The IE Fixed camber plates add about 1.5 negative front camber IIRC. The rear Helix arms are adjustable, so as much as you want. I have 1.5 right now in the back I think.

If you run 15's you're going to have trouble getting power to the ground, there aren't a lot of wide tire options that don't look silly (High profile) for 15" rims. It's hard enough to find 16" tires! I personally like the 16's, My wheels only weigh 12.5 lbs each, that's 15+ lbs lighter than OEM S - Lites on each corner.

Let me know if you have any other questions .

 

I don't have any personal experience with Megan, but a few that have them have told me that they're a bit bouncy. I haven't had that same experience with my Cross Coilovers, but i'll be the first to admit, they're nearly double the cost of the Megan's.

 

I disagree, increasing total HP available by 20%+ adds a huge competitive advantage on the track. The MINI's suspension stock is pretty good, brakes could use a little work, but nothing a new set of pads and some fluid can't handle. My first mod on that car would be a pulley. For 250-300 installed it's one of the most cost effective mods out there.

 

It depends on whether the OP is doing all of the work himself. $4k will be blown a lot sooner if he's off-shoring the install work. Intake, exhaust, pulley, tune, camber plates, rear swaybar, wheels, tires, brake pads + fluid... Where is the money left for the head? I wouldn't do a head before any of those, myself.

I've neglected the brakes myself as I'm focused on teh autocross, but I've had them fading on the street and it's the next thing on my agenda.

Plus last I've seen, no head on the market increases horsepower by 20% – you're sitting 30whp prettier than me with the head, header, and probably more face/dyno time with Jan. That's more on par with a 10% increase, head-wise. (Nitpicking.) But yes, the added power is great. So are the CROSS coilovers. But there goes another $2k. I thought we were taking into consideration some semblance of a budget.

FWIW, I think 15" wheels should be considered. There are plenty of options in the 225/45 or /50 range that fit the bill. That's for track use only, I wouldn't run a 15" for summer time, aesthetics alone.

 

A head with a tune will net between 25 and 35HP (Aka the 20% number). There have actually been quite a few cases on these forums of people that have seen huge gains with just a head.

I'm not as convinced about 15's, there are very few BBK's that will fit over 15's if he decides to do that in the future, it starts to become silly once you get to 16's, the same 15 inch wheels only weigh a pound, maybe two less. 225/50/R15's have a 4.4 inch sidewall, at that point you're going to have issues with sidewall stiffness and handling is going to take a hit. I'm actually dropping down to 215/40/R16's (3.4" Sidewall) because I REALLY can tell a difference with my current 3.6 inch sidewall (Probably the tires sidewall strength too though). Other than cost, I can't make any argument for 15's. I didn't have money to buy another set of wheels, so I opted to just get these and use them both on the track and on the street. I have a set of 225 width Avon Tech/RA's that I mount on them for the track.

For what it's worth, my tune is one of the first Jan did with his head, and after spending 4 hours on the Dyno working out other issues with my car (Weird Torque Curve) we kinda just gave up. Jan wants to re-tune the car and expects that he can squeeze another 4-6 HP out of it. It's hard to make any power past 7k with the stock cam too. My redline is 8250 RPM's but I rarely rev that high because past 7,000 RPM's the HP just flatlines.

I agree, with a 4k dollar budget, most of it is eaten up by the time you get the head and install it, but I was giving a general overview of my priorities, and what you could buy with that money.

If I had 4k bucks and not a dime more, this is what i'd do:

Suspension:
TSW Springs - $200
Alta 19mm Rear Sway Bar ~ $200
IE Front Camber Plates ~ $175
Helix Rear Camber Arms ~ $220

Engine:
Helix Short Shift Kit ~ $60
JCW Intake ~ $350
Alta 15% Pulley ~$99
NGK 2 steps colder Iridium Spark Plugs ~$60
Helix/Bosche 380cc Injectors - $260
OBX Header with Stock Cat ~ 275 from a decent exhaust shop
"One-Ball" Exhaust ~$120 from a decent exhaust shop

That puts you just over $2000 for the parts, figure 600 or so in installation costs. That leaves you another $1,400 for whatever you want. A tune from Jan would tie the parts together, and he's the kind of guy that would probably work with you if you planned on doing more mods later.

You'd still have some money left over for tint and some stripes too .

 

Yea, if I did 1/2 the stuff I read about, I'd have to triple it, twice.

That's why your input is so valuable. Thanks!

What is your opinion on the wheel size 15" vs 16" (current size) vs 17"? My wheel experience is nil, so all input helps.

Reading the pre-cat article referenced above now. Interesting.

Scott

 

Rusy & RedSkunk,
I'm enjoying the banter, please continue. Some questions:

Question: Negative camber moves the top of the wheel *in* and the bottom of the wheel *out* - right?

I am doing as much as possible by myself. Did the exhaust last weekend. Will do pulley, rear sway, CAI and hopefully springs (or whatever you guys talk me into) next. If I get control arms on the rear, I'd do those when working on the sway bar.

Question: Dyno time. How much does it cost, how long does it take, etc. Someone please describe a typical "Date with Dyno".

Questions:
1. Wildwoods fit over some 15"s, are they ok? They are not Stoptechs, but still at $1200 for just the front, I figure they will stop the car better than stock. I also assume that BBKs are more for those with high track time, but I saw one NAMmer say that "getting good brakes is like adding horsepower" because you can run full throttle longer and brake later, carrying more speed.

2. What is disadvantage of 17" wheels on the '02 MCS? I like them. They are heavier than a non-OEM 16" or 15" of same make, but still much lighter than OEM 16"s, right? Cost is a bit higher, but not much. Seem to have greater number of options available too. Do they track worse? Do they street worse? What?

I found this on Randy Webb's site:
Why is smaller, better for AutoX? I'm not doing AutoX, so I guess 15" tires should not be considered as much as the lower side wall height of the 16" and 17"s.

Why TSW vs H-Sports? For the H-Sports, to me it seems the 1" drop and progressive rate springs help both the daily ride, and are the right drop for the MINI.

How does this help? Just quicker shifting?

What is an OBX header? Thought it was a brand name....

Ok, that's all the stupid questions for now.

[EDIT one more] How much additional sound do you add when you start adding headers, heads, etc.? I'm running the Volt now, and it is not as "open" as the Magnaflow, so not as loud.


Thanks again.

Scott

 

if youre tracking the car i would say your focus should be on keeping your speed up so investing in a nice suspension set up is ideal (coil overs). if you can maintain a higher speed through the turns you'll find that you'll be much faster around the track than had you spent the same amount of money on the engine. a good brake set up is also important, the better the brakes the longer you can stay traveling at high speeds before you need to slow down for a turn. Remember the key is to maintain a high speed. If your focused on the engine and dont work on the brakes you wont be cutting down on your lap times that much because you be getting to higher speeds faster but you'll be lacking the ability to slow yourself down in time to really benefit from it plus brake fade sucks. after those two things are taken care of see how much money you have left, you'll probably be able to afford a nice cai, 15% pully and look into maybe the air diverter from alta and perhaps a hood scoop that allows more air in to cool the intercooler as high heat will be robbing you of all your potential power. Oh man i almost forgot get rid of those heavy stock wheels as unsprung weight is not you friend. sticky tires! All in all i think power should probably be your last focus,if you look in one of the issues of mc2 mag you'll see there was a test of about 12 or so modded minis all cooper s' and one justacooper with a nice suspension setup- dispite his lack of power he still showed up some powerful s'. And make sure you take your back seats out, saving weight is good

 

That tune is an additional expense, I've yet to see a head alone net 40hp (20% hp increase, since nobody adds a head before the common mods that should bring you closer to 200hp). But like I said, I'm just nitpicking. Like BRG just posted, I would concentrate more on suspension than the pow-wa, and the head is a big expense with this price cap.

Sidewall stiffness is as much a function of the tire than the actual sidewall. But I was making the assumption that we were buying a second set of wheels, since it personally makes more sense to me to run sticky rubber solely for *insert fav. motorsport here*, and keep whatever you already have for the street. I'm not looking to set any records on the grocery store run.

smportis -

Anything from 15 to 17 will work and is used by a lot of people. (Gotta check out the wheel / applicable forums for more detailed responses.) Just don't go to 18s, for the love of god.

It's my understanding that big brake kits aren't really for increasing stopping ability, but more for decreasing brake fade. I've seen people happy with just pads / brake fluid, and people who aren't. I'd suggest trying different pads and fluid (and maybe ss lines and metal caliper bushings) first, before dropping large $$$$ on a BBK.

Yes, negative camber moves the top of the wheel in. I myself would suggest adjustable camber plates if possible, since you can't adjust camber with fixed plates, it just adds a static number (that many people aren't satisfied with, and that often varies from the left to right side of the car). I've seen many people end up with less than -2* camber with the IE fixed plates, whereas many of us end up running more than -2 for track or autox.

The TSW springs are probably one of the best springs on the market, since they provide a 1" drop and are linear. Linear springs are usually considered the better option for track or spirited driving because they're... well, linear. Easier to pick a line and stay on it when your springs aren't changing rates on you. I had the H-Sports, and they were still fairly jarring even with the progressive wind, because at the end of the day, you're loosing travel on an already travel-impaired car when you install lowering springs on the stock dampers. (Or even aftermarket dampers, apparently.)

That's why I would suggest still thinking about going straight to coilovers, ones that: have camber plates, allow ride height to be adjusted independent of travel, and come with linear springs. These, to me, seem to be the most important features in a "budget" set of coilovers. +$1k on coilovers seems like a lot, unless you'll be buying springs ($200), adj. camber plates ($300-400), and then down the road, new shocks when your stockers blow out ($600-700) because you were running the lower springs with them, decreasing life dramatically.

etcetera.

 

- Dynos vary, usually pay by the hour, figure anywhere from $60-80 per hour
- The Wilwoods are nice, if I had the money...
- Smaller wheels = less weight / less mass further from the hub, plus shorter gearing = best for autocross. Remember to add the weight of the tire when figuring weight differences. The 15" tire will weight less too. But, again, there are plenty of people running 16 and 17 on the track, competitively. Search around the wheel forums.
- quicker shifting, I haven't yet bothered to do a short shift kit, some people advise against installing them. I'd consider this a fringe, not really performance, thing to get whenever you wanted to blow <$100 on the car.
- OBX is a brand, they sell $199 headers which are good for the money, Megan also sells a header for the same price, both worthwhile "budget options."
- The header will add substantially more exhaust noise (still livable for most people), head might add more noise under the bonnet, depending on head.

 

only issue with a smaller wheel is a larger sidewall and resulting softer turn-in. That said, there's a sweet spot and 15/16/17 are the norm for track use.

 

from a cost perspective 15's are light and often times cheaper than 16's, 17's

 

Since you're interested in the track and keeping a budget, I think you're going along the right path with 15 inchers. You can pick up cheap 15 inch rims (rota, holies, whatever) that are light and perfect for track or street use. Further, you can put sticky street tires (azenis) in 205/50/15, which will throw your speedo out of wack by a little, but it will add acceleration, effectively lower your gearing, and they're a lot cheaper than 17s.

If someday down the road you elect to get some larger brakes, the wilwood kit does a good job of fitting under 15s, sometimes with small spacers.

mb

 

I really like the look of the 17"s ... The 15"s just look like a lot of tire - kinda tall and ugly.... IMHO.

So there's no disadvantage to the 17s other than 1) cost, 2) a little bit of comfort on normal roads, 3) weight gain, 4) loss of acceleration. Geez, why would anyone go with 17s with all that?

 

Wanted to update everyone on what I ended up doing to spend $4500 on modding my car. It actually ended up a little higher (hard to believe, i know) since my wife gave me wheels and tires for fathers day.

Here is what I did:

First, I did all the labor myself except for my tune from Waylen Hunsucker (Way Motor Works) in Atlanta, the dyno, and the alignment. That saved some major $$.

Parts:
- $100 - ALTA 15% Pulley.
- $200 - ALTA CAI - Used from a NAMmer
- $ 50 - ALTA Oil CC - on a whim, used, great price (thanks LOU)
- $550 - VOLT Exhaust
- $240 - H Sport Rear Sway 19mm
- $229 - H Sport Rear Control Arms
- $215 - H-Sport Sport Springs (R53)
- $214 - M7 Strut Tower Brace
- $175 - CF JCW Hood Scoop
- $159 - M7 Ultimate Lower Grille (R53)
- $229 - M7 Ultimate Upper and Middle Grilles (R53)
- $ 25 - Stubby Antenna
- $145 - DDMWorks Intercooler Diverter
- $125 - DYNO #1
- $650 - Tune from Way Motor Works (~20 hp)
- $900 - 17x7 Enkei Racing RPF1
- $500 - 215/40ZR-17 Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec
- $156 - Brake Paint, LightInSight, Matts
- $271 - Carbotech AX6 Brake Pads F & R
- $ 35 - AT6 Brake Fluid
- $199 - TSW Slotted Rotors F & R
__________________________________
TOTAL = $5367, MINUS $1400 for wheels = $3967

Still Need to get:
- $200 - Schroth Racing Harness, removable
- $300 - Body Stripes
- $250 - Window Tint (maybe)
- $120 - Brake Caliper Bushings



So that is where I am. I've not tackled the brake components yet, but I've done all the rest. I love the new look with the lower stance and custom wheels. Drives great as well. Need to align it to get it fully running.

 

What tuning software does way use? And are you happy with how you spent your money?

 

You can't go wrong with the M7 ultimate grills! They are very nice pieces indeed. However, it is a good chunk of change that could be put to something else. But hey, if you want at least some sort of aesthetic change to the car you can't go wrong there.

Also, for this list, are you factoring in install costs, if you are not installing them yourself?

 

Sorry for the delayed response!

To both questions:

1. I am not sure which software Wayland uses. I'll try to find out. I did get to spend a lot of time with Way the day he tuned my car, as I bought him some lunch after he finished. He told me about his rise as a top BMW mechanic, all his time spent at one of the top mechanic colleges (with scholarship I believe), the competitions he won, etc. He was not bragging, just telling his story. He's a good dude, and a talented mechanic.

After he had been working for BMW for a while, he asked to be put in the Mini mechanic school by BMW. He heard that the Mini was coming out in '01/'02 and felt it would be very popular in the States. They obliged, and thus he became one of the first few people in the US to be formally trained by BMW on the Mini.

He left them after a while and decided to do his own thing - which takes him to where he is today in between Atlanta and Indy, and all points in between. That's the cool thing about Wayland - he travels quite a bit. Maybe not as much as Jan, but I think he gives more personal service. Not to badmouth Jan, but he and I talked about him coming to Nashville, and that just never materialized since jan was so busy.


2. Am I happy with my purchases. Yes, thus far. I had a ton of fun researching which parts were best for me, and even more fun doing the work myself. So far, the only labor I've paid for has been the dyno run, Way's tune, and soon the alignment after I put on the wheels and tires.

I've not put on the Oil Catch Can yet, nor the brake stuff listed in my sig, but I plan to do those soon. I have an Oct 17th track day coming up and I've been working towards that all year.

The car is very, very different now from a power AND a handling standpoint. The upgraded exhaust gives it a unique sound. All the power components give it much more pull, the tires and wheels give it lots of grip, the sway bar stiffens it, and the control arms help keep it planted. The brakes should keep it from fading and a bit more initial bite and response. I can't wait to really get it out on the track.

I also need to clean out my IC (intercooler), as I'm sure it is full of 6 years of oil gunk and is not cooling as well as it could. I've been putting that one off!

The only thing that I'm not satisfied with on my car is the paint. It has lots of little chips and dings from the previous owner's 30K miles he put on it, but it is not bad - I'm a little CDO (that's OCD in alphabetical order... ... that's a joke son!) about stuff like that so the little chips bug me.

Another issue, I also got a little aggressive when I put on the M7 Ultimate Grills. For the middle grill, it said that you could remove some of the plastic material that showed under the grill, and I misread it and removed too much. After the install, the top part of the grill did not meet up wtih the plastic and seemed to need another place to connect with the grill. When I showed it to Wayland, he laughed at me and said that I cut the whole support out of the grill - that's why it was sticking out. I'm going back to re-read the instructions, but I swear I cut out what they said that I optionally could cut out. But that is more than you wanted to know.

Hope you got this far down in the post. It's been a blast thus far. Next year, I'm going to sink a little more into it, but I don't know where/what yet.

 

Yes, the grills from M7 were expensive, but I really like the quality of them, and I really think it gives the Mini a very unique look that I don't see out there very often. M7 was good about supporting me when I had an issue (my fault, not theirs).

Re Install Costs: I did all the installations myself, using mostly posts from this forum as a guide. I can't think of anything that I did that was not spelled out in NAM. Some of the guides have lost their pictures due to one of the picture storage sites going out of business though, which is a bummer.

I had never done ANY installs on a car before - and I've learned a whole lot. I even have my very own Snap On Torque Wrench bought used on Ebay! (and about $1000 worth of other tools that I did not include in the cost).

I figure I saved about $2500 in labor by doing it myself, $300-500 alone on the pulley.