One thing you guys are leaving out is feel.

The blue inserts you see in the B&M kit replace the big rubber grommets that bolt the shfter to the body. Not only to they raise it up, thus preserving the dust cover but they impart a very precise feel to the shifter.

Before when you reached the end of the shift you hit rubber, Now there is no flex in the shfter and the shift ends solidly.

It's the best part of a smart and high quality design.

PS: I'll sell anybody my old slip-on metal nipple short shifter - CHEAP!!

 

The B&M seems like a good choice to me... It seems a pretty good price too. Around 125.00 the standard?

 

I've been using the B&M shifter for two weeks. Very nice.

 

There's a lot to be said about the Alta short shifter, for one it's the ONLY one on the market thats adjustable. That alone is pretty valuable when you look the amount of customization that is available.

Certainly worth considering:

http://outmotoring.com/alta_short_shift_kit.html

 

...I guess the only negative to the Alta is that is does NOT accomodate the stock or Whalen ****....and it is priced higher than the B&M/ProMINI and the Rogue/MINI Mania....

It seems to me that you're not getting much by paying 125+ for the B&M shifter when you can just get the Mania/Rogue adapter that does the same thing for half the cost. They both have the fixed 20% reduction in throw.

Just some thoughts...

 

Let me start off saying this is an unbiased look at the various choices in shifters. The info has been gleaned from various threads on this forum. It is solely my opinion....yours may differ! I'm not flaming anyone. I just want to point out facts and ask some questions.In other words, no arguments, please! If I've mis-stated any facts just let me know so. I too am in the shifter market, so I'm trying to understand these things as much as possible before I make a decision. You dealers commenting here, let's drop the sales pitches and come up with some straight answers

>>They both have the fixed 20% reduction in throw.<<

The ProMini and B&M are advertising 30% reduction (the add-on link type are only 20%). How much reduction can be gotten on the Alta before there's a clearance problem with the dust cover? Also, is the Alta's adjustable reduction done by sliding the pivot ball unit up or down the shaft? If it is, how is it locked in place? If it's just set screws, then it's possibly not as solid of unit as the other two, as these screws can work loose over time. Yeah, I know, it's a long shot....but it's still a possibilty.

>> I think the stock shift height is perfect and do not want to reduce it.<<

The reduction of the shift height is part of the overall reduction from the shifter. A shifter like B&M offers might only be a 20% or 25% reduction if it were the same height as the stock setup.

>>It seems to me that you're not getting much by paying 125+ for the B&M shifter when you can just get the Mania/Rogue adapter that does the same thing for half the cost.<<

In my opinion your extra money is going on, in this case, is the integrity of a shifter that's one piece and a shorter throw. The add on extension will always have the possibility of loosening up and coming off. I'm sorry, but when it's my life on the line, I'll put the extra money into a system that has less possiblity of coming apart when I really need it.

 

>>You dealers commenting here, let's drop the sales pitches and come up with some straight answers

If my responses came across as a sales pitch i'm sorry, wasn't intended to be, simply responding to questions asked.

 

...ditto, just opening up the discussion to one shifter that I think has a lot of merit, the Alta short shift kit.

The percentages that I quoted (B&M and Rogue) are from the last round of research that I did nearly 3 months ago, they may have changed or I may have mis understated a spec, sorry.

To answer the question regarding the adjustability on the Alta unit, it does adjust at the fulcrum, using a set screw to lock it in place. The throw is adjustable from 1 to 45%, which I tend to think is pretty valuable.

Your points regarding the screws loosening up is valid, as the Rogue and the Alta both rely on them to keep the extension/fulcrum in position. There's always loc tite and brute strength to tighten...

BTW, the Mania one has one set screw, the Rogue has three screws with a large rubber shrink tube to keep the screws in place should the loc-tite wear out; and it's cheaper than the Mania unit.


Anyway, to each there own, that's why there's so may choices in life, and so many products to choose from, thank heavens. I wouldn't have a business in there weren't :smile: Life is good, enjoy your ride.

Hope you find the product that suites your needs.

 

Thanks for the replies guys. Didn't mean to step on any toes, if I did. Just started catching whiffs of the "mine's better than yours" comments. Not that these are bad as long as there's support given as to why. :smile: I know it's easy to slip a bit when you truly believe in the product your selling.

Outmotoring, what about the dust cover question? Can the Alta be adjusted to full reduction and still use the dust cover?
A few other questions pop in my head. At full reduction, how much does the shifter drop below stock?
Is the shaft stout enough for the shaft adjustment piece to be drilled and pinned once the ideal setting is found?
Also, if the adjustibility is kept, can the shifter be adjusted in the car, or does it have to be removed to perform this task?


Also, a question to any that have had experience with these things.... My S has a very stiff reverse gate, as do most it seems. How much is your leverage affected by these reduced height shifters? Is reverse still obtainable without having to resort to a two handed death grip? :smile:

Casey, I haven't forgotten you. I've already researched and know everything I need to about the B&M/Promini shifter. Just trying to get a handle on the Alta before I make my decision to purchase one or the other.

Thanks to all of you for putting up with this interrogation!

 

>>There's a lot to be said about the Alta short shifter, for one it's the ONLY one on the market thats adjustable. That alone is pretty valuable when you look the amount of customization that is available.

hi I surfed here from other forums about short shifters and since this is the beginning of my research phase, I am not understanding some things said.
As example, why is it good to have adjustablity more than 30%? The person who made this statement talked about the nature of the customizing of our cars, is this adjustment something that would be more helpful for an autoX car as compared to daily driver? Would someone please explain. Thank you.

 

>>>why is it good to have adjustablity more than 30%?<<

The higher the percentage the shorter the throw. This means quicker shifts with less arm movement. The downside is that when shortening the upper part of the shifter and lengthening the lower part it increases the amount of effort to move it. Depending on the arm strength of the driver this may or may not be a concern.

>>>...... talked about the nature of the customizing of our cars...<<<

The two customizing features of most short shifter kits (except the ones where a link is added to your stock shifter) are a lower mounting of the shift ball and the ability to change shift ***** away from the stock setup (options dependent on the kit you buy)

>>>is this adjustment something that would be more helpful for an autoX car as compared to daily driver?<<<

It's definitely a performance oriented enhancement, though there are some cosmetic changes, too. If as "daily driver", you mean not pushed too often, and never getting track time, I don't know if I'd recommend one of these, unless you feel the cosmetic changes are worth the money.

 

It's been a few days so I'm putting the bump on these questions from my previous post. Anyone who's had experience with the product care to comment?

Can the Alta be adjusted to full reduction and still use the dust cover? If not, what's the greatest reduction you can get with the cover on?
At full reduction, how much does the shifter drop below stock height?
Is the shaft stout enough for the shaft adjustment piece to be drilled and pinned once the ideal setting is found?
Also, if the adjustibility is kept, can the shifter be adjusted in the car, or does it have to be removed to perform this task?

 

I decided to just suck it up and get the B&M unit. I am not too pleased with the fact that it reduces the shifter height, but that is the only negative I can see. True performance cars like the new Porsche GT and ralley cars always have the shifter as close to the steering wheel as possible. What difference does it make if the shift throw is shorter but that is contrasted by the fact that it takes me longer to reach the shifter. I will be a 95% satisfied customer (as long as I don't snap that retainer ring).

 

Thanks for all the info, guys. I think that this is going to be my next functional mod. Is there a how-to posted anywhere, or can someone give me an idea what the install involves? Can I do it on ramps, or do I need jackstands (which I don't have, so in other words, do I need to pay a pro to do it)? How hard is it compared to, say, an air intake? Are sockets and extensions enough, or are there other tools required? I don't mind buying the tools, but I'm pretty new to mucking about with mechanical parts.

Chris

_________________

 

Instructions are available on the bm site - bmracing.com i think. We also include the instructions in the kits.

 

Thanks. Yikes! I can't believe they claim only 30 minutes for the install! Looks like it would take me at least 36 hours, ending up with a tow to the dealer.

Is 30 minutes a reasonable amount of time to expect this install to take at a BMW-capable shop? I want to do this mod, but I don't want to end up spending over $200.

 

I'd think it'd probably take 1 to 2 hours - depending on the amount of difficulty the tech runs into...based on what I've been reading in other people's posts who've done the install. There also seems to be a risk of breaking a retaining ring during the reassembly, due to the fact that B&M's instructions don't seem to be accurate for re-assembly.

I'm concerned by this - since I DO want to have the mod done, but DON'T want to speand an extra $120 bucks for new parts from MINI should anything get broken trying to follow B&M's wacky install instructions.

Didn't someone say they were going to put up a 'How-to' on this? - so that either we or our 'mechanic-of-choice' could have somewhere to turn for some advice before starting the install?

- - Michael

 

To keep from breaking the retaining ring it is suggested that you remove the entire assembly and do the work on the work bench. (Both uninstall and install) This saves working on the shifter at odd angles and with excess binding from the cables. You'll find it much easier install over all. Go through the directions a couple of times and you'll find the point where you should remove the assembly instead of the shifter. I've done two of these so far, one in my car and one outside. (Mechanics have done the others) By far, the easiest method, is to remove the entire assembly first. I broke my retaining ring installing into my car. It has not happened since with the removal method.

 

Thanks for the advice, Minibeast! - I'll keep that in mind... How long did it take you to do it, using the 'removal method'?

Cheers - - Michael :smile:

 

Give yourself about 2 hours. If you try to rush, that is when you'll make mistakes. Besides, this can be really fun once you get into it. The actual removal of the assembly only adds maybe 5 minutes, it's getting past all the other stuff that wears you out. Take your time, maybe havea bud over to help hold stuff out of your way and you'll do just fine.

 

I just had the B&M short shifter installed yesterday with my Whalen **** and I absoulutely love the set up. No downside at all, it is perfect. I like the shorter hight and the throws and the Whalen is so much better than the stock ****.

**** $150
B&M $140
instal $140
total $430

not cheap but I really like it.