is there a whp and torque number that seem to just work for the Mini on the track and autoX. Where do the ddiminishing returns set in. Is 260 hp that much faster than 230 etc. Original 260 Cobras were very balanced cars (or so I am told) the 427s were beasts to get around the track (or so I was told) Any one got a handle on this?

 

and the answer is always more!

Matt

 

That has been my theory but I'm running out of things to do.....no turbo or NO2 in my future. The car is alread pretty damn fast and yes I still want more.....I'm just wondering where it stops? "Onasled" seems to have it going on

 

I'm doing the SC. I bought one from a JCW upgrade on eBay, I just arranged for the porting today.... There's intake work you can do, and making sure that it's all blended to work together is good as well. There are little things, IC sprayer, water injection etc.
Then start going on a diet. Droping about 15 lbs or so is like adding a HP... Talk to TonyB about that....

Matt

 

I talked to peter about the SC mod but I cancelled it when I had some personal issues and lost my enthusiasm for awhile....I'm back!

I am very interested in your findings on the SC I have heard as much as 15 hp gains. Intake is the other engine mod.......WMS claims about 6 hp for this mod. That about does it for the engine. The Quaife/clutch/flywheel mods are in the hoppper but I am getting conflicting input as to effectivenesss. Keep me in the loop especially on the SC mod

Thanks

 

The best way you can go is to ensure you can maintain whatever hp level your car can achieve. What I mean is, the MINI is classic for pulling timing and adding fuel to (theoretically) quench knock as air intake temp, coolant temp and oil temp rises.

You should add a larger capacity radiator, external oil cooler, and a better airflow entry system.

This way you'll keep your 260hp all day instead of 300hp, then 250hp then 150hp....

 

Has anyone actually seen the benefits from these? I'm starting to do logging, but timing isn't the first signal I'll be adding.... But with good timing logged, seeing the retardation would be easy.....

Matt

 

The CarChip E/X will log timing (and other cool things), and chart it/them quite nicely. If you wish to borrow mine, let me know. Since I haven't done any power-adder mods recently, it's been sitting in the house. It also clears codes, which is nice...

http://www.davisnet.com/drive/produc....asp?pnum=8221

http://www.davisnet.com/news/press/d...ip12-15-03.asp

 

I have an EX, but the 5 second rep rate is just too slow for any serious logging...... That's most of a 0-60 run......

Matt

 

You are correct about that! The charting does some assumptions (extrapolations) between those 5 sec intervals. Oh well... A nice long weekend to all!

 

Is there an update on your SC mod?

 

I'm no expert but a friend of mine who's a very good canyon carver once told me that most people never get close to pushing their car to their absolute limits - if you can get close to that as you can and still need more power then consider upgrading.
He drove my car when it was stock and pushed it harder than I ever would dare attempt, and he stated that he could push his honda much harder. It's mostly skill that will give you the advantage - I would invest in that first.

 

I am....it is a two pronged attack....I am working on my driving and my car at the same time......I do appreciate the post as I have given that advice myself many times.

 

It's hard to define how much too much is, but I would venture to say that chassis-wise our cars can handle just about as much as you can possibly throw at them. They're much stiffer than most cars, with thousands of spot welds and all. The real limitation would probably therefore be weight and balance-related, not power-related. If you put a heavier engine in, it may be beyond the capabilities of the car [somewhat narrow stance, short wheelbase, etc.]. Otherwise, the chassis is as good or better than any other FWD car I can think of. [FWD, though, is also somewhat limiting the dynamics because of the whole steering with the driven wheel thing...]

 

There is a point where you have too much HP for your two wheels, then you'd want an AWD conversion!

I want to see a mini with two engines, on driving the front, one driving the back, would balance weight, and give a huge chunk of power, but imagine the engineering!

 

"Optimum power for the MINI?"

The answer depends on your intended use.
For an all out dragstrip monster: get as much power as you can and the widest stickiest rubber that will fit. Turbo and NOS welcomed.

For a dedicated track MINI: about 230+HP is good but you need to lighten everything and more to get the best power to weight ratio and you need to get the suspension alignment tuned for the track along with the right suspension upgrades and track tires/big brakes.

For heavy autocross use: about 210+ to 230 HP is usually more than enough power, but you have to find balance in suspension and the best lightest wheels and sticky rubber to help.

For a street car and daily driver: A stock MC or MCS will do just fine and for occasional autocross and track will still do fine. Light performance wheels don't hurt (the stock runflats are so heavy).

To get the most out of your available power on ANY MINI:
You need driving skill- first and foremost. If you get an excellent driving instructor at any of the major driving schools and have that person in a stock MCS vs you in your modded MCS on a track you WILL be impressed how well that stock MCS measures up to your MINI no matter how good you think you are. I have seen this so many times it isn't a secret or a rare happening.

The same holds true for musical instruments. My son's violin teacher on a begninner instrument sounds really good compared to me playing a really good student instrument- doesn't matter which song. Skill is what matters.

So if you really want to get the "Most" out of your available power- think on improving your skill level before you do anything else.

I also happen to think that loosing extra weight always is good, and especially having lighter rims and good soft tires helps- I don't see which wheels you are using.

 

I guess where I'm going with this is around a track is it really worth the money to get another 10- 15 hp once your over 200-115? Are the times gong to come down....will you get "dropped" on the straights?

 

.

 

I totally agree as I have seen this myself live and in person .....I am working on my skills...but as I said it is a two pronged attack...one for skills and one for car

 

I've read that hotrodders (v-8 type) use vacuum pumps on the crank case to get more horses on the wheels. Would that be viable here on a MINI? The idea is to remove the air in there which at 5000+ RPM is quite restrictive on the crank. Anyone heard of this? Does it even make sense?
dan

 

IF you have about 230 HP you will have enough potential power except on tracks that have very long straights and long sweeping turns which favor more HP cars.

The KEY to any straight is to enter the straight with more speed by setting up the turn or element before the straight. So by driving very very well right before the straight you will enter the straight carrying more speed and hold more speed for the entire straight.

Thus, you need to think how will you be able to allow for more speed coming out of that turn? Do you have enough tire grip to get the power to the road? Check out which tires you have- for track use it is critical to have tires of the right compound and tread depth.
Do you need a limited slip differential to allow more power to be transferred to the wheels? It does help, especially when coming out of corners with higher rpms and you want as much traction as possible (assuming your tires are working and not slipping).

And do you have suspension with enough negative camber to allow you to use your tires to their fullest? Front camber plates and track alignment will help to make your tires work to deliver power to the ground.

The problem with modding a car and learning as you go is that the car can be changed and improved quickly; but the driver will have to adjust to those changes to obtain the control needed to make use of the upgrades. The best situation is to keep the car the same over a long period of time and get to spend alot of time driving that car under varied courses making small changes as you go.

 

The increased horsepower is from improved ring sealing from the increased pressure differential across the rings. Alternately, you can just crank up the boost:smile:.

And despite diminishing returns, there is no real maximum horsepower because you can always add more and let traction control sort it out like with these adjustable Racelogic units: http://www.racelogic.co.uk/?show=Tra...l-How_it_Works
Even a 427 Cobra would be perfectly manageable using modern technology.

More power will always give you more acceleration at higher speeds, even if acceleration at low speeds is limited by traction.

 

As in most cars I think its about balance. Faster straight line speed isnt always going to get you around an auto-x track faster. Yet if you have a couple track days during the summer good auto-x power might not get it done either.

The best mod I've seen over and over, on almost every level of amateur driver is a driving school. The time you take off of your runs, not to mention the level of confidence you get out of a school is one of the most valuable "mods" you can make.

I highly suggest that you spend a weekend (or week if you can afford it) at a good driving school, and then consider what you want to do with you car. Rather than looking at it as a two pronged attack, look at it as a two staged attack. Your view of what you want to get out of your car will almost surely change after you get out of school.

 

Is there really ever enough?

 

Sounds like you would like the Jeep Hurricane concept. I saw it and must say it is amazing. A turn radius of 0 two Hemi engines, and it looks awesome. Too bad they will never make it