Some of you here are very passionate about Re-Vins- either you want them crushed at customs or you could careless. I'm curious though, why the need for Re-Vins? What laws are preventing someone from importing a late 90s Classic? Is it only certain states where these cars cant be licensed? I'm just kinda curious what the laws are? Is it possible to have a late model classic imported and be honest about it? Gracias.

 

Here's a Car & Driver article that explains it a little bit, and provides some links to official NHTSA/DOT documents/sites.

From the article :

"Here's the summary of the synopsis of the brief: Cars newer than 25 years must meet all federal safety and emissions standards for their year of manufacture or they endo into a bureaucratic brick wall. There are very tightly controlled exceptions that likely don't apply to you. Got your eyes on, say, the 2004 European Car of the Year? The feds have one response to anyone asking if he or she can import the cheerful little 50-mpg Fiat Panda: Fuhgedaboudit!"

In general, a re-vin is an (illegal) effort to make a newer car appear to be older, so that you can import it without having to modify it to meet federal safety/emission standards.

 

makes sense. im assuming a classic mini doesnt meet safety standards? werent they imported during the first few years of production? i cant imagine a whole lot has changed in their design.

so its a no go on a newer classic huh? what about titling it as a track car or something?

 

Yes, as long as the car never sees the road you can import it and keep it on the race track, other than that the law has changed, it used to be nothing after 1968. Now it is 25 years or older so every year that ticks off the clock more legal Mini's are available to us. There is no "need" to strip the newer cars of their VIN (birth certificate). In 2025 all Mini's will be legal here. When you have had one 36 years a few more is nothing and those who cheat and break the law to do it destroys the value of those cars and drives the price of un-revined cars through the roof. In 2025 when all Minis are legal, you can have two identical cars sitting side by side, the revin will be worth alot less and the more revins in the country the more the unmolested car will be worth and the less the revin will be worth. So if the trend continues to just FLOOD this country with Re-VINS a smart person would buy up as many untouched cars in the UK and store in them the UK because they will be worth a small fortune one day here in the states. Makes no sense since every year that goes by 1000's of legal cars are now ready for export.

 

Ah... so you're afraid this massive flood of re-VINs will hurt the value of your car... You know... I was just down at the NJ docks the other day and they were covered with illegal Mini's... ...makes sense now...

So what would you have done to all of the cars that are already here? Crush them? Seriously. I want to know. I won't argue the validity of the law. It is what it is. But once the car has made it through, I can't see how it hurts anyone.

Look, I have no problem with stopping incoming re-VIN's. Customs used to be lax on them (or simply didn't have the man-power) and many got through. More recently, they're clamped down on this. This, combined with high Mini values in the UK and an unfavorable exchange rate have basically made the whole thing a non-issue. Few Minis are coming to the states right now, period. Legal or otherwise.

The same thing happened with a few muscle cars a few years ago - with similar arguements about legality and values. At first, there were worries that a re-VIN Camaro would hurt the values of older ones. In reality, it turned out not to be the case. For one, the new bodies are simply too well made to ever be mistaken for an old one by a knowledgable buyer - and if someone spending upwards of 6-figures on a muscle car doesn't know what they're looking at, then they get what they deserve. Original and well-restored genuine cars with the right options saw no decrease in value at all. Most have actually increased due to the extra exposure.

 

Ok Ok, I was afraid this would happen and we may get in a pissing match (like one was seen a few weeks ago) about Re-Vins. That wasnt my intention. I was just simply curious about the laws. My classic only sees the road once or twice a week and I would love to own a late 90s daily driver and just wanted some insight. Don't mean to get a bunch of wedgys up in here.

Regardless, to those who responded, thanks for the information. Looks like I'm stuck waiting it out. Or finding one that has already cleared customs.

 

If you want a later model re-VIN, just buy one with a current, valid title. As you said, the main peril, really, is that the customs guys that insopect the car when it comes on from overseas will know what they're looking at and confiscate it.

Mercy seems to think that the DMV can and will arrest you and crush the car in the DMV parking lot if they see it (maybe they'll drop a Dumpster on it? drive a fork-lift into it?), but *my* experience and the experience of many, many others is that a re-VIN car can and should breeze through the DMV inspection process. I personally know of nobody, not a single person, that's had issues at the DMV.

Mercy is rignt on one thing however: every day that passes means that more and more cars are valid and legal to bring over. It's 2008 - that means that cars older than 1983 are legal under the 25-year rule. there are plenty of Minis of that vintage overseas. Minis from places like Australia are favored since their climate is dry(er) than, say, Holland. But even European Minis of that vintage can and do show up for sale - there are even companies that will inspect the car and do any required safety and mechanical repairs before shipping them to the US. If you're really conceraned about it, buy a 1982 Mini or earlier - they can be found.

Good luck!

 

A couple things, no, re-vins do not hurt the value of my car quite the contrary, it increases the value of mine every car that is stripped of it's heritage. Second, I am not under the impression that DMV will crush your car if they find it, it is fact. Talk to George Molina of the LA Sheriffs Task force on stolen cars, he will give you examples of not only Minis crushed but others as well. Vespa, we all would love to have a 2000MPI we would all love to have newer Minis, well most anyways, some chose to break the law while other chose not to. It is not worth the risk over a car to lose your car and investment over. Making people aware is what I do, I am not here to **** off those who have them and chose to keep and enjoy them, I am here to **** of those who chose to sell them to the unsuspecting public, and to keep the future more reasonable for those who want to drive them 15 years from now. SO Ian, my motivation is not one of value of my car, but all the cars being destroyed just to make the self-indulgent feel good about driving their newer Minis. Present company excluded Imaginox. Pre 1968 unmolested cars wont lose value ever, any car imported into this country illegally one day will be deemed worthless due to the fact that you will be able to buy a legal one rather than an illegal one.

I honestly dont have one problem with the cars already here until they show up on eBay as something they are not, then they are fair game.

 

Real classic lovers unite! - Stop the illegal threads

-Grace

 

Every week this seems to happen.....i know the threads have been quite latley, but this just steers me off to other sites.....it's getting old

 

I'm with Big Norm on this thread.... I have been around NAM since I got my first BMW Mini in 2002 and my second on in 2005. Now I just have a '79 that I am rebuilding and due to family needs no longer have a new Mini. Neverthless, while I have a non re-vin '79, what other people do is their business and it does not change what I am doing nor do I think it will change the Mini market.

This re-vin issue seems to come up on this board over and over and I have to say its a turn off. Everyone has there opinion and that's fine. However, every time the topic comes up the same things are said by the same folks!

I like the fact that there are people willing to help each other on rebuilds or problems or finding parts - the re-vin debate is enough to people off!

Soap box done - lets find something more constructive

 

I totally agree..I didn't start it this time..but at the same time if asked I will address the issue, and I thought it was a very calm discussion, no one has to read it that's for sure. I am with OK and Norm.. lets see some pictures of your rebuilds..

 

From here on out we should refer people who ask about re-vins to do a history thread search, and leave it at that, that way we dont go through the same crap every week...enough has been said in previous threads to educate someone on what ever they need to know...lol.....lets keep the classic mini threads fun and exciting not a down and out argument location.....we all love our mini's new and old, and these threads are designed for us to share the love of our cars with everyone, and it's also here so that we can help each other through issues we are having with our vehicles.......it has been a great source, for info, history, and making new friends......let keep it that way

 

As much as I like you Norm, no one was arguing here, and the thread was appropriately titled. You don't have to read anything posted in a thread, nor do you have any right to tell us what to talk about. If you expect me to stop talking about something when addressed you are mistaken. I did not bring up the subject and someone had a legitimate question that will be addressed by me as long as I am here to answer. It is truly unfortunate that that the issue is even an issue at all but it has just as much right to be talked about as anything else Mini.

 

i was speaking in general about the re-vin issue and not your specific statement....im not telling anyone what not to say nor do i care what anyone says....all im saying is that there is plenty of threads in the classic mini section that goes over the re-vin's.....i simply suggested that we refer people to search prior threads for there anwser in this matter so that heated discousions dont accure because we all know that it can become that....might not be intentional, but it does happen when this issue is brough to the forum

 

LOL.. well that's true enough.. I was impressed with the cordial tone this thread had taken..

 

i apologize for bringing out a subject like this. i didnt mean to get people worked up at all. i was just simply asking for some direction on the "laws" that everyone likes to refer to, but never really spell them out. this thread can be closed now, my question was appropriately addressed and answered. thanks.

 

You did nothing wrong, no need to apologize. You titled the thread appropriately, it was carried out with no problems or challenges. The subject gets a lot of attention and is talked about often for obvious reasons, and there are a lot or reasons people want it to go away. But it wont!

 

I'm not so sure the topic is the problem - it's been quite fine in this forum for quite some time until recently.

 

To answer the original question and title of the thread, there is NO need for Re-VINs. The law is very clear. Please refer to Norms new sticky https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=156884 and click on the bottom link.

 

i actually moved the link to the top of the sticky....

 

Oh cool.. please click on the pdf file for the laws and this form can be used to bring in your legal import

 

In CA I don't think the 25 year rule works. I think 1975 is a hard and fast year. But this is a state issue, and not a federal one. If you're up for the game, do some reading specific to your state if you're in California....

Matt

 

Look at it this way. You can't have a production vechicle that has for the most part been unchanged since 1959 but Billy Bob can get him a pair of frame rails for a 1934 ford and BRAZE them together, stick a 700 HP big block in it throw a fiberglass body on it and in most states without inspection it is 100% legal and roadworthy.

 

Funny how that works, huh? Total B.S.