Am I reading this url http://www.bodymotion.com/Racing/Sub...g_Mini_Fab.htm correctly? To me this sounds like a kit to replace the MINI's "drive by wire" into a proper cable based throttle. I'm sure I've got to be reading this wrong, no?

Has anyone tried the Body Motion gear? It's used by Nuzzo Motorsports who race an MCS in the Grand-Am Cup.

Cheers,

Paul

 

No, you read it correctly. One of the issues with going to a Motec EMS is the drive-by-wire, a situation I'm currently in the middle of figuring out. The easy way to get around it is of course to go with a cable throttle, so I'm sure that's what this is all about.

The thing I found strange about this throttle body is the size - it's right about the stock size at 56mm. The throttle body I have is 61.5mm, and we are working on a bigger one for cars with some mods done that include chamfered outlets to the supercharger. I can't imagine going through all of the trouble to modify it to a Bosch throttle position sensor and cable actuated throttle and then not go bigger in size.

I'll have to give them a call tomorrow and check out what exactly they are doing and why.

Randy

 

Ask them why the wiring harness is $2500.

 

>>No, you read it correctly. One of the issues with going to a Motec EMS is the drive-by-wire, a situation I'm currently in the middle of figuring out. The easy way to get around it is of course to go with a cable throttle, so I'm sure that's what this is all about.
>>
>>The thing I found strange about this throttle body is the size - it's right about the stock size at 56mm. The throttle body I have is 61.5mm, and we are working on a bigger one for cars with some mods done that include chamfered outlets to the supercharger. I can't imagine going through all of the trouble to modify it to a Bosch throttle position sensor and cable actuated throttle and then not go bigger in size.


I noticed the same thing, hence my confusion. Granted this equipment is supplied to Nuzzo Motorsports for their MINI entries into the Grand-Am Cup. Could be that the throttle can't be increased from stock as per the rules. Sounds logical enough then that they did this to get better throttle response but stay within the legal size limits.

>>I'll have to give them a call tomorrow and check out what exactly they are doing and why.

Let me know what you find out. :smile:

Paul

 

Has anyone done any dyno testing to show that the stock throttle body is restrictive?

 

>>Ask them why the wiring harness is $2500.




R

 

Just got off the phone with them. Great guys.

The reason they are converting the e-throttle is as suspected - to make the Motec work. They are using a totally different design as far as the throttle body goes, and have found that the 56mm Bosch unit (which is actually 1mm smaller than stock) flows better than the stock unit - and they cannot change the cam, head or pulley. They also didn't want to approach the Grand-am governing body with a whole slew of changes, so the 56mm throttle body was conservative to make it into the rule book.

As far as the cost on the wiring harness - it is a plug and play uni9t that allows the use of the Motec controller and maintains the ECU for other than engine functions (the speedo, cruise, etc.). The development for a plug and play wiring harness more than compensates for that price - trust me.

They talked about some of the upcoming developments, and I will be privy to those to make them available.

Hope that helps!

Randy

 

My only gripe about my new (1/20/03) MCS is that when you lift off gas to shift the RPM's don't come down for several seconds. This is obviously programmed into the car. Is there any patch or anything that can be done to change this? Is the mechanical throttle linkage intended to cure this aggravation?

 

While some of it is definitely due to programming to reduce emmisions, there is another more difficult to resolve reason - the flywheel weighs in at a whopping 27 lbs .

Believe it or not, you get used to it, and it actually assists in shifting to keep the revs from dropping - so it's easier to match shifts on the track. Give it a while, and see if you don't adapt with your current shift technique.

If you absolutely can't stand it - I have an aluminum flywheel with a clutch package coming out soon, and the Motec unit will cure the ECU programming - we are talking big bucks in both parts and labor.

Let me know if you have any other quesitons.

Randy
720-841-1002

 

Another contributor to the "hanging revs" feeling is that the supercharger itself acts as an additional flywheel since all the rotating mass is spinning proportionally with engine speed. In effect, putting on a 15% pulley, makes the engine feel like the flywheel is bigger!

Oh, and I added up all the Motec stuff. $5180 in parts alone for engine management that HOPEFULLY runs as well as stock, and can presumably be tweaked for some extra ponies, as long as you have the know-how.

_________________
2003 MCS DS/DS Black Leather
Packs: Prem/Sport/Cold, PDC, SatNav

Helix/P&D 15% Pulley, MTH Chip, Magnaflow Exhaust 165.0 whp (14.5% HP gain, 14% Torque gain)

My MINI

 

Is installing this unit a simple case of replacing the throttle body and linkage or does that $2500 plug and play wiring harness need to be install in order to use the cable based linkage?

Paul

 

How about ITRBs? I can hear it now.

 

>>
>>Is installing this unit a simple case of replacing the throttle body and linkage or does that $2500 plug and play wiring harness need to be install in order to use the cable based linkage?
>>
>>Paul

The engine computer would be very, very unhappy if you removed two of its friends (accelerator pedal with dual potentiometers, and throttle body with dual potentiometers).

 

Paul,

Andy's right- you would have to have some sort of new engine management to run it, or the Siemens would kick your butt

The entire reason Nuzzo went to the new throttle body and cable throttle is to make the Motec work.

As far as the cost goes, a similar technology can be had (but with all of the headaches of wiring set-up) from AEM. The Wolf 3D 4.0 is something I've been toying wtih, but it introduces the same issues that Bodymotion and Nuzzo had with the Motec.

I'm still trying to work within the parameters of the Siemens EMS 2000, but just tell it what I want to do as far as ignition timing, fuel ratios and redline.

Randy

 

>>>>
>>>>Is installing this unit a simple case of replacing the throttle body and linkage or does that $2500 plug and play wiring harness need to be install in order to use the cable based linkage?
>>>>
>>>>Paul
>>
>>The engine computer would be very, very unhappy if you removed two of its friends (accelerator pedal with dual potentiometers, and throttle body with dual potentiometers).

So this amounts to virtually a complete computer replacement. Ouch.

Paul

 

>>
>>So this amounts to virtually a complete computer replacement. Ouch.
>>

Where are all the talented video game hackers when you need them

 

That's what chiptuners do.

I think we will see customizable engine management soon in the most elegant way possible (no cutting, no splicing, no hardware replacement).

 

Not soon enough. I've been really disapointed with what the chip tuners can do with the MCS. While I understand we're never going to see the kind of power that the VW 1.8t chips make I'm sure we can do better with a 15% reduction pulley specific chip.

Here's hoping.

Paul