Absolutely right, except one minor point. We were endowed by certain inaliable rights given to all people endowed by our creator. Other than that As you pointed out 100% correctly, the constitution only limits the government not people. The 10th amendment then leaves all things not enumerated in the constitution be left up to the states.

Michigan has decided to ban aftermarket exhausts. That is perfectly whithin "rights" and you have NO inaliable right to have one. Though I agree that the government should not be getting into these details......Lets get real. Nobodys rights are getting violated.....people think everything is a right.....Its not!

You can work to oppose the law through petitoning your elected lawmakers, or you can move out of state. Not the country, just your state. Thats the beuty of how the framers wrote the document. States decide.......But the bottom line is that there are many more people who are sick of rude and inconciderate morons (aka Ricers and Rednecks) who feel a need draw attention to themselves and have already petitioned law enforcement, and legislators to make law. Even though I do NOT think there should be a law against annoyances, we need to get over it! majority rules (ought to rule more often too) If more people want a law than don't then thats the way it is. There is nothing about our rights being violated.

 

A law against annoyances? So we're gonna have laws against pests, birds that crap on your newly washed MINI, things that go bump in the night, etc?

You're annoying me now, let's make a law against you...


The problem is we have too many laws, and they confuse the law enforcement. Like was posted earlier, there are already noise laws, but they are not enforced...so let's make another law to not get enforced because it clashes with the other noise law. It's rediculous the amount of restriction we have as a whole....and now we're getting spied on....but don't blame Exxon because they had a 30+ BILLION profit in the last quarter, instead, according to bumbling Bush, blame us for using the gas...doesn't us include him?

 

Im sick and tired of our rights and freedoms being taken away from us as a nation, from the government. The ban of aftermarket exhaust is clearly a violation of the right of the owner of the car.

However, I can also side with the people trying to persue their happiness; (as in enjoy their peace and quite.) Their needs to be a mixture of both. This law needs to be enacted not on the state level, but on the local city or town level, as in an ordinance.

The city were I live has sound ordinances. You cant disturb the peace by playing music excessively loud, etc. Anything mainly disturbing the peace, and this is not taken out of control. This is how it should be.

 

In my mind, this is actually more problematic than a statewide thing. How would you know which town you could and couldn't drive through? At least with statewide laws, they would apply to cars registered in the state, and out-of-state visitors wouldn't be subject to fines.

 

Just so this isn't misinterpreted, remember that the decibel scale of sound is logarithmic, meaning that 90 decibels is ten times as loud as 80 decibels, and 100 times as loud as 70 decibels.

95 decibels, which is the limit six feet away from the exhaust when they test is, is pretty damn loud. I know I wouldn't be concerned about my Cooper Milltek exceeding it.

 

I absolutely disagree with this proposed law (aren't there already nuisance laws that cover the most flagrant offenders?), but you're twisting the truth in your original post.

No, it doesn't. It just places restrictions on the volume of the aftermarket system.

No, it doesn't.

No, it doesn't.

No, it absolutely does not.

You weaken the strength of your argument when you resort to exaggeration and inaccurate portrayal of what is actually being proposed.

Again, I disagree with this proposed law 100%, but not for any of the reasons you mention.

 

In my city, I believe if you are causing a disturbance, then, you are brought to attention. I am not sure how the exact law is phrased, but I know it is noise based. You will not be "denied" entrance into the city if you have an aftermarket exhaust on. I think the only way you will get pulled is if you have a massive audio system, and are playing it at full volume in the middle of the night, or you have a straight-pipe exaust and are reving it next to a cop or in a neighborhood.

A friend of mine has a 92 GLi with no exhaust (welded pipe), and he rarely drives it. It is loud as hell, and if the authorities ever heard him, they would pull him over in an instant.

 

I corrected my post! I left out an important NOT.....If you read the context of my post you would have understood what I meant to say.

I agree with you we have WAY to many laws.....There is a noise law already on the books, the problem is enforcement. That same problem would exist with the new propsed law as well. Cops will only enforce such laws when you are found to be racing or when you just decide to be a jerk to a cop. But, my point was that the majority of people do support the law so it will likely become law. about the 15000th law that is enforced at first but 5years later only enforced when you are a jerk about things

By the way....you are not getting spied on unless you are talking to someone in a forgien country....and then technically we are spying on the person you are talking to not you

 

Excellent post....This is where I come down on the issue

 

In texas it's illegal to curse in public and to drive a truck with your shirt off. Yeah, that's a progressive state.

 

It is certainly not a "right" of any kind for a moron to blow by my home with an exhaust that is so loud that it wakes kids in their bedrooms with the windows shut. That is simple assault, and should be prosecuted - preferably with a shotgun.

There is indeed a "right" to quiet enjoyment, as the Supreme Court has phrased it, and any jerk that violates that right of others has the manners of a goat.

Grow up - you don't get to assault people with a baseball bat or a car exhaust.

Again - if you want noise, go to a track, where it is encouraged and appropriate, not anywhere that other people live.

 

I guess you didn't understand the Bill of Rights so i will reiterate. You have NO rights. All the amendments do is STOP the government from passing certain laws ... and a loud exhaust is not one of them.

Of course, (not to get political) you can vote and throw out your current politicians (whoever they may be) and vote in car friendly ones. THAT is you opportunity to do something. Anything else is just whining.

 

I think its funny that having a super loud exhaust is so important to anyone. Best performance, light weight, quality and tone I can understand - keeping it in line with acceptable volume for the street and to live among other people seems perfectly reasonable. The code as listed does not outlaw aftermarket exhausts, just ones that are louder then the parameters.

Making it a rights issue seems kinda silly - let's say you have an infant and everyone supposedly had the right to be as loud as they want, and your neighbors decide they can blast music on outdoor speakers whenever they want, use a chainsaw on and off in the middle of the night, etc, (you get the picture) and the baby can't sleep, you can't sleep and thus work well, and so on - does their "right" supercede yours to reasonable peace and quite and quality of life? In a perfect world people have conscience and empathy and wouldn't behave that way, but clearly that is not the case so the result is laws like this to control it; I'm not saying this particular one is perfect, but just responding to the notion that it is anyone's 'right' to be as loud as they want whereever.


(By the by, I do have a loud exhaust car in my neighborhood that comes and goes at all hours and wakes me up in spite of the double pane windows we put in - I haven't called to complain but don't think I haven't considered it).

 

I'm with you, but I doubt we'll live to see it. Freedom is all but extinct. It will have to get a whole lot worse before people start to get tired of being regulated to death. I'm afraid that there is no easy answer for the few of us that still appreciate individual liberties.

Rawhyde

 

Wrong. In my case, the neighbors and I have repeatedly requested that the rednecks stop trying to do burnouts on their Harleys on our neighborhood streets. Now they just try harder. We have also requested that they lay off of the motorized vehicles in the yard after midnight. Now they stay out all night making as much noise as possible.
On what basis have you determined that?
At this point, your Big Brother will have to. Local law enforcement is no help.
Based upon?
This is a logical impossibility. Running very loud pipes does not bring one respect.
In this case, I'd rather have higher property value than rednecks throwing beer cans in the street and urinating on them in front of children. (I think this is some sort of NH redneck game.)
I'll have to disregard your order, but feel free to do that for me since you've expressed such affinity with the biker kingdom. Additionally, I'm fairly positive that one cannot make a friend or two that one never knows.

 

Becareful what you ask for as the door swings both ways...remember history..."when they came for the Jews, it did not bother me because I am not a Jew..."

That said, I like to see them enforce this BS at the next Woodward Dream Cruise

 

Well sounds like it sucks to live on your street. I would have to say that I would have "upped" and moved by now. Maybe you should have Steven Segal or Chuck Norris move into your house. I have a feeling you have alot more problems than just loud exhausts on your street. And as I said there are respectable people who ride Harleys with loud pipes.....Loud pipes doesn't make you a dirtbag .You are painting with a broad brush. Again , if it is that bad call your realtor. I grew up in Paterson NJ a true S-hole I know when its time to pack up and go. Trust me, sounds like you are there, unless you are exaggerating a bit.

 

Sure, loud exhaust may be annoying to some poeple, but there's a RR crossing down the street and every time a train goes by the house shakes. My next door neighbor is retired and spends 7 hours a day on his yard using power blowers, weed eaters and mowers that are quite loud. My own dogs bark when they hear something at night. Every Saturday night, from 12:00am to 3:00 I can hear music thumping from a bar across the highway. Children scream blissfully on the playground at my little girls school. My neighbor works third shift and sleeps most of the day, but right now they're running saws and hammering all day constructing a house right next door. It goes on and on. Do we systematical try to eliminate everything that we find annoying? No! We suck it up and thank God we can make some noise. We act like american's and realize that if we are going to live in this diverse and wonderful country we MUST be tolerant. All you @%#&!'s that think more laws are the answer, I ask you this. What are you doing that annoys other people?

 

Oh man imagine if they did, that would be a ton of revenue!

 

I'd like to see you say this to me in person.. :impatient

 

Forget about Chuck Norris ! We should send OldRick to help MCS22004 with his problems..... Shot gun talk isn't Nam talk......

 

Maximusmini, I can't say it to you in person `cause you're not here, but I'll repeat it just for you.

 

Way ahead of you. Dear leader has got you covered.



As others have mentioned, we live in a society. While the fed seems to only represent those who enjoy the luxury of a lobby, the legislatures at the state and local levels still seem to pass laws that represent the views of the constituency they represent. It seems the people of Michigan may be sick of listening to others excessive and unnecessary noise.

Apparently many modders do not know, to the detriment of the 98 percent who don't mod is that, unbelievably, there are venues where such noise is not only permitted, but encouraged! Awash is this ignorance, many have determined that residential streets and neighborhoods are the appropriate venue to run, race, and otherwise wind out their modified cars. Surely concerned for safety, they are kind enough to use the hours between 11:00 pm and 6:00 am for at least a significant percentage of these activities.

I wonder what percentage of those who think the constitution protects their unmitigated right to be an unmitigated *** live in areas where the population density exceeds even 2500 people per sq. mile.

But, but, then everyone would win. The emphasis in aftermarket parts would shift to developing the better performing kit that everyone could live with. I found this while reading about exhausts, (what's best, etc) and would love to bolt on a better performant catback if I could find one that didn't make me engage in antisocial behavior every time I drove my car.

 

pg. 10 Steve Thompson Straight Pipes and Street Civility, last line:
"Too bad so many never get the message of motor maturity: A real man doesn't need loud pipes to prove his manhood."
He thinks of it as noise pollution. I would transcribe the whole editorial, but...

 

Glad I live in Ohio....where exhaust, intakes, headers, tints, and everything else is still legal!

Suckers!