Since you did not reference the site where all this information came from - here it is - http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/waterinjection.html

Interesting site.

 

Thats the one, it does let you know what all needs to go into a good setup.

 

100% meth cools IAT's better than 50/50. It's not "pissing your money away"; it'll also add power, more than 70/30 (Power AND cooling. Isn't that a good thing?). To say that 70/30 is as good as 100% meth isn't true, at least for IAT's. BUT, and it's a big BUT, you need a GOOD tune to tie it all together. Not one you throw together on the fly by reading about it on the internet, but one done by someone who knows tuning inside and out. Meth adds another factor to the equation. So does E85, for that matter.

100% meth CAN and IS run perfectly safely in the MINI, with big performance gains, but it's an order of magnitude more involved, and you really need to work with someone who knows how to set it up properly--both with the delivery, and the tune. You also don't want to be running 100% meth and have the tank run out on you, that's a disaster in the making. 100% meth isn't for everyone, including me, and probably not for you, but that doesn't make it worse than 50/50, or 70/30, it's just a matter of getting it set up properly, at which point it'll outperform both, depending on your goals.

50/50 is great if your just after cooling, it's relatively safe and easy to work with--it's not going to burn like meth. You can run it without a tune. Go beyond that, and you're better off working with someone with some experience, rather than trying to piece it together off the internet.

To be honest, I don't get it. You're playing around with so many variables--various alcohols, E85, and the Sprintex, along with various pulleys and trying to tune this concoction on your own. Good luck getting it all sorted out. In the meantime, maybe exercise a bit of caution on the advice?

IMHO, if you're going to run anything greater than 50/50, PLEASE go to someone who knows what they're doing.

 

That's not a bad site, but you have to look at the what they do day in and day out. They build single and dual stage kits for bikes. The kits aren't even progressive. The small electric pump used, the 440, is out of an esspresso machine, and they use a power supply to run it because they haven't just re-wound the thing for 12vdc?! Stick a 120/230VAC pump on a bike because you can't re-wind a transformer? Not cutting edge.

Some of the info is good, some of it very outdated or not relevant to other applications.

There are other manufacturers in the industry which pioneered injection on cars and make many components form scratch for the application of water/alcohol injection. Do your research to be well informed.

 

D1ck, there is a difference between posting info from other web sites and understanding that info. I hope people look for modding help other places then your posts. It's not a game it is real money they are spending.

 

my car runs peachy on 100% meth. all 271 hp of it.

 

Somewhat well said CCT1. I have tested multiple mixes on the dyno down at TOBZ long before the SPRINTEX and long before my engine went south. Guess what running more than 60% did pretty much NOTHING but richen the AFR. Yes I could have leaned the fuel maps under boost to compensate but,what happens if the tank runs out? The answer to that is in your above post.
I kept running the 60% mix the whole time the car was on gasolene, but when I switched over to E85, I tried running only 10% alcohol and needed to change my W/M jet down a couple sizes. The IAT's using the smaller jet and more water where actually COOLER than running the 60% with the big jet. When the car gets back on the road, I will be changing the W/M setup and running my 60% mix again because I'm not going back to E85 for a while.
Can you run 100%? YES, Can you do it without a lot more tuning? NO, Will you go lean enough to blow your motor if you are tuned for 100% and you run out? It wont happen instantly but YES you will go lean enough to cause serrious dammage. That is one of the main reasons I dont recommend it to anyone!

 

Good for you Colin, somebody give this guy a cookie!

 

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funny how the statement that 100% meth is worse for IAT cooling has now gone by the wayside.

 

I said that it wasnt needed, not that it wouldnt cool an intake charge. The water has more of a bennefit than the alcohol, for those that prefer to cool more than just the air in the manifold and still lower the burn temprature with the alcohol it does have. Running a higher concentration of water is safer if you unexpectedly run out, and that is supposed to be the purpose of theese systems "SAFTY" not BOOM "I guess it was EMPTY!"

If you want to run straight alcohol, GO FOR IT! The 1-2 HP you get over running a safer mix that dosent mess up your AFR, is just not worth the results of running the car lean when you run out, or the system malfunctions.

Just my oppinion but, I WILL NEVER ENCOURAGE THE USE OF 100% ALCOHOL IN THEESE SYSTEMS!!! People make the systems, therefore THEY WILL break, and problems WILL HAPPEN, why chance it?

 

Interesting thread... Just a quick question for ****. Have you found out why your engine went south? Would be interesting to hear what actually caused it.

 

*READER BEWARE, SOME TUNING ADVICE ON THIS THREAD MAY OR MAY NOT BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE HEALTH OF YOUR MOTOR*

2cents

 

1-2 HP? What poppycock dost thou spout? Where did you get this figure. On an untuned JCW, running 100% meth netted an average of +2-3 deg timing on the track over 50/50, with a stock tune on a stock engine. If I were to tune my JCW to run on 100% meth, I would gain far more. The people that make the systems encourage the use of anything from 50/50 to 100% meth, depending on your application. Do you think you know more than Jeff Howerton of Howerton Engineering or Richard Lamb of Aquamist? People run 100% all day long with not one single issue. You probably break your systems running denatured alcohol or isopropyl alcohol. Aquamist's pumps are designed to run 100% meth with no issues, and I'm sure all the other companies' pumps can too.

And by the way, you said that "water has far better cooling properties than alcohol" and that "the alcohol was there for atomisation and anti-freeze properties". Both statements are INCORRECT. Water cools cylinder temps better than meth, but meth will cool IAT more than water. And the meth still cools the cylinders down. You can get any mixture to atomise properly, assuming you choose the correct jet size. The meth isn't there to simply aid atomisation.

 

So basiclly tuning for 100% on a dd or anything close to it, is ill advised simply because, if you run out, you have to be way to careful driving the car, accidently open it up and uhh-ohh.

Since we're off topic anyway, as far as the street goes I'd rather use a 25 or 50 shot of NOS than meth as far as power goes, and that small of a shot would be just as safe if not safer. At least if you're running low or out and can't use it, you're tuned rich. (unless you're using the Byteronik F/A and can change tunes whenever you want.)

 

Then there is the new solution coming that allows for detection of no Meth and Automatic map switching.....

 

And that is the setup that might get me to 100% meth. Take that out of the equation, and I'm probably there.

Another advantage of 100% meth: clean valves, prevent all that carbon buildup. How nice would it be never to have to worry about that? Take the danger of running out of meth out of the equation, and 100% meth may (actually probably would) lead to longer engine life. Who would've thunk?

 

I heard the new solution unlocked some hidden torque down low on a stock bottom-end, M45, BVH, Super Radical cam, and on 100% METH

 

The rest of that is incorrect. If you are running meth and you know what you are doing or you take it to somebody that does so you are running it the proper way YOU WILL BLOW YOUR MOTOR if you go WFO with a empty tank. Your AFR's should not be the same as 91 if you are running meth for performance. They should be leaner. Your timing should also be higher out the top. If you are not doing these things you should not be running it for performance because once again, guess what your doing it wrong. You arent using it to maximize performance of your car. Ive tuned EVOs, STis, Hondas, blah blah blah that got a minimum of 30hp with out touching the boost. This was only using the meth for what its used for, so increasing timing and leaning out the fuel. Would the motors have gone south if they run out of meth. YES. Did they know this? YES. Did they care? NOPE. Why? Because they knew the risks. They wanted the performance that meth could give them.

I like how you say your not going to run E85 anymore like its what destroyed your engine. YOU destroyed your engine because you have no idea what you are doing. I've been giving you all kinds of free advice. You need to go get a tuning class or something before you try to become the resident tuner at NAM. You are just going to end up hurting more then helping.

 

What part of this says that I use meth for making power? NONE OF IT!

Its funny how all of the supporters of a certian "buisness" feel the need to jump in and start an OFF TOPIC arguement the second somebody mentions something that isnt their way of doing things.

Yes I use W/M for COOLING that is what the systems where designed for, and they are good at it. I could care less if i could change my tune to run 100% alcohol and gain a couple HP with the risk of failure when the tank runs out. And YES it is ONLY A COUPLE HP, atleast that's all I got out of my setup. Last I looked cooling the internals of the engine was verry important to overall performance, is it not? From what you people have said about this S/C, you shuld be extatic that I am telling people to use W/M as a cooling aid, and not add to the list of possible failures.

Now lets get back to this threads TOPIC, a discussion about the SPRINTEX S/C. If you are here to make arguements out of what other people do because they arent YOUR way, STFU and go troll somewhere else.

 

Yep spun a rod bearing. Lots af abuse on stock parts, and running a tune that wasn't perfected yet where the cause. Its what happens when you lean out and dont notice it right away.

 

What and whose car have you been tuning on while yours is broken? Does it or them have a Sprintex too? Exactly how many Minis have you personally tuned?

Thanks, just trying to discern where you have been getting your data from!

 

Let me get this straight.

You give your own advice about something that you are not an expert about, in fact blowing up your engine during your experience, to people that could misinterpret that you are an expert.

Then, you dismiss the advice of people that, in fact, ARE experts and have A LOT of experience with using and tuning MINIs with meth.

Then you accuse them of trolling because their position is not the same as yours. (pot calling kettle black?)

Then you are complaining they are out of topic when, in fact, you are the one that brought up water/meth injection in the first place?

Are you insane?

Wait, let me get the thumbs up smiley so my post doesn't seem confrontational. Here it is.

 

Guys, knock it off and get this back on track. Start a new thread about the benefits (or not) of methanol and move on. Or don't. Whatever you choose, stop this bickering and off-topic banter here.

 

Dear mister moderator, I believe that this thread is on track as the subject of Meth was brought up by the OP. He choose to bring this subject up in HIS OWN THREAD and giving BAD advice along the way. The good people that know what they are doing with these cars are just trying to help out the mini community but NAM doesn't seem to like helping out. All you guys do is take posts away and pretend like nothings wrong. <edited by moderator> I also find it a coincidence that I find your location is Colorado..... I don't really care if you boot me for this post because unfortunately I don't find this Site informative anymore, it really is a joke. I just come on here now to see what the BS status is now......