that one will not find the best shops in this state because they cannot legally use the most desirable chemicals here. I don't know how true that is, but it wouldn't surprise me...

Hope this info was of some help!

 

Thanks, Tony. Of course it doesn't help, since all I wanted to hear was that coating with wrap was OK
But seriously, this information makes the decision a little easier--I will butt wrap my header and if it dies in 2 years, I'll have saved up enough to get a better one that's coated from the factory. I only paid 200 bucks for the header, so it's cheaper than gas! I'll try to avoid fires, and hope that a little less heat entering the engine bay will help my non-DFIC.
Thanks again for the reflections on a hot topic.

cheers,

 

I think we'll be walking the path of rotten headers together
I'll be wrapping the stocker. If it craps there's more where that came from.

 

Getting rid of under hood heat is good

 

Not a problem. As usual, there are pros/cons with various approaches or options, and it's nice to have info on which to base a decision. I will pull the trigger soon, and share...

 

No, I'm not here to argue in this thread but rather was interested in headers and coatings. My question goes like this…A SS header from Alta or who ever costs about $800. Then I guess it needs to be coated to cut down on the heat generated under the bonnet. Is it a decent solution just wrap the stocker?
(And Dr. O, I see you were conveniently absent from yesterdays “discussion!”)

 

I think Matt might have been installing a new "toy," but that's just a guess...

Wrapping the stocker should cut-down on under hood temps, and for the price (no new header or coating), you might be quite satistfied. Should probably remove it to wrap it well...

Depending on one's cat back system, some have said that aftermkt headers make a noticeable difference though. I look forward to finding-out...

 

dmh: I think there's more to the stock header than just heat generation! Have you looked at one? Where the 4 primaries enter the collector they are just crimped to fit a round socket--not a pretty sight and the X-section area must be cut in half for each pipe. Then there's the pre-cat and the really long flex joint. It weighs about 6000lb (just an estimate). To be honest, it would be a waste of header wrap to do that puppy!
There's no doubt my Megan header is letting more gas escape faster--what that means for HP and Torque I don't know. I think I'll be wrapping it...
On that topic: what about the wrap sealant? The guy at Napa parts doesn't sell it, but is it required/recommended/optional?
thanks,

 

The wrap has a better insulating factor than the ceramic or aluminumized coating. I'm not sugesting you touch an HPC or a Jet Hot coated or a wraped header, but the wrap will be much cooler ( less hot ), they are both pretty hot. In theory, the cooler the header, the better the flow. The hot exhaust won't stick... that's the simple version. I've seen wrap that has a foil backing on it, outside surface, don't know what that's all about, but that would reduce under hood temp quite a bit

 

It seems that there are two distinct reasons for "covering" a header. One is to keep heat contained within as much as possible, and the other is to lower engine bay heat. The first makes for direct performance gains, and some will say on the range of 3%... Just covering the outside (wrap or coating) allows the heat to still leave the flow path more as compared to coating on the inside. If one wants to maximize that performance gain through improved scavenging, then addressing the inside would be prudent...

If underhood temps are mostly of concern, then just doing the outside will help. Again, this info is just from me doing some reading, as I'm certainly no one of experience here...

 

but for the new AGS tube. It's just bare Al and I'd like to reject the heat from the through radiator hot air.....

Matt

 

Bling. Makes pissin away a grand more comfy.


On a side note, I was watching the Le Mans this weekend and one of the tech spots showed one of the cars running Inconel ( amazing stuff )headers running wrap covered by a heat shield. Here 's the cool :D part. They had wrapped the rear cage supports in gold foil. These were in the engine bay (LMP car if I remember right) and they lowered the cage bar temps 80º which in turn lowered cabin temps almost 20º.
Good stuff.