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Stock Problems/IssuesDiscussions related to warranty related issues and repairs, or other problems with the OEM parts and software for MINI Cooper (R50), Cabrio (R52), and Cooper S (R53) MINIs.
Hi, new to my Mini so have some questions about this:
This is at 93k miles. So not ground to nothing yet, but certainly on the way. My understanding is that this is from the seal behind the small drive gear going bad and the oil getting sucked through. In other places I've read that that's not it, but that the oil just drains out because the case isn't sealed.
If it gets sucked through the rotor bearing then that means the bearing should be toast because the seal is gone and the oil has washed the grease out, right?
So I'm looking at replacing the gears, the seal, the bearing behind the seal, and then the water pump (93k mi. after all...). Or pull the gears, replace the bearing and seal-wait, there has to be a seal on the other side right? So that's pulling the SC apart, or paying for a rebuild from a shop.
What I really want to do is pull the gears, replace the one seal, and put the gears back on the other way so I'm using the "good side" of the teeth. Or pull the gears, replace the seal, and install an electric water pump. That still leaves the bearing though. What's lubing that?
There are special pullers and installers required to rebuild the supercharger. I wouldn't recommend trying to rebuild the rear PTO, if the teeth are that bad off and the fluid is being vacuumed out of the housing I would recommend a rebuilt unit.
Our rebuilt units come with all the seals and bearings replaced, as well as an updated rear PTO gearset. So even if your rear PTO is toast, we are still able to rebuild and offer a core return because we're replacing all of those components anyway.
The amount of money you'd spend on temporarily fixing that charger and installing an electric pump with the hoses to accommodate it would be about the same you'd pay for a rebuilt charger that should be "the last charger you ever replace".
There are special pullers and installers required to rebuild the supercharger. I wouldn't recommend trying to rebuild the rear PTO, if the teeth are that bad off and the fluid is being vacuumed out of the housing I would recommend a rebuilt unit.
Our rebuilt units come with all the seals and bearings replaced, as well as an updated rear PTO gearset. So even if your rear PTO is toast, we are still able to rebuild and offer a core return because we're replacing all of those components anyway.
The amount of money you'd spend on temporarily fixing that charger and installing an electric pump with the hoses to accommodate it would be about the same you'd pay for a rebuilt charger that should be "the last charger you ever replace".
Hey, not trying to thread Jack but I was wondering what is required in order to install the electric powered water pump?
The amount of money you'd spend on temporarily fixing that charger and installing an electric pump with the hoses to accommodate it would be about the same you'd pay for a rebuilt charger that should be "the last charger you ever replace".
I think not sir! Though I admire your attempt to protect me from myself, that would be the easy and expensive path. A path rarely chosen by me (refer to my signature).
An ewp80 can be found for less than $200. Knock the pto gears off with a large hammer (just kidding), pull rotors and replace case bearings and seals (about $70 I think), buy a couple of hoses & I'm on the road.
This is assuming the rest of the S/C is in good shape. I understand the bearings on the other end typically last quite a long time. I will pull it apart and see what I think before making my decision.
The Davies Electric water pump only runs around $250. Not a bad deal considering you won't have to worry about PTO gears being ground to dust. Plus you're freeing up extra SC power, not sure if what kind of boost gauge you would see?
Has anyone found any negatives to the Davies Electric water pump?
Very much interested in this myself.
Yes , I saw that thread before. I have asked that guy if he would share his drawings with me.
I'm going to try and pull the PTO gears this weekend, check the rotor tolerances, pull the rotors, and check case bearings to see if it's worth using or needs replacement. I'll post pics & info. as I go through it.
First I tried making a puller from some scrap I had. Would have worked if it were steel I think but it was aluminum. It broke next to the hole. then I tried one with no hole and a wrench on a hex bolt instead of that allen. It started pulling the gear but the ears ended up bending straight. Then I tried making one from some black pipe pieces & that didn't work. There's just no room there! I would just buy a little puller but there is nothing local and I didn't want to wait.
So I sat don, closed my eyes, & tried to think of another way. Then it hit me! I'm going to pull the S/C apart so why not push the shaft out instead of pulling the gear off?
20 minutes later. .003" end play. That will do nicely, thank you.
Both end shafts smooth with no problems. Do the little scratches in the teflon coating mean anything or is that typical?
Bearing looks good too.
The bearing for the other rotor taken from inside. So the question is: new bearings and seal, or just re-grease and seal?
Well right, that's what I was thinking, but I'm doing lots of work on this car including swapping a bunch of parts between 3 different cars https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...tery-mods.html So more work, more time, about another $65 plus $45 or so for a pilot bearing puller set to remove one of the bearings from the case. I need to check side clearance.
Last edited by fullmoonguru; 02-20-2017 at 04:42 AM.
I pulled the driven gear off of the water pump drive shaft with a small 3 jaw puller. I wanted to reverse the gears so the undamaged side of the teeth are being used. The problem was this collar on the back side of the driven gear. The solution was the 10mm washer which I drilled and filed to fit over the shaft, then filed flat so it was the same thickness as the shoulder (.256 from the other side of the gear to the face of the shaft I think).
An angle grinder and flat file took care of the shoulder. I have so much going on with these 3 cars right now, I don't need to add custom electric water pump madness to the mix. Also, this is not like a transmission gear where you have loading on both sides. There is a drive gear and a driven gear at all times so only the ramp on one side of the teeth is under load.
"Next to godliness..." I washed everything with Purple Power, power washed, dried with an air gun, then sprayed all of the bearings and steel parts with WD40. The case bearings on the back side of the housing were lubed with about a peanut-sized glob of Lucas Oil Red N Tacky (NLGI #2 synthetic grease, with a temp limit of 450 deg.)
With the washer fitted over the shaft I pressed the gear (reversed) back on the shaft. I made a mistake in that the blue socket was actually on the water pump drive key instead of being directly on the shaft. It didn't move, probably it's resting on a shoulder on the shaft but if I did this again I would use a socket small enough to rest directly on the shaft.
Ready to mount. Of course the play is still there but I'll be happy if I get a year, or even 6 months out of it. It may be that the clearance I felt is not a big problem. It's the first one I've ever looked at so I have no reference. It's a short shaft with no side loading and it supported on both ends. Just need to get the seal, press the drive gear on, and assemble everything. The seal that was in there was a real POS. a metal collar with a rubber flap. Why would Eaton use that design? Really makes no sense to me.
Last edited by fullmoonguru; 02-20-2017 at 04:36 AM.
OK got the seal in & put it back together. Here's how it went:
A real oil seal with an actual spring in it. This is a CR6213 I bought from ebay for $15 or something.
Used a socket of the same size with an 8mm bolt to press it in to place.
I installed it with the open end toward the gear box since that's where the oil is.
As with the seal, I pressed the gear back on the shaft (backwards!). This 14mm socket was just the right size to extend over the end of the shaft far enough to seat the gear in teh same position it was when it came off.
Ready to assemble! I used anaerobic sealant on the case mating surfaces, put blue loctite on the bolts, and torqued them to 18 ft. lbs. Job done, ready to install!
My hat off to the OP. I like the idea of flipping the gears around and your tenacity. Necessity is the mother of most inventions, except those inventions searching for a problem that does not exist.
Somebody can tell me what is the size of the pto bearing. Like if it is skf and the serial number of the bearing. I open my supercharger. All the bearing as a number but the pto doenst have one?
I'm just about to refer someone to this thread so though I would post a long term update. Going on 2 yrs. now, not sur how many miles, but all is well. I think this is a good option for addressing worn gears.
I'm just about to refer someone to this thread so though I would post a long term update. Going on 2 yrs. now, not sur how many miles, but all is well. I think this is a good option for addressing worn gears.
HOLY CRAP. Not only an engineering spectacular, but a real good forum member keeping such a thread active. Thanks!
So I had the came issue and had another supercharger that may not have been good. But had a good hear and got the larger gear from a great guy in Canada on eBay. I can post his info if anyone needs.
Anyway I made this tool and can send to anyone that needs it. I can mail the feet and you can attach them to your puller it may bend the first time but you can re bend back
Fullmoonguru, you have saved me so much money! At this time, the CR6213 seal is out of production and not available anywhere, but after copious amounts of research I was able to find this reproduction and it fits perfectly!
02-16-2017, 08:07 AM
I like the idea of flipping the gears around and your tenacity. Necessity is the mother of most inventions, except those inventions searching for a problem that does not exist.
