Well, I think I may have just found out what too much rear swaybar feels like. Thankfull, it was without damaging anything.

I tried moving my 3-way adjustable bar from the softest setting to the middle one. On wet pavement, with DSC on, with the swaybar on the middle hole, the car went from slight understeer to DSC inducing oversteer when I let off the throttle. With the swaybar on the softest setting, the car would go from slight understeer to really slight understeer when I let off the throttle.

Yes, for testing I purposely pushed the car into an understeer situation and let off the throttle - not on a public road. I wanted to know what would happen.

The DSC proved, yet again, that I still have some learning to do when it comes to driving. It had kicked in and straightened out the car faster than I realized things were starting to go wrong, and definitely faster than I could have gotten back on the gas to straighten out the car myself.

And, I now have a "klunk" coming from the back end of the car. I'm guessing the bolt between the swaybar and endlink isn't tightened up enough or completely seated straight.

I think I'm going back to full soft. I have to really pull a bone-headed move with the bar on full soft to get the back end to come around, and it started to happen a little too easily on the middle hole. Part of me wants to use the stiffer setting to learn some more about driving, but that definitely needs to be reserved for the autocross course.

For the record, my suspension setup is:
JCW suspension upgrade springs and struts / dampers
stock sports suspension front swaybar (the small one)
RDR (Helix) rear swaybar
stock control arms and end links, no camber plates

 

its all for fun!

if the rear end starts giving up... going oversteer... just stomp the throttle.. miracles of the FF is always... lift off oversteer especially with the hard rear sway bar on the stiffest setting!

 

Good info snid. I'm about ready to try my H-Sport comp on the middle setting and was wondering what to expect.

 

You can induce drop throttle oversteer with any ARB setup. It all depends on speed, lateral g-force, and the how violently you lift.

It's a good idea to get used to the soft setting first and work your way up.

I will say however that even with a large rear bar set on it's stiffest setting, an otherwise unmodified Mini has too much understeer. Of course, if you lift while turning, that is going to change in a hurry...

 

to setup my cars for street, I usually take it on my predetermined course
over dry and wet (with dynamic stability ON the first few times)to see
how it runs so that i know when to prepare if the rear slides out or not.

I can only use it as a reference point since all pavement and conditions
are different street to street, but it's a good starting point.

 

I just put the bar back on full soft. I feel much more comfortable now.

I'll go back to the middle setting for an autocross, where I can spin the car with minimal danger. But I know I'm not ready to drive with the car like that on the street.

Other people who are more skilled than I could probably be thrilled with the way my car handles with the stiffer rear swaybar, but I'm not ready for it yet.

And, my "thunk" sound is gone again. Yay!

 

Be careful.. especially in the wet. I used the middle hole for months of street driving with no problems. Then one day while being a little to aggressive, I had to quickly back out of the gas I caught it but it was close

 

Cool. I figured as much. With the soft setting, I've learned to go into a corner off throttle which unweights the back end a bit (not enough to induce oversteer) and then get back on the throttle near the apex. It's an amazing difference if I just go through a corner on the gas. I just want to try the middle setting to see how much more it's going to push it to oversteer. I understand completely about being careful in the wet as I've induced a tad bit of oversteer even on the soft setting.

 

wat dd u do to correct it?

i got 20mm bar, want to go stiffest setting coz feeling that softest setting is to soft. not 100% sure of wat could happen... from wat ive seen is that it goes full oversteer and ur car pretty much does 90degree turn,.

 

Now you know why street cars come with understeer. As you get more and more nuetral syspension set up, unloading the rear will get it to step out. There is really no way around this.

This is also why a lot of people say keep the agressive driving for the track, where there are helpful corner workers to let you know if you may have to slow down in the middle of a turn.

Be careful, and have some fun.

Matt

 

yer makes sense i guess.. ill keep it on softest then.. i mean natural reaction is to let go of gas, stomp on brake, then bang u got full oversteer .. even if u correct this by turning oppostie way .. i dun fink it will be enough.

 

...my Webb bar just arrived

 

it to unlearn some "common sense" habits from street driving. Short of "Both feet in" (ie, just giving up and trying to stop the car by pushing in the clutch and hitting the brakes and hoping you don't hit anything before you stop moving), learning to hit the gas and not the brake when you start to feel the rear end go is a very tough lesson. And this will make you go a bit wider in the turn as you unwind, and if there's something there, like a wall or watever, it's not good news. I really am having a tought time "unlearning" my street driving habits. But with so few track days a year, it's very, very hard to get the reps needed to learn.

The faster I go on the track, the slower I go on the street!

Matt

 

It's actually possible, even desirable, to set up a car so it will step out or rotate under a trailing throttle condition. Then, your only option is to keep your foot in it. I prefer this because it keeps my feet where they're supposed to be ...keeps me honest.

'Step out' above is a relative term, by the way. Nothing spooky, more a weight shift thing at high speed.

I find that a little more rear spring and a little less rear bar make for a more consistent drive up to the limit.