Long story, but my 02 MCS has been sitting for 3 years. It broke down 3 years ago, and I'm now getting around to fixing it.

When it broke down it would run rough and the exhaust manifold would glow red. It would get harder and harder to start each time I attempted until eventually not starting at all. There was never an engine light at that time.

I just installed a new timing chain, sprockets, and tensioners. I have spark. I have fuel spraying out of the injectors. The supercharger is not locked up. The crankshaft position sensor is new, and the camshaft position sensor is functioning as it should. The starter is turning the engine over.

I'm really stuck here. Any ideas??

 

Going to move you to the Stock Problems/Issues folder.

With the red header, I am wondering if your Cat is plugged up. Can you feel any air being discharged at the tailpipe when you crank the car?

 

I actually thought that 3 years ago, and cut the cat out, and replaced it with a straight pipe.

 

Are you certain that you kept the engine in time when you did the chain/sprocket swap?

 

I followed the Bentley Manual. Cam sprocket arrow was facing up and the copper chain links were all lined up perfectly. I got same results before and after timing install. The old crank sprocket was in deed worn. The teeth were pointed and sharp, not dull and rounded off like the new one.

 

Forgive me, as I'm just grasping at straws here; I have no idea why your engine will not start despite your having fuel, spark, and a starter that works, but is that fuel the same fuel that was in the tank three years ago when the car last ran?

 

Yes, it is. Isn't old gas still somewhat ignitable though? At least enough to see if the car will start?

 

Old ethanol gas is basically water with a little kerosene

 

Modern day fuels will definitely degrade over the course of three years time just sitting. It's not surprising that the engine won't fire up.

I'd try my best to get that old fuel out of the system and get some fresh 92 or 93 octane in... Then try her again.

Hopefully, there's not much of it in the tank.

 

good catch...

 

Ok, Thursday I will empty the tank and put some fresh fuel in and see what happens. I'll report back afterwards. Thanks

 

Even if you remove all the old fuel from the tank, you will still need to cycle the stale fuel from the remainder of the system (fuel pump, fuel lines) before your engine will start.

This process should be performed after the car has been sitting overnight, so fuel pressure has subsided. First, remove the intercooler and driver-side intercooler bracket, locate the end of the fuel rail (driver's side), then remove the stem from the center of the schrader valve (you'll need a tool like the one HERE to do this). Then, connect properly sized clear hose to the threaded end of the valve, put the other end of that hose into a clear container to catch the fuel (a large Gatorade bottle will work well), then turn the ignition key to the second click without starting the car (you'll hear fuel pump run for a few seconds, then stop on its own). Repeat this process until your bottle is 1/2 to 3/4 full of the bad fuel. You might have to fill a couple bottles before all the old fuel is purged from your system. You'll probably know the good fuel has reached the end of the line by the color and smell of the fuel.

I'm not positive if simply disconnecting the fuel line from the fuel pressure regulator (at center of rail) and observing a similar process works as well. There may be a check valve of some kind in the end of the fuel hose. Maybe someone else can chime in here.

Good luck.

 

Got it. Thank you. I bought a siphon today. Tomorrow morning I will try this and report back.

 

Ok. New gas and I'm getting the same results. Yesterday, my obd cable arrived. I'm installing the software now and will try to pull codes. Any other ideas? I don't have high hopes for codes, since there was no engine light when this all started.

 

You'll have to create and plod through a checklist to eliminate all possible culprits.

For combustion to occur, one needs to have fuel, air, spark...

Fuel: At the surface, it still "feels" like a fuel delivery problem. Are you satisfied that you've completely purged the fuel delivery system of old fuel, all the way from tank to fuel rail?

Air: The car has been sitting for three years; Have you checked the air intake system? In three year's time, it's entirely possible that our little friends in the rodent family have set-up a major obstruction somewhere along your air intake system. Also check exhaust for same. If air can't get out, air can't come in...

Spark: Did you check spark at the ignition coil, or at each of the plugs? If you haven't pulled the plugs, do so and see what they look like. If they're fouled-up or wet, you won't get adequate spark. If wet, cylinders are likely flooded by repeated attempts to start with bad fuel. Might be good just to get another set of plugs.

Electrical: Are both the cam position and crank position sensors plugged in? Check ALL electrical connections... Have you looked over your fuses? Are both connections of the main harness fully plugged into the ECU? What's the condition of your battery?

Other: Have you checked compression?

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Hopefully, others will come along with further suggestions...

 

Fuel: When I emptied the tank I got about 7 gal. I put 5 gal of fresh gas in and got about 1 gal through the rail. I'm pretty confident I got all the bad gas out.

Air: I will check tomorrow. Good thoughts on this subject.

Spark: Plugs were dry and I have spark at each plug. I have a brand new set I'll put in tomorrow just to be sure.

Electrical: Sensors are plugged in. Haven't checked fuses, but I will. Harnesses are plugged in. Battery was obviously dead after 3 years, but I've had it plugged in to a 1.5 amp tender for about 2 weeks now.

Compression: #1 @ 30 psi. #2 @ 60 psi. #3 @ 90 psi. #4 @ 120 psi. Same results before and after timing chain replacement. Seems all over the place to me. I was told the supercharged engines were non-interference motors due to the lower comp. ratio. Dished top (R53) vs. domed top (R50) pistons.

 

Those compression numbers are painfully low...
With compression that low, I'd venture a guess that you've found the issue.

Ideally, you'd like the number to be 140 psi or higher, and somewhat consistent with one another.

I assume the compression test was a "dry" test, meaning you didn't add oil to each of the cylinders?

If so, you should follow up with a "wet" test...

A "wet" compression test is used to indicate if low cylinder pressures are caused by worn piston rings only. The test is done exactly the same as the “dry” test, however a small amount of engine oil (about 1-2 teaspoons) is added into the cylinder being tested to create a temporary seal (to prevent possible blow-by). If compression rises significantly afterwords, then worn piston rings are the culprit.

You also mentioned that the battery had been dead for the three years the car sat. The MINIs require the battery to be in tip-top shape, otherwise a myriad of electrical gremlins wreak havoc, disrupting proper operation, even when reading at 12-volts. Might want to obtain a new (group 47) battery before proceeding, although I'd get the compression testing done first... If your piston rings are shot, a new battery isn't going to help.

Let us know how you make out...

EDIT: 288 views and nobody else has anything to add?

 

It sounds like the first thing I will be doing in the morning will be the wet compression test. I'm assuming if my results are the same, I'm looking at a valve job?

So is the R53 engine interference or non-interference? I haven't been able to find a definitive answer.

 

Correct.

A big psi number increase would be new rings and/or pistons in the least...

I understand the w11 engine to be an interference engine, so if the timing chain snapped while the engine was running, you're very likely to have valve damage. Did your original timing chain snap with the engine running?

That might account for your rough-running and red-hot header issue...

 

What I think happened is that the chain tensioner gave out and the timing chain jumped a couple teeth.

 

I didn't get around to the compression check today. I hope to get to it this weekend. I'm afraid it's going to be the valves though. Already been pricing some different options. Any recommendations?

 

 

Looking at the history with the timing chain and symptoms of rough-running and glowing red exhaust headers, I'd concur that things are pointing in the direction of the valves...

One thing to also keep in mind is that if the valves are bent due to clashing with the pistons (after all, it is an interference engine), you may have suffered damage to the pistons too; possibly terminal... Do you have access to a borescope to evaluate the piston crowns?

As to recommendations...

I'm sure you are looking at all options, but there are still outstanding questions that you need to answer before you go further down the road with this... See what the wet compression test reveals, and try to get an evaluation of the piston condition.

 

I do have a borescope, and I did not see any damage to the tops of the pistons. That's part of the reason I kind of ruled out the valves earlier in this project.

Is it possible for valves to bend without damaging the pistons?

 

I have to think that if a valve is impacted by the top of the piston to the point of bending that valve, there would at least be a divot on the surface of the piston...

Let's see what that wet test reveals.