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Manic Motorsport brings us N18 owners OBD II Tuning! Solution is finally here!

Drivetrain (Cooper S) MINI Cooper S (R56) intakes, exhausts, pulleys, headers, throttle bodies, and any other modifications to the Cooper S drivetrain.

Manic Motorsport brings us N18 owners OBD II Tuning! Solution is finally here!

  #2401  
Old 03-15-2019, 05:48 AM
ridinDirty
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Understand, I have asked the same question!
All I know is if I don't turn off traction control I get the smell of my clutch and rpms climb due to my clutch slipping. Not sure myself.
 
  #2402  
Old 03-15-2019, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by ridinDirty View Post
Understand, I have asked the same question!
All I know is if I don't turn off traction control I get the smell of my clutch and rpms climb due to my clutch slipping. Not sure myself.
Is this in a straight line situation?
I wonder if this is an indirect result of the DTC maybe becoming confused if the front wheels are spinning???

I am assuming that you are pressing and holding the DTC button to turn all of the traction controls off. So, another thought. Have you tried just pressing the DTC button quickly and not holding it down? On my MINI the word “Traction” shows up in the Tach. I find that works well on the track as it cuts down the agressivness of the traction control. It may help with your issue.
 
  #2403  
Old 03-15-2019, 06:50 AM
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The DTC doesn't cause the clutch to slip. It just doesn't prevent it from happening in the same manner that it prevents wheelspin. Sensors on each wheel compare the speed to the other wheels. It makes the necessary corrections when it determines that a wheel has lost traction. It's more difficult to get wheelspin in the higher gears because the gear ratio reduces the torque available at the wheels in favor of speed. I am not aware of sensors that make a similar comparison of RPM on either side of the clutch. When the engine is running strong and the clutch is marginal, that's when it can slip.
 
  #2404  
Old 03-15-2019, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by ridinDirty View Post
Understand, I have asked the same question!
All I know is if I don't turn off traction control I get the smell of my clutch and rpms climb due to my clutch slipping. Not sure myself.
Originally Posted by SPYECAR View Post
The DTC doesn't cause the clutch to slip. It just doesn't prevent it from happening in the same manner that it prevents wheelspin. Sensors on each wheel compare the speed to the other wheels. It makes the necessary corrections when it determines that a wheel has lost traction. It's more difficult to get wheelspin in the higher gears because the gear ratio reduces the torque available at the wheels in favor of speed. I am not aware of sensors that make a similar comparison of RPM on either side of the clutch. When the engine is running strong and the clutch is marginal, that's when it can slip.
I was thinking that was the case; the DTC has nothing to do with the clutch. But it seems that in ridinDirty’s case that the DTC is doing something to, maybe, cause a wheel or wheels to drag. Truly just guess here, But I did have a problem with the DTC on my S when I put the BBK in. The eLSD part of the DTC would be overly agressive and over-brake the inside wheel in turns and the wheel would literally drag through the turn. I then found that MINI does a modification to the DTC computer program for when the JCW sport brakes (the Brembos) are installed. I made that change and things are better now. Not saying that is ridinDirty’s issue; just that modifying these MINIs may have unintended consequences. For example, does the added power, with a LSD installed cause “confusion” in the DTC system? Could there be some torque steer that is causing the DTC thinks is the car going into a spin and the DTC is applying the rear brakes to correct the spin, causing drag on the clutch? I don’t know. Interesting issue, though...
 
  #2405  
Old 03-15-2019, 04:53 PM
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I can't say that I feel anything out the normal, such as brakes being applied to front or back. Its just as soon as it starts making power the rpms fly up and that lovely smell of burning clutch come on fast.
Mine is an 07so
- to do a burn out I have to disconnect one of my wheel speed sensors otherwise the computer shuts the throttle, if I fail the system then I'm good to go. (found this out at the drag strip)
I was told that is an 07 only issue.
-I don't have any indication that says traction when I press my button, it just lights up the triangle on my tack. I have tried holding my button in for 5 seconds, just a quick push etc to try and get my burnout issue to work but never tried any of those "secret" button pushing to see if my clutch will not slip any different.

I'm not complaining, I just hit the button and go... Nice to have to much HP....lol
 
  #2406  
Old 03-15-2019, 05:59 PM
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Does the DTC control the brake on the slipping wheel.... and that braking is loading the clutch more??
 
  #2407  
Old 03-15-2019, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by ridinDirty View Post
I can't say that I feel anything out the normal, such as brakes being applied to front or back. Its just as soon as it starts making power the rpms fly up and that lovely smell of burning clutch come on fast.
Mine is an 07so
- to do a burn out I have to disconnect one of my wheel speed sensors otherwise the computer shuts the throttle, if I fail the system then I'm good to go. (found this out at the drag strip)
I was told that is an 07 only issue.
-I don't have any indication that says traction when I press my button, it just lights up the triangle on my tack. I have tried holding my button in for 5 seconds, just a quick push etc to try and get my burnout issue to work but never tried any of those "secret" button pushing to see if my clutch will not slip any different.

I'm not complaining, I just hit the button and go... Nice to have to much HP....lol
I had an ‘07 too. It didn’t have DTC, just the traction control. It seemed that it would just cut power when the wheels slipped. No braking, the way I remember it. I tested it a lot in the snow. I remember going to a ski area and wondering if it would let me get to that area when it almost slowed me to a stop. I also seem to remember the button was an on-off switch, like yours. Of course none of thiis was at the level of power and torque you are at. Not trying to ”fix it” just wondering. Interesting....
 

Last edited by Eddie07S; 03-15-2019 at 07:00 PM.
  #2408  
Old 03-15-2019, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by ridinDirty View Post
I can't say that I feel anything out the normal, such as brakes being applied to front or back. Its just as soon as it starts making power the rpms fly up and that lovely smell of burning clutch come on fast.
Mine is an 07so
- to do a burn out I have to disconnect one of my wheel speed sensors otherwise the computer shuts the throttle, if I fail the system then I'm good to go. (found this out at the drag strip)
I was told that is an 07 only issue.
-I don't have any indication that says traction when I press my button, it just lights up the triangle on my tack. I have tried holding my button in for 5 seconds, just a quick push etc to try and get my burnout issue to work but never tried any of those "secret" button pushing to see if my clutch will not slip any different.

I'm not complaining, I just hit the button and go... Nice to have to much HP....lol
Get a light flywheel, LSD, and monster turbo --- no burn out even possible, with or without traction controls. Gives you time to cope with the extreme torque steer from all that power. I hardly ever disable my '07's ASC, maybe 'cause of the OS Giken? It only slips when I slip it at launch.
 
  #2409  
Old 03-16-2019, 01:28 PM
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oldbrokenwind, nice to hear from you again.... if you unplug one of you wheel sensors, she will burn out just fine. I have been thinking about cutting the sensor feed back wire and running it to a toggle switch...lol beats unplugging it for the drag strip.

I added the LSD, not sure if its playing apart in all this...
 
  #2410  
Old 03-16-2019, 02:45 PM
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Which LSD do you have?
 
  #2411  
Old 03-16-2019, 03:27 PM
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Quaife
 
  #2412  
Old 03-17-2019, 06:43 AM
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  #2413  
Old 03-17-2019, 10:38 AM
ridinDirty
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Eddie07S - I'm not sure I'm reading your add-ons right but you track 15" but have big brakes ? I was wanting to put 15 slicks on mine but I have big brakes is why I'm asking.
Sorry for going off topic
 
  #2414  
Old 03-17-2019, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ridinDirty View Post
Eddie07S - I'm not sure I'm reading your add-ons right but you track 15" but have big brakes ? I was wanting to put 15 slicks on mine but I have big brakes is why I'm asking.
Sorry for going off topic
Very fair question...
Wilwood has several BBKs for the Gen I and II MINI Coopers, and TCE Performance Products has some of their own variations of these BBK which makes for a wide range of BBK products for the car. I have the smaller of BBKs that they have available and it is made in two rotor sizes, the 11.75” and the 12.2”. The calipers are radially mounted and only use a spacer to accommodate the larger rotor. There are a number of aftermarket 15” wheels that fit very nicely over the Wilwood BBK with the 11.75” rotors and there are a number of 16” wheels, including MINI wheels, that will fit over the BBK setup with the 12.2” rotor. The Wilwood BBK as marketed uses a 0.81” thick rotor (basically the same as the MINI rotors). TCE markets a variation of that kit with a 1” thick rotor, which I have gone to because of the level of braking required at Watkins Glen. For that track, I run the 12.2” rotors and 17” wheels to maximize brake size and cooling. For short tracks, like Lime Rock Park, I run the 11.75” rotors with my 15” wheels to get the gearing advantage of the smaller wheels and tires, and the reduced unsprung and rotational weight.

If I can find it, I’ll post a link to a picture of my setup.
 
  #2415  
Old 03-17-2019, 03:19 PM
ridinDirty
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I bought mine from TCE as well but at the time I wasn't thinking about going to smaller wheels. Sounds like you have a very nice setup and well thought out.
 
  #2416  
Old 03-17-2019, 06:44 PM
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Thanks.

I have suffered with brake issues over the years on the R56 because there is no way to get cooling to them. WGI is brutal on brakes, with a lot of braking zones that are down hill and 40 to 50 mph changes in speed. 15" wheels trap a lot of heat in the rotors and caliper, whereas the 17" wheels allow the rotors to vent better. I had thought about going with TCE's 13" kit (not the Wilwood 13" kit) but I would loose the option to use the smaller wheels and there is a lot of weight to deal with.

Here is a thread that goes through this in detail with that Wilwood BBK and 15" wheels:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...lwood-bbk.html

Here is a post in that thread with good pictures of a typical fitup:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ml#post4427057

Hope this helps.
 
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