Wheels that fit Stoptech BBK
#1
10-13-2005, 05:38 PM
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Wheels That Fit All BBKs
I thought it would be good for those of us with the StopTech big brake kit to tell what wheels work with the kit, and how large of a spacer is required. It could be a good database for those looking at buying new wheels, or those looking at getting the kit. Just reply and add Wheel, Wheel Size, Offset, and Spacer (if required):
BBS RV-F ------------------- 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- no spacer
OZ Superleggera ------------ 17"x7" ---- +37mm offset -- 5mm spacer
SSR Comp ------------------ 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- 3mm spacer
SSR GT7 ------------------- 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- no spacer
Team Dynamics Pro Race 1 -- 17"x7" --- +45mm offset -- no spacer
I will now add information to this post for all BBKs. Once we get enough responses, maybe we can make this a sticky!
I will add to this post as people add to the thread.
BBS RV-F ------------------- 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- no spacer
OZ Superleggera ------------ 17"x7" ---- +37mm offset -- 5mm spacer
SSR Comp ------------------ 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- 3mm spacer
SSR GT7 ------------------- 17"x7.5" -- +42mm offset -- no spacer
Team Dynamics Pro Race 1 -- 17"x7" --- +45mm offset -- no spacer
I will now add information to this post for all BBKs. Once we get enough responses, maybe we can make this a sticky!
I will add to this post as people add to the thread.
#3
10-13-2005, 08:49 PM
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#4
10-14-2005, 02:52 PM
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Received a response from StopTech on wheels that fit without spacers:
MM HT3
MM Evo 5
Action
Action Sport
Mille Miglia
SSR Competition
Sport Edition Fox 5
ASA KA3
TSW Revo
I will update the top list with all important information later.
Also, I am thinking that this thread would be better if we include all BBKs. Send me the wheels you use with your BBK (any BBK), and I will compile the list at the top of this post.
MM HT3
MM Evo 5
Action
Action Sport
Mille Miglia
SSR Competition
Sport Edition Fox 5
ASA KA3
TSW Revo
I will update the top list with all important information later.
Also, I am thinking that this thread would be better if we include all BBKs. Send me the wheels you use with your BBK (any BBK), and I will compile the list at the top of this post.
#6
10-14-2005, 04:02 PM
#7
10-14-2005, 04:08 PM
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#8
10-14-2005, 04:11 PM
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#11
10-14-2005, 04:48 PM
Trust me; you can't include all the BBKs in this lump clearance thing. A good idea but it'll need to be in an xl sheet to be complete.
Selling both the Wilwood factory and my own 13" kits there are three diffrent specs for them.
What causes this (and makes compiling a list very difficult) is that clearance is effected by:
Caliper bodys size and shape
Rotor width
Hat offset
Rotor diameter
Change any one of these and you have a new clearance. Change two of them and you're over the top in trying to check fit! I believe that the ST kit is probably the least wheel friendly of the bunch. Not 100% on that but it's likely. IF it's the case then about the only thing you can infer is that lesser spec'd BBKs will also clear THAT wheel.
The idea is good, executing this plan is going to be far tougher.
Selling both the Wilwood factory and my own 13" kits there are three diffrent specs for them.
What causes this (and makes compiling a list very difficult) is that clearance is effected by:
Caliper bodys size and shape
Rotor width
Hat offset
Rotor diameter
Change any one of these and you have a new clearance. Change two of them and you're over the top in trying to check fit! I believe that the ST kit is probably the least wheel friendly of the bunch. Not 100% on that but it's likely. IF it's the case then about the only thing you can infer is that lesser spec'd BBKs will also clear THAT wheel.
The idea is good, executing this plan is going to be far tougher.
#12
10-14-2005, 05:31 PM
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#13
10-14-2005, 06:32 PM
Hmm. Been there, done that.
When planning the TCE kits I compiled and extensive list of all the BBKs on the market that I could find at the time. And their variants as best I could tell. In that sheet I took a stab at the potential wheel fit one would encounter on that particular kit. It tooks some time to compile it as I had to research the calipers in use, the rotor widths and diameters as well as some other estimated data relating to other things. It's by far not 100% complete, but with some work I pretty well laid down the bench mark for the best combo of fit, size, and cost to name a few.
Email me and I'll send you a copy. Think I still have it.
http://tceperformanceproducts.com
toddandchris1@***.net
When planning the TCE kits I compiled and extensive list of all the BBKs on the market that I could find at the time. And their variants as best I could tell. In that sheet I took a stab at the potential wheel fit one would encounter on that particular kit. It tooks some time to compile it as I had to research the calipers in use, the rotor widths and diameters as well as some other estimated data relating to other things. It's by far not 100% complete, but with some work I pretty well laid down the bench mark for the best combo of fit, size, and cost to name a few.
Email me and I'll send you a copy. Think I still have it.
http://tceperformanceproducts.com
toddandchris1@***.net
#14
10-14-2005, 06:38 PM
#15
10-14-2005, 06:55 PM
#16
10-14-2005, 07:15 PM
Spacers get the love/hate deal.
The down falls of them are really all pretty basic;
1. You often lose the hub centric nature of the wheel support. While the wheels interface with the rotor hat (iron or alum) in fact takes most of the abuse and load, the hub centers the wheel. When this is gone you have lost the centering of the wheel. That in turn places the studs both in shear when supporting the wheel but also makes them center the wheel. Hopefully. Many wheels have stud holes placed in a less than favorable manner as it's not really critical they be dead nuts on. Most are but beware of this.
2. Bearing wear. The load of your car is placed farther out then the bearing was intended to support the load. This means the hub wears at a greater angle when riding in the *****. Deflection becomes a greater issue. Least case you wear out the bearing quicker, worse case you shear a hub! Not common but bearing wear is. (yes I speak from kit experience)
3 Fender clearance. Obviously with the big- ol' fatties on the car adding wheel spacers can make matters worse.
4. Scrub radius changes. This is the arc the tires take when turning and as the track width changes (wheel spacer X 2) so too does this turning radius. I'm not a suspesion expert but in short I view it as the outer wheel fighting the inner wheel at a greater width. Thus wearing the tire patch more. *I'd have to dig out the Carroll Smith books for a more indepth discussion on this, it's been way too long.
5. Studs. Yes studs. All wheel spacers on the MINI will require a stud kit as well. So what? Hey, I'm just helping post the data so plan on spending more money for this as well. And of course you'll want to do the rear as well...
6. Offset changes. This means that if you add spacers you may request a wheel offset change when you order them as well. Assuming you can use the same numbers in the rear....so much for tire rotation perhaps?
All I can think of, what'd I miss?
The down falls of them are really all pretty basic;
1. You often lose the hub centric nature of the wheel support. While the wheels interface with the rotor hat (iron or alum) in fact takes most of the abuse and load, the hub centers the wheel. When this is gone you have lost the centering of the wheel. That in turn places the studs both in shear when supporting the wheel but also makes them center the wheel. Hopefully. Many wheels have stud holes placed in a less than favorable manner as it's not really critical they be dead nuts on. Most are but beware of this.
2. Bearing wear. The load of your car is placed farther out then the bearing was intended to support the load. This means the hub wears at a greater angle when riding in the *****. Deflection becomes a greater issue. Least case you wear out the bearing quicker, worse case you shear a hub! Not common but bearing wear is. (yes I speak from kit experience)
3 Fender clearance. Obviously with the big- ol' fatties on the car adding wheel spacers can make matters worse.
4. Scrub radius changes. This is the arc the tires take when turning and as the track width changes (wheel spacer X 2) so too does this turning radius. I'm not a suspesion expert but in short I view it as the outer wheel fighting the inner wheel at a greater width. Thus wearing the tire patch more. *I'd have to dig out the Carroll Smith books for a more indepth discussion on this, it's been way too long.
5. Studs. Yes studs. All wheel spacers on the MINI will require a stud kit as well. So what? Hey, I'm just helping post the data so plan on spending more money for this as well. And of course you'll want to do the rear as well...
6. Offset changes. This means that if you add spacers you may request a wheel offset change when you order them as well. Assuming you can use the same numbers in the rear....so much for tire rotation perhaps?
All I can think of, what'd I miss?
Last edited by toddtce; 10-14-2005 at 07:17 PM.
#17
10-14-2005, 07:29 PM
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I agree with keeping the thread to just the stoptech, although if it clears the stoptech it's a good bet that it's going to clear about anything.
Here's the thread I created for the AP Racing kit
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...light=apracing
Judging from your list above, it appears that the Stoptech sticks out a few mm further than the AP does.
Here's the thread I created for the AP Racing kit
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...light=apracing
Judging from your list above, it appears that the Stoptech sticks out a few mm further than the AP does.
#18
10-14-2005, 08:10 PM
I have to say I disagree with how you propose to handle this Jeff. I do agree on the data, collection and post.
But....you'll need five or six threads to list all the kits for the car. And in fairness to all of them each can (as this one has) take tangent turn down the road to other topics not directly related to your original post.
Get the data in one thread.
"I have X brakes and Y wheels."
Then it's up to you to compile it into a data sheet that can be put into one sticky for everyone. A worthy task no matter how you approach it for sure.
** A simple thread on what you have for brakes and wheels. Any other comments and or input (other than spacers) to be deleted. No q&a stuff.
But....you'll need five or six threads to list all the kits for the car. And in fairness to all of them each can (as this one has) take tangent turn down the road to other topics not directly related to your original post.
Get the data in one thread.
"I have X brakes and Y wheels."
Then it's up to you to compile it into a data sheet that can be put into one sticky for everyone. A worthy task no matter how you approach it for sure.
** A simple thread on what you have for brakes and wheels. Any other comments and or input (other than spacers) to be deleted. No q&a stuff.
Last edited by toddtce; 10-14-2005 at 08:15 PM.
#19
10-14-2005, 08:17 PM
#20
10-14-2005, 08:23 PM
awesome, i think i better jus stick w/ur advise.....we talked about this a while back on the phone i called u for brakes & we ended up talkin' spacers & wheels. thx, sounds good to me.
Originally Posted by toddtce
Spacers get the love/hate deal.
The down falls of them are really all pretty basic;
1. You often lose the hub centric nature of the wheel support. While the wheels interface with the rotor hat (iron or alum) in fact takes most of the abuse and load, the hub centers the wheel. When this is gone you have lost the centering of the wheel. That in turn places the studs both in shear when supporting the wheel but also makes them center the wheel. Hopefully. Many wheels have stud holes placed in a less than favorable manner as it's not really critical they be dead nuts on. Most are but beware of this.
2. Bearing wear. The load of your car is placed farther out then the bearing was intended to support the load. This means the hub wears at a greater angle when riding in the *****. Deflection becomes a greater issue. Least case you wear out the bearing quicker, worse case you shear a hub! Not common but bearing wear is. (yes I speak from kit experience)
3 Fender clearance. Obviously with the big- ol' fatties on the car adding wheel spacers can make matters worse.
4. Scrub radius changes. This is the arc the tires take when turning and as the track width changes (wheel spacer X 2) so too does this turning radius. I'm not a suspesion expert but in short I view it as the outer wheel fighting the inner wheel at a greater width. Thus wearing the tire patch more. *I'd have to dig out the Carroll Smith books for a more indepth discussion on this, it's been way too long.
5. Studs. Yes studs. All wheel spacers on the MINI will require a stud kit as well. So what? Hey, I'm just helping post the data so plan on spending more money for this as well. And of course you'll want to do the rear as well...
6. Offset changes. This means that if you add spacers you may request a wheel offset change when you order them as well. Assuming you can use the same numbers in the rear....so much for tire rotation perhaps?
All I can think of, what'd I miss?
The down falls of them are really all pretty basic;
1. You often lose the hub centric nature of the wheel support. While the wheels interface with the rotor hat (iron or alum) in fact takes most of the abuse and load, the hub centers the wheel. When this is gone you have lost the centering of the wheel. That in turn places the studs both in shear when supporting the wheel but also makes them center the wheel. Hopefully. Many wheels have stud holes placed in a less than favorable manner as it's not really critical they be dead nuts on. Most are but beware of this.
2. Bearing wear. The load of your car is placed farther out then the bearing was intended to support the load. This means the hub wears at a greater angle when riding in the *****. Deflection becomes a greater issue. Least case you wear out the bearing quicker, worse case you shear a hub! Not common but bearing wear is. (yes I speak from kit experience)
3 Fender clearance. Obviously with the big- ol' fatties on the car adding wheel spacers can make matters worse.
4. Scrub radius changes. This is the arc the tires take when turning and as the track width changes (wheel spacer X 2) so too does this turning radius. I'm not a suspesion expert but in short I view it as the outer wheel fighting the inner wheel at a greater width. Thus wearing the tire patch more. *I'd have to dig out the Carroll Smith books for a more indepth discussion on this, it's been way too long.
5. Studs. Yes studs. All wheel spacers on the MINI will require a stud kit as well. So what? Hey, I'm just helping post the data so plan on spending more money for this as well. And of course you'll want to do the rear as well...
6. Offset changes. This means that if you add spacers you may request a wheel offset change when you order them as well. Assuming you can use the same numbers in the rear....so much for tire rotation perhaps?
All I can think of, what'd I miss?
#21
10-14-2005, 09:11 PM
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PS: This might clear almost any brakes. I saw a very shiny black MCS with Nevada plates parked at my nearby dealership and it had 18" wheels by A&N with Nitto tires. There was lotsa offset and I believe the brake calipers were painted red--darn I should have looked more carefully but I was mesmerized by the wheels (black centers and silver rims).
#22
10-14-2005, 09:41 PM
Originally Posted by benthevegan
17 inch volk te37s should fit pretty much any big break kit. The way the spokes are designed is for BBK. They are exteremly light, very strong(completely forged) and very nice looking. They are just a little expensive.
I had a set of 17 Volk LE 37 and they needed over 7 mm to clear a set of Stop Tech's. Looking at them we thought there would be no problem but we were suprised.
Randy
M7 Tuning
#23
10-15-2005, 06:56 AM
thanks toddtce:
I thinks I'll skip the spacers and perhaps not do this at all. I love my BBS RGR's and to be honest, I just wanted them for the beautiful look. I don't believe I need those breaks for performance since I never hit the track and my top speed on average is less than 35mph because I live in NYC and the roads are scary. Only recently went for a small trip to Beacon and averaged 75mph.
Anyways, thanks for the information.
I thinks I'll skip the spacers and perhaps not do this at all. I love my BBS RGR's and to be honest, I just wanted them for the beautiful look. I don't believe I need those breaks for performance since I never hit the track and my top speed on average is less than 35mph because I live in NYC and the roads are scary. Only recently went for a small trip to Beacon and averaged 75mph.
Anyways, thanks for the information.
#24
10-15-2005, 07:11 AM
A quick 'google' this morning put my commnets on scrub radius to be wrong. My comments were on Ackerman steering and toe issues, not scrub. Sorry for the incorrect information.
Do a quick search on SCRUB RADIUS and you'll open up number pages that can fully explain this. After reading a few you'll see the common complaint is about 'light' steering and or poor feedback from moving this point from zero or negative to a positive position. I'll defer to the suspension experts from this point forward as to whether this is good or bad.
Do a quick search on SCRUB RADIUS and you'll open up number pages that can fully explain this. After reading a few you'll see the common complaint is about 'light' steering and or poor feedback from moving this point from zero or negative to a positive position. I'll defer to the suspension experts from this point forward as to whether this is good or bad.
#25
10-15-2005, 07:12 AM
Strom,
Thanks for the link on the 3mm spacers. I'd like to add that KINESIS K18R with 15mm HR spacers. Probably can go w/ 10mm but no one makes a 10mm that is hubcentric.
Just like to add that if you use a 5mm or less spacer it is not hubcentric and it does not need to be because there enough of the hub exposed to center the wheel for proper wheel fit.
Thanks for the link on the 3mm spacers. I'd like to add that KINESIS K18R with 15mm HR spacers. Probably can go w/ 10mm but no one makes a 10mm that is hubcentric.
Just like to add that if you use a 5mm or less spacer it is not hubcentric and it does not need to be because there enough of the hub exposed to center the wheel for proper wheel fit.