I have a 2010 MSC and am currently using the Schwaben, BMW/MINI scanner, when I read the VANOS Gear set position vs. actual position they both read 36 degrees which seems odd to me...I have looked everywhere and I cannot find anything that tells me what is should be if timing is set correctly and since this is the first vehicle I've ever worked on that doesn't have keyways on the cam sprockets I wanted to find out before I go tearing it apart to far and get myself into a hole I can't get out of!!

Thanks!!

 

Just so I'm understanding what you're asking, you're wondering what direction the VANOS gear on the end of the camshaft would be relative to the camshaft?

There is none. It can go on in any direction. Like you said, the cam gears are not keyed to the cams and they are naturally going to turn a bit as you are setting the timing and going through the torque sequence for the timing chain.

The ECU reads the camshaft position on the other and of the cams near the transmission side of the engine. And timing of the camshafts relative to the crankshaft is checked using the timing chain toolset. You put the engine in TDC and in theory the camshafts should be in TDC as well. If the cams are not in TDC then you can't put the camshaft tools on.

Checking timing using the timing chain toolset can be found here: https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/r...mshaft/4PAbHZs

 

Bombardier- when I did the timing chain (nightmare) and replaced everything, I rotated the crankshaft to 90 BTDC and used the pin to lock the flywheel in place then locked the camshafts, the lettering on the cams where both straight up and down and the cam locks slipped right on...then I removed the old timing chain tensioner and replaced it with a new, 82mm tensioner.

My question(s) should have been, if the timing is correct, what degrees should the VANOS gear read? If my set point and actual are identical, does that mean the timing is dead nuts on? And, with a new timing chain, should I have used the 82mm tensioner or should I have used the 78mm tensioner?

 

Also, it’s my understanding that the VANOS gear returns to a “resting” position when the car is turned off, that’s why I’m wondering about the 82mm tensioner with the new chain, is it possible that the additional length of the longer tensioner would stop the VANOS gear from returning to its “resting” position?

 

Ah, that much I wouldn't really know. I just followed the steps for replacing the chain, tightened everything down and started up the car with no issues. I wasn't aware they revised the tensioner to be longer.

I would assume that if all your tools are in place, the chain didn't skip any teeth, and everything is back together your timing should be fine. Considering any service manuals, factory or otherwise, that I've seen mention checking VANOS gear position it's probably not a factor.

 

Hi SynginSky2010,
No the longer tensioner will not prevent the vanos from returning to neutral once the oil pressure bleeds off. The maximum setpoint for intake vanos on the N14 is 36 degrees and the minimum is -34 degrees with a maximum deviation between setpoint and actual of 6 degrees. Typically, the target at idle is 34 degrees but this does not include weighting factors such AC compressor drag, etc. I've attached a picture below so you can see how the timing changes based on RPM and load. You should be able to see the values fluctuate while revving the engine. If not perhaps try another tool such a INPA/EDIABAS or similar.

 

Thanks Lou!!! So, if I’m understanding this correctly, if my set point is 36 degrees, and my actual is 36 degrees then I am at the MAX value for the N14 engine? If that is the case, it sounds like I should A) Get a better scanner, and B) possibly double check my timing?

 

If the engine is NOT running the setpoint and actual will be 36 degrees. The vanos system works off of oil pressure that is controlled by the vanos solenoid. Since the system can't apply positive and negative pressure but only pressure the vanos is only operated in one direction. So without pressure it sits at 36 degrees, as oil pressure is applied to the vanos it travels in the negative direction.

In my case since my idle is set at 900 rpm, my vanos will sit around 24-25 degrees at cat heating (different map) and approx 22% load. Once up to temp it's higher. Yours with a lower idle RPM should generally be around 31-34 degrees depending on whether the engine is cold, in cat pre-heat phase or fully up to temp.

 

That makes perfect sense!! Thanks for taking the time to explain it!!

 

Glad to help.

 

I got the Bavarian Technic scanner hoping it was just my old scanner that wasn’t able to read VANOS movement, the BavTech wasn’t reading VANOS movement either....so, after a VERY long string of expletives, I pulled the valve cover off and re-checked timing, right where it should be, so I was at a loss. Then, it occurred to me that this wasn’t an issue and issue before I replaced the timing chain, guides, tensioner....and the VANOS solenoid, so, I pulled it out, the screens were totally clean, but when I checked the internal spring to see if maybe it was stuck or something...the spring doesn’t compress at all.

So, before I order another one, I just wanted to ask the experts how hard the spring should be to compress?

Thanks in advance for your help!!!

 

I don't want to go too far off topic, but once the VANOS solenoid has been replaced, should a VANOS adaptation be performed?

 

I hadn’t considered that, but it makes sense, I have the Bavarian Technic scanner, can someone tell me how to clear the VANOS adaptations with it?

 

I'm not familiar with that unit. This is the device that I have on the way....

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/192902790438

 

Its normal to clear the vanos adaptations when changing a vanos unit itself. Strangely enough ISTA just calls for checking the DME for errors after changing the solenoid. Personally, I would clear the adaptations as a matter of course after changing a solenoid.

 

I know this is a 4-year old thread, but I am having the exact same problem on a 2010 Cooper S (N14 engine). After rebuilding the head, setting the timing per the book (pinned the crank, bolted the two cams in place with the fixture, torqued the Vanos and exhaust sprocket to spec) my Vanos seems stuck at 36 degrees. These cars don't report oil pressure, but I am begining to wonder if it's 1) low oil pressure (everywhere or just to the VANOS) or 2) The DME has gotten fubared and is calling for a VANOS position that is out of range. I have the check engine light on the dash, but my code reader doesn't show any codes! I have ordered a better code reader that includes INPA and ISTA support so should have better data soon. Did OP ever resolve this issue? What was the problem? My car is very rough at idle, runs a bit better above 2k, but I'm reluctant to drive it very far with the code reader indicating that the Vanos angle never changes. THANKS! David