Suspension H&R Springs, Vibration issue
#1
H&R Springs, Vibration issue
I own a 2007 Cooper "S" that I put a set of H&R Springs on recently and off the line I'm experiencing slight vibration even though the tires have been re-balanced and also did an alignment. The vibration is more noticeable when I step on it off a dead start than gaining gradual speed. A friend of mine is experiencing the same exact problem with his 2007 Mini "S" that has a set of H&Rs. Please advise.
#2
#4
It might also be the CV's .....some cars notice vibration when lowering and some don't. It seems to really depend on the car.
check out this thread for some other possibilities: http://www.motoringunderground.com/f...ight=vibration
check out this thread for some other possibilities: http://www.motoringunderground.com/f...ight=vibration
#5
Worrisome for me since I'll be putting on a set of lowering springs next month, and am debating between H&R or Mach V... Yes, I know there are other users who have installed the H&R's and not had a single problem. But it's just a bit strange to me that I've read of no problems with the Mach V's.
Best of luck in getting everything fixed!
#6
Yea, I remember that as well. There were two different guys and if I remember correctly, one is still dealing with the issue.
Worrisome for me since I'll be putting on a set of lowering springs next month, and am debating between H&R or Mach V... Yes, I know there are other users who have installed the H&R's and not had a single problem. But it's just a bit strange to me that I've read of no problems with the Mach V's.
Best of luck in getting everything fixed!
Worrisome for me since I'll be putting on a set of lowering springs next month, and am debating between H&R or Mach V... Yes, I know there are other users who have installed the H&R's and not had a single problem. But it's just a bit strange to me that I've read of no problems with the Mach V's.
Best of luck in getting everything fixed!
Probably because the Mach V springs are a little higher, or are less agressive.
#7
msteadman,
People have had the same issue with mach v also:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co....php?p=1881969
I have the same issue 07mcs with H&R springs;
0-30mph vibrations are felt in the passenger front side.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=120956
I agree with RallyMini, if you look in some of the posts someone had their axles and cv's replaced by the dealer "fixed the issue according to them". I am going to bring my car into the dealer since I live close to one, I just haven't had the time yet.
People have had the same issue with mach v also:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co....php?p=1881969
I have the same issue 07mcs with H&R springs;
0-30mph vibrations are felt in the passenger front side.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=120956
I agree with RallyMini, if you look in some of the posts someone had their axles and cv's replaced by the dealer "fixed the issue according to them". I am going to bring my car into the dealer since I live close to one, I just haven't had the time yet.
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#8
msteadman,
People have had the same issue with mach v also:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co....php?p=1881969
I have the same issue 07mcs with H&R springs;
0-30mph vibrations are felt in the passenger front side.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=120956
I agree with RallyMini, if you look in some of the posts someone had their axles and cv's replaced by the dealer "fixed the issue according to them". I am going to bring my car into the dealer since I live close to one, I just haven't had the time yet.
People have had the same issue with mach v also:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co....php?p=1881969
I have the same issue 07mcs with H&R springs;
0-30mph vibrations are felt in the passenger front side.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=120956
I agree with RallyMini, if you look in some of the posts someone had their axles and cv's replaced by the dealer "fixed the issue according to them". I am going to bring my car into the dealer since I live close to one, I just haven't had the time yet.
Damn that wheel gap! I really want to get rid of it, but it seems the current solutions are a bit lacking. Well other than going to coilovers, which simply isn't in the cards right now.
#9
My take on the vibration is this:
- It is pretty subtle. When a customer first brought it to my attention, I had to drive around for a long time before I could perceive what he was talking about. Some cars do it very little, some cars do it more.
- It seems to have something to do with the amount of lowering. I think any set of springs that lowers this much -- our springs, H&R's or others -- will probably have this same issue.
- My guess is that it has to do with the behavior of the bearings at a certain shaft angle on the CV joint. The joint may be "unloaded" and have slightly more play at a given angle, which happens to be present when the car is lowered.
- I'd guess it won't have any detrimental effects in the long run. The CV joints are always at some angle, and are designed to work at many various angles and loads depending on suspension and steering position. They're also pretty heavy-duty looking considering the small size of this car.
These are just my guesses. If I learn anything more concrete I'll post here on NAM.
--Dan
Mach V
- It is pretty subtle. When a customer first brought it to my attention, I had to drive around for a long time before I could perceive what he was talking about. Some cars do it very little, some cars do it more.
- It seems to have something to do with the amount of lowering. I think any set of springs that lowers this much -- our springs, H&R's or others -- will probably have this same issue.
- My guess is that it has to do with the behavior of the bearings at a certain shaft angle on the CV joint. The joint may be "unloaded" and have slightly more play at a given angle, which happens to be present when the car is lowered.
- I'd guess it won't have any detrimental effects in the long run. The CV joints are always at some angle, and are designed to work at many various angles and loads depending on suspension and steering position. They're also pretty heavy-duty looking considering the small size of this car.
These are just my guesses. If I learn anything more concrete I'll post here on NAM.
--Dan
Mach V
#10
#14
Wow, I have the exact same issue with my Mach V springs I just installed.
I was going to do some research, but just happened to stumble upon this thread. The vibration only happens between 0-30 mph. I notice that it is much more noticeable in 2nd gear. When I shift early into 3rd, the vibration is much less pronounced.
Only concern I have is if I take it to the dealer, they will just blame the any problem on the aftermarket springs....
Nick
I was going to do some research, but just happened to stumble upon this thread. The vibration only happens between 0-30 mph. I notice that it is much more noticeable in 2nd gear. When I shift early into 3rd, the vibration is much less pronounced.
Only concern I have is if I take it to the dealer, they will just blame the any problem on the aftermarket springs....
Nick
#15
The same thing as a few other have said. Its the CV joints being at a greater angle than they were prior to lowering. The R53 did it as well...my R53 was lowered, but I never really experienced the issue, although I felt a very very very slight vibration when accelerating.
A lot of times it will go away after a while as the CV joints start to wear at the new, lowered angle.
There is a HUGE thread in the R53 suspension forum that discusses this very issue in great detail.
A lot of times it will go away after a while as the CV joints start to wear at the new, lowered angle.
There is a HUGE thread in the R53 suspension forum that discusses this very issue in great detail.
#19
Has H&R with factory shocks now.
I had Koni FSDs on them when I put the springs on. I have decided to go back to the factory shocks with the H&R Sports and it is so much more fun to drive. It actually dropped the rear to about 1 3/4 inches over the factory and with the koni's was only dropped not quiet 1 inch. In the front now it dropped to about 1 1/4 inches. With the Koni's it dropped the front to just a tad over 1 inch. Go figure
But the vibration is not there now since I have had the factory shocks reinstalled.
I had Koni FSDs on them when I put the springs on. I have decided to go back to the factory shocks with the H&R Sports and it is so much more fun to drive. It actually dropped the rear to about 1 3/4 inches over the factory and with the koni's was only dropped not quiet 1 inch. In the front now it dropped to about 1 1/4 inches. With the Koni's it dropped the front to just a tad over 1 inch. Go figure
But the vibration is not there now since I have had the factory shocks reinstalled.
#20
We have still yet to figure this out. Some speculate the CV, some its an alignment issue, who really knows. But to me, there is no way Mini could design the car to not function in all angles of the suspension travel. Esspecially angles that the wheels will travel in normal daily operation (plur or minus 1-2" off ride height). Using this logic, things like alignments could be the issue, or a bad control arm bushing. When the new JCW car comes out, its not going to have this problem, right??
Anyway, if we or H&R can figure out what causes this we will make everyone aware of the solution.
Anyway, if we or H&R can figure out what causes this we will make everyone aware of the solution.
#21
You state that mini designed the vehicle to handle properly with varying ride heights of 1-2" while driving.
This is true, but,even if the design had a flaw and would shimmy at that travel, it would only be for a split second and would go unoticed.
but now that the vehicle is at a constant 1-2" lowered it is noticable.
I notice this myself while cruising on the freeway at 60+, but i thought it to be a tire balance issue. it's not enough to annoy me, but it is there. I'm thinking geometry issues to be the cause.
Something in the steering arrangement gets moved to low or straight, and does not work properly at the new angle.
Does the vehicle have a vibration issue when using a complete coil over assembly? I would think it would, because just the strut towers are shorter to accomadate the shorter springs. the steering geometry should still be off as with just a spring swap.
This is true, but,even if the design had a flaw and would shimmy at that travel, it would only be for a split second and would go unoticed.
but now that the vehicle is at a constant 1-2" lowered it is noticable.
I notice this myself while cruising on the freeway at 60+, but i thought it to be a tire balance issue. it's not enough to annoy me, but it is there. I'm thinking geometry issues to be the cause.
Something in the steering arrangement gets moved to low or straight, and does not work properly at the new angle.
Does the vehicle have a vibration issue when using a complete coil over assembly? I would think it would, because just the strut towers are shorter to accomadate the shorter springs. the steering geometry should still be off as with just a spring swap.
#22
We have had 3 shop cars in the last 2 years, some the early R56 and the last one a new 08 R56. We have had springs and coilovers on all of them and never had the issue. So its a huge mystery.
Also for Mini to not design the car to be lowered is pretty bad. They, for 100%, know that a % of them will be lowered at some point and they must have designed around this. So i just can't believe it has to do with that. I think its an alignment issue. We still get calls once a week from an alignment shop asking how to align the rear toe, and front camber. To me, this is the variable with the vibration.
Also for Mini to not design the car to be lowered is pretty bad. They, for 100%, know that a % of them will be lowered at some point and they must have designed around this. So i just can't believe it has to do with that. I think its an alignment issue. We still get calls once a week from an alignment shop asking how to align the rear toe, and front camber. To me, this is the variable with the vibration.
#23
We have had 3 shop cars in the last 2 years, some the early R56 and the last one a new 08 R56. We have had springs and coilovers on all of them and never had the issue. So its a huge mystery.
Also for Mini to not design the car to be lowered is pretty bad. They, for 100%, know that a % of them will be lowered at some point and they must have designed around this. So i just can't believe it has to do with that. I think its an alignment issue. We still get calls once a week from an alignment shop asking how to align the rear toe, and front camber. To me, this is the variable with the vibration.
Also for Mini to not design the car to be lowered is pretty bad. They, for 100%, know that a % of them will be lowered at some point and they must have designed around this. So i just can't believe it has to do with that. I think its an alignment issue. We still get calls once a week from an alignment shop asking how to align the rear toe, and front camber. To me, this is the variable with the vibration.
sounds to me like the clients are bringing there cars to the "cheapest" alignment shops.
Thats why i suggested a performance knowledge alignment shop. they cost more but know what they are doing.
#24
--Dan
Mach V
#25
about what % are you having problems in this area? Any other types of vehicles? or just the mini.