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Not much new to report, but a few answers to above post replies:
- Winters in Minnesota are pretty dry
- I don't believe the moisture is due to the weather - it's condensation from the engine/gasoline
- My garage is made of cinderblock, with a concrete floor, and it's tiny! Not sure I can invest money to upgrade it to make it suitable for the little guy
What I was getting at number13 is that you are parking a car with a hot engine in a cold garage. The moisture causing the problem is definitely condensation, I don't disagree with that. What I'm saying is that if your garage is totally air-tight, and it sounds like it is, then the condensation has no way of evaporating. Can you try opening a couple of the garage's windows an inch or so? That might help. Other than making the car a little bit colder, it's not going to hurt anything and it could very well help the situation. I advise anyone else experiencing the problem who parks in an unheated air tight garage to do the same.
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Just my .02 But what happened to plugging in your car at night? When I went to college in North Dakota I plugged in my full size Ford Bronco when ever it would be parked for a while. There is a heater that was placed in a freeze plug on the block that would keep the engine warm during the common sub zero temperatures ! I think if I lived in Duluth or anywhere that has frequent temperatures in single digits I would look into some type of engine warmer ! The heat radiated from the engine block I am sure would help with the condensation issues. I do agree though that if this is happening in temperatures at or just below freezing MINI needs to find a fix QUICK! Like I said just my .02. AS ALWAYS KEEP MOTORING!!!!!
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2007 R56 MINI COOPER S LASER BLUE, PREMIUM,SPORT, ANTHRACITE HEADLINER, 17" WEB SPOKE, BRUSHED ALUMINUM INTERIOR, DIY INTAKE 90 DEGREE ELBOW TRUE FLOW 9" FOAM FILTER.
Well add another mini to this issue. Mini is stating to take longer drives. So they want my wife to make longer commutes to work, take the scenic way??? What a load of crap...who is paying for the extra fuel or mileage? Not Mini thats for sure.
Chicago doesn't really compare to North Dakota or Duluth...
Let alone comparing a MINI to a Bronco!!!
Well lets see 4 wheels-yes engine filled with oil either dino or synthetic-yes. SUB FREEZING TEMPERATURES-YES. Oh sorry for the sarcasm but I as well LOVE my MINI but it is not the supercar of the UNIVERSE. Even our little S rockets can get a little cold sometimes! And yes they are a fuel driven engine with oil in a sump like the bronco had! Kind of hard to lubricate when oil turns into a jelly like substance. All I was trying to do was give some options. I know when I went to N.D. on scholarship and being from Miami the last thing I thought about was keeping the engine of my car warm! Also I wonder if any of these cars were properly warmed up at idle before driving? Have a great day and "KEEP MOTORING"
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2007 R56 MINI COOPER S LASER BLUE, PREMIUM,SPORT, ANTHRACITE HEADLINER, 17" WEB SPOKE, BRUSHED ALUMINUM INTERIOR, DIY INTAKE 90 DEGREE ELBOW TRUE FLOW 9" FOAM FILTER.
Well, dropped off the MINI on Friday - apparently a fix has been engineered and "new" parts are to arrive at the dealer on Monday. The parts are supposed to include a tee fitting and a capped drain that will rest near the exhaust manifold to reevaporate the collected condensation after startup. The dealer did a good job and I have a loaner until the car is done. They will shuttle vehicles between Mpls and Duluth mid week. I was impressed that a solution was developed so quickly.
Also I wonder if any of these cars were properly warmed up at idle before driving?
I've had the same issues as all the previous posters. However, I've always been taught that idling is very hard on engines and a person should instead warm their vehicle up by driving conservatively and not just letting the car idle.
And putting the car in a heated garage is all fine and dandy and what I do when I'm at home but my car has no choice but to sit out in a parking lot for 9 hours while I'm at work in which case there's plenty of room in the lot for condensation to escape (referring to the reply regarding opening a window in the garage) and that was where one of my issues has occurred.
I've been told to run the car for 10 minutes or so, shut it off and restart to remedy this issue in the future.
In reply to type and location of gas purchase, this has happened to me from separate stations and different octanes of fuel.
I don't think it's ridiculous to think a brand new car should function just fine in -20F. If an 85 Saab or 89 Olds can manage in this climate, certainly a brand new BMW product should be expected to do the same.
Have been running into the same issue myself lately. Interrogated vehicle fault memory and found fault codes 2B32 and 2B31 stored for throttle valve actuator continuously/briefly jammed.
Since this fault would only occur immediately at engine startup my "fix" has been to turn the ignition on (pushing the start button without starting the engine, KL15) and pressing the gas pedal a couple times to "unjam" the throttle then cycling the ignition and starting the engine.
I was hoping there would be a software fix for this by now but there apparently isn't. If a throttle sweep on below freezing starts could be worked into a software update that may help reduce this fault.
Oh, and for the record, my commute is 31 miles each way, 90% highway and country roads. If it is condensation causing these throttle faults BMW still needs to invest more in the crankcase ventilation engineering team.
Started having cold start misfires 10 days ago on my R56 (new in mid-April, 22,200+ miles so far!) reminiscent of icing in the throttle body I had problems with in a 1977 SAAB Turbo many years back.
MINI sits in the office lot all day; when this began it'd been 45F in the morning, raining on into the afternoon while the temp dropped to 16F when I left. Started up, into reverse, backed up half a car length & suddenly I'm on 3 cylinders or less! Yellow-outline engine lamp didn't come on until the next morning, stayed on for a day, then went out.
Similar thing happened a week later, this time after a cold-soak park overnight in my driveway. Doesn't last long, MINI gets me to where I need to be, but the delayed-action indicator lamp is disconcerting at best even though it goes out after a day or so.
Dealer seemed clueless when I first brought the problem up, but since it went away I never took the service appointment I'd set up. 'Course, later that day was when the problem surfaced for the 2nd time.
My R53 was 6-winters reliable in this climate, even with 130K+ miles. I hope the R56 will be too, once these teething things get resolved....
I've been told to run the car for 10 minutes or so, shut it off and restart to remedy this issue in the future.
I'm with you on this issue (despite your comment about the SAAB - see above) as 21st-century engineering should have resolved 20th-century problems long before seeing production.
This shouldn't be happening with our MINI'S at all.
I couldn't agree more! I have a 2004 Rav4 with 125000 Km and that thing runs better then my 07 Mini with only 4000 Km. Something is wrong with this picture.
The same condensation problems have happened to me at both 2000km and now at 3874km. The dealer response was to drive more. Move out of town? Go to a larger city? I don't appreciate them passing off the fact that the crankcase is not designed to ventilate well or some other problem as as my fault. Unfortunately, I'm looking at getting into a battle with them to take the car back. I live in the prairies of Canada and can't be having this problem every two months, especially when it's off warranty. You'd think BMW would come up with a solution instead of blaming the consumer. Brutal and disappointing!
Last edited by Crashbangwallop; 01-31-2008 at 07:05 PM.
Reason: misinformed
I think a catch can is basically what the factory fix is for this problem. My usual drive route involves the car running for at least 30 minutes each time it starts so that isn't the issue, but remember it can stay below freezing for several months at a time and even up to a week below zero so any condensation will just continue to build up until the car stays above freeezing for a while.
During the worst of the problem, the car did not want to run at all, so getting it warmed up was not really an option.
So far the catch can is working, but I've only had two round trips on it.
I brought the cold starting problems up to my SA today. According to her getting a CEL is not normal in cold temperatures, and any dealer that says so is giving you the run around.
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how about adding some 'heat' (fuel line dryer) and seeing what that does?
we're picking up our 07 soon and i would like to be assured that my wife doesn't run into this problem during her commute.
I run Isopropyl in mine and that usually fixes it up. Contrary to the dealer's comment that Isopropyl creates water (my chem eng degree argues with that) and it was just coincidence that when I added Heet the car started to run fine.
Well just so you folks know, this isn't necessarily a cold weather issue.
This happened to me yesterday, and I live in San Diego.
It's been raining here a lot in the past few weeks, and yesterday I was about 4 blocks from my house on my way home from a 15 mile drive and I suddenly had a loss of engine power with the accompanying yellow engine light.
I'll have to call the dealer today to make an appointment to bring it in on Friday.
Is it okay to drive it until then? The dealer is about 30 miles away... should I have them come pick up the car?
By the way, I usually drive the Mini only 7 miles per day, and it only has 2,900 miles on it. I love it, but I have to say I'm a bit depressed today that my 5-month-old car is falling apart already.
Is it okay to drive it until then? The dealer is about 30 miles away... should I have them come pick up the car?
According to the manual if it's the yellow light then you can still drive conservatively. If it is the same issue as we are having it should resolve if you drive for a while as the car warms up. Try starting the car and letting it run for 10 minutes. Then shut it off and restart. That was the suggestion of the dealership here. I've also had luck with Isopropyl alcohol in the gas tank.
how about adding some 'heat' (fuel line dryer) and seeing what that does?
we're picking up our 07 soon and i would like to be assured that my wife doesn't run into this problem during her commute.
I tried adding fuel line dryer after the first incident that I experienced with my new 07 a couple of weeks ago. It seemed to work for a few days, but by the weekend, the problem returned. At this point, I think it appeared to work due to the warmer weather conditions. When it got really cold again (with my car, lower than 20F), the throttle froze up again (or whatever the problem *really* happens to be).
My car is at the dealer (for the second time), waiting for parts from MINI, right now. According to my SA, the dealership received information from MINI about a new fix (perhaps it's the same one as Toshio posted). He didn't offer many details, other than it will take a couple of hours to install the parts. I'll know more about what they did once I pick up the car.
I hope it works. Otherwise, I'll be one very disappointed customer. A 3-month old car shouldn't be having problems like this. Heck, I have an 11-year-old Volvo that's never had this kind of problem.
Haven't had a recurrence of the worst of my R56's misfiring-upon-cold-start syndrome over the past few days. Reluctant to take it in to the dealer as every time it's happened, shutting it down - take a deep breath or two to relax - then restarting has effected a return of normal engine operation.
Twice the engine power light has lit up, but anywhere from 12 to 24 hours after the misfiring occurred, which I find Very Odd Indeed. When it does light up, I find there's no effect on engine performance either. It typically stays on for a day or two, then goes out.
My normal commute is 46 miles one-way, 75% on interstates. What with the decline in 'civility' in traffic these days, the recent winter weather, and the truly amazing increase in both frequency and volume of pot holes in the roads here, I've started taking the train. My MINI commute has declined to something like 16 miles back and forth to the station each day, just enough to get the engine warmed up nicely.
I've been consistent with feeding BP Gold since I took delivery mid-April of 2007. 22,700+ miles on the odo to date; this cold-start misfire is the first problem I've encountered. I'm dubious that adding anything to the gas tank would improve things any as I believe the condensation is in the air-handling portion of the engine intake system - specifically the throttle body - not in the fuel-delivery plumbing.
A SAAB 900T I had (some 30 years ago) had an air metering device that frequently collected water on its horizontal aluminum plate actuator, which in really cold weather would freeze solid. Either it wouldn't run at all, or suddenly it would run full-throttle. Not at all nice in slippery conditions.
I'd wanted a Clubman when I realized my R53 was becoming a liability at 133,000 miles a year ago.
As they hadn't been released yet here, I "settled" for an R56. Think my dealer would be 'reasonable' in trading my '56 for a new Clubman, now that they're here? (It'd be the 5th MINI my wife and I had taken delivery of from them since April of 2002.)
Think the cold-weather affects the Clubman S the same as the similar R56's that have been built so far?
! I think if I lived in Duluth or anywhere that has frequent temperatures in single digits I would look into some type of engine warmer
! The heat radiated from the engine block I am sure would help with the condensation issues. I do agree though that if this is happening in temperatures at or just below freezing MINI needs to find a fix
QUICK! Like I said just my .02. AS ALWAYS KEEP MOTORING!!!!!
in the roads here, I've started taking the train. My MINI commute has declined to something like 16 miles back and forth to the station each day, just enough to get the engine warmed up nicely.
