Pretty straightforward question... is there any way to change the LCA bushings, without the special tool, and without dropping the subframe? Can the old rubber bushings be hacked out of the sleeves?

 

Maybe, but it would take forever. Dropping the subframe is really easy. no special tools are needed except a torque wrench when putting it back together.

I tried to hack out my bushings after dropping the subframe as I didn't have a press. It wasn't going to happen. not for many hrs of hacking. Luckily I only tried for 1/2 hr then my neighbor came home and he has a press. it made quick work of pressing out the old and in with the new.

 

Well, what would you do if you didn't have a friendly neighbor with a press? (I have friendly neighbors, but I doubt any of them have bushing presses.) :D

 

Find a friendly garage with one....

 

Are you replacing yours with another set of stock bushings?
If so, just buy a set from MINI all ready to go in...although getting the old ones off the arms and getting the new ones on will be kind of a pain with the arms still on the car.

If you are going to use aftermarket bushings, see if Uberfisch can get you a spare set of warranty brackets(that they are just going to throw out anyway) from his work. You will still have to press the old bushings out, though.

 

No I'm definetly going to go poly bushings.

 

You need the dealership tool to press out the old bushings. It's cheaper to have the dealership do the job than to buy the tool, amazingly.

 

I have the special tool and only use it to reinstall factory bushings. If your going to install poly bushings just lower the subframe and remove the entire bushing/bracket assembly. Put it in a press and force it out, then reinstall the poly ones.
I have the PF bushings in stock http://www.waymotorworks.com/product...cat=285&page=3

And if you need we can press them into a set of brackets and you can return yours as a core. That way you won't have to do anything with a press, or fight out the old bushings.

WAY

 

If your car has elevated mileage, you might consider removing the sub-frame so you can replace the LCA ball joints and the sway bar bushings as well.

If you concentrate, this is a 3 hour job, start to finish.

 

That sounds like a great deal! If the OP doesn't take it, I'm interested.

 

I would consider the offer from Way, that is fantastic, but my car is my DD and I can't have any downtime with it. I'll just have to see if any of my friends have a press, and drop the subframe, or see if a buddy at one of the mini dealers can let me borrow a tool...


Edit- unless you mean that you'd send me the bushings in brackets, and THEN I'd ship mine back. How much would that cost altogether?

 

Pretty shure that is what he meant send you brackets with PF bushings installed and ship yours back as a core

 

My car is starting to "tramline" more often now that it has 45k on it. With the type of roads we have here in Alaska, I'm almost certain that these bushings are shot. So I'm looking at doing this as well - the idea of buying bushings pre-installed, and sending the old brackets back sounds like a great idea!

Do these PF bushings increase NVH significantly? I'm looking to tighten up my front end, but would rather avoid rattling my teeth out, if possible...

 

Re the Power flex bushings; these will add hrashness at times and you will feel and hear it most just under your feet and door jam/ A pillar area.

These do offer much better control, especially under braking. Also, not often discussed, your alignment specs can be, and should be dialed in with a tighter tolerance...these bushings do not flex and traditional alignments specs make up for a range of control arm articulation. There is barely any movement in the rear of the control with this bushing or the Alta unit.

 

Another great alternative to the poly bushings is the Alta psrs. High quality part with no more nvh than the poly's.

 

I'm a self taught DIY'er, so I hope you'll take this in the right vein, but if this car is your DD and you have to ask a question like this on such a basic repair, should you even be attempting to do this job? You can't afford downtime, what if you mess one up?

My recommendation is to take it to a shop and have them do the work, you need to align the front end afterwards anyway and you can't do that in your driveway either........

 

As it sits, I'm fairly disappointed in the stock bushings. My car is at 45k and while the bushings still look intact (not torn or leaking), they have gotten softer and thus, the suspension has gotten sloppier. I've owned many other vehicles in the past where the suspension bushings lasted well over the 100k mark.

I'm willing to give up the smoothness to have a tighter suspension and bushings that will hold up a bit longer on the roads around here. I'm fine just so long as these bushings don't rattle my teeth out like the heim jointed control arms I had on my Jeep.

Thanks for the info!

 

I have about 100,000 miles on the Power flex bushings. Last spring I took them apart and re-lubed them. Aside from a little bit of binding at the extremes of travel they are a very nice additon to a list of mods you can make.

The Alta unit allows some Caster adjustability. However, despite what some of the adds say, adding caster will not improve turn-in repsonse, it will slow it down. Adding caster will aid high speed stability though. The range is probably pretty small 1 - 2 degrees...

 

If you have an R50/53, the Madness chrome-moly control arms [<---can't recommend these enough!] or ALTA PSRS are better solutions compared to the poly bushings due to the non-axial relationship between the control arm and bushing.

For the R56, the poly bushings are fine and do not bind [or add any significant NVH for that matter, tires make a much bigger impact on that], however because the R56's front geometry is, erm, sub-optimal, the ALTA PSRS are still a better choice to bring back some steering feel to the R56.

That's my take on it!
Ryan

 

...and building upon what Ryan wrote, although the Powerflex bushing is a two piece unit that does allow the center portion of the bushing to move in and out of the outer portion as the front portion of the control arm moves over the ball joint, this very movement over the top of the front ball joint is exactly why the Powerflex unit will bind; the control arm follows an arc that perfect scibes the surface of the ball joint and as such the stud at the rear is only on axis at ride height...the stiction becomes progressively worse as the control arms move to full compression or full droop.

The shear weight of the control arm is enough to over come this binding. However, stiction of any kind is never a desirable trait.

The only real concern I have with the Alta unit is its durability in the winter...salt damage is a concern of mine to be precise. It would be great to hear from folks who have used this unit in these conditions. I would have used it if only I lived somehwere warm 365 days a year....or for a track dedicated/summer only car.

My rig is near death anyway...last rights are around the corner...

 

Many of my fellow club members have the PSRS. In fact one of them has been running them for over 2 years with no problems or wear. We do not use salt here in the PNW, (Portland, OR) but the unit is made of stainless steel and aluminium so I can't see where corrosion would be that much of a problem.

It has the ability of adding any where from .75 to 1.5 degrees of added caster.

I will counter your claim the added caster does not aid in turn in. It will simply because with added caster you add more camber thru the turning arc.

http://www.autospeed.com/A_110681/cms/article.html

 

Because I, like yourself, am a self-taught DIYer, and I also don't have money to throw at shops whenever something breaks on my car. I'm not judging my own ability to make the repair, all I wanted to know was if there was a way to do the bushing install without a press, since it's not exactly feasible for me to own one.

 

Bigshot,

You are confusing grip = cornering power - with turn-in = control.

Turn in is all about mechanical leverage and in this case the speed with which the car turns into a turn. Since increasing caster increases mechanical trail, the wheel will resist turning physically but as well geometrically. The incresed force can be measured at the steering wheel.

The added neg camber up front - outside wheel - is a good thing, but the added neg camber to the inside rear wheel is always a little suspect to me since it gives more grip to the wrong tire in an opposite lock condition.

In any event, up to 1.5 deg is not a lot of added caster in general...5 degrees would be.

EDIT before I get flamed, yes, race cars have different requirements than road going fare, and, that way back when bias ply tires were the norm mechanical trail was so small as to not exist because bias ply tires distorted so much under load. I raced bicycles for most of my life and an easy way to feel the difference between big and small mechanical trail differences - fork rake - is interchanging forks on the same bicycle. Small mechanical trail angles provided wicked turn-in but all things equal, posed stability problems going down hill at speed for example. Large angles did just the opposite...after a race up Mt Lemon in tucson many years ago, I changed my gear set and fork and down hilled the mountain with a few other racers as fast as we could...the new fork added welcome stability.

Don't forget, pneumatic trail also occurs; this is created entirly thru tire distortion in side view. There are many suspension engineers who believe that caster is a convenient conceit - that pneumatic trail is the only trail required because its fidelity is more pure than mechanical trail and comes without other compromises.

In addition, because weight is thrown accros the car, SAI is diluted...I also believe this wieght transfer interferes with proper rear sway bar operation...in theory causing more twist in the torque tube for a given steering angle - less linear

 

I think we are saying the same thing but with different words.......

Adding caster does induce additional camber while turning, thus you are getting more grip up to a point.

 

...when setting up a car you always have to ask two seperate questions...do I need more grip or more control? The paths taken to each element of setup is different, but you may find that controlling weight distribution/balance for example aids grip and vise versa.

For example, though increasing grip via increasing driver control is not a primary goal, it is beneficial. Giving the driver more control is always a priority...a high 'G' machine with poor balance is likely much slower than a car with less cornering power but with perfect balance.

Regarding the mini, there are a few techniques/tricks that can be employed to help grip, but in the big picture, tire compound ultimately defines grip. Increasing front track is but one...this increases grip without adding more neg camber and helps to reduce understeer.

Springs, dampers, swaybars, steering gear, bushing compliance and weight distribution determine control...for non-aero cars.

I agree that incresing neg camber to a point will help control but I think any increase in camber gain as a result of more postive caster is - may be - offset by slower steering reaction. Getting the car to turn-in, especially on an autoX circuit, is vital!

...it is important to seperate control and grip because you will ask yourself different questions during setup and you will analyze your setup in a different way...that the two may cross is understood.