um...automatic?
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From: Toronto, Canada
<puts on suit of armour and braces himself> Hi um... I've tried to learn to drive standard (father, friends) and just can't grasp it. I really, relaly, really want to get a Mini and um, I uh... want to know if the Mini Cooper-- be it the bas emodel or the S is available in <lowers voice>automatic?
4th Gear
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From: Alaska
The Cooper and the MINI One are available with an automatic. The "S" is not and I hop is never, no offense. It's a sports car and shouldn't be supressed by an autoshifter. Don't buy a sports car that is toned down, just spend some time in a '74 Gremlin w/ standard shift. It's inexpensive to buy and if you can learn in that you can drive any stick.
Cheers :smile:
Cheers :smile:
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We just took delivery of a new '02 MINI Cooper CVT a couple of weeks ago and the car has been terrific!. The CVT transmission (Stands for Continously Variable Transmission) features technology that makes it totally different from the typical automatic slushboxes found on most new cars today as it doesn't have any 'real' gears. The CVT tranny can only be purchased on the Standard Cooper (As a $1275 option) and it is not currently available in the Cooper 'S', unfortunately (I am keeping my eyes peeled for the day MINI decides to build a Cooper 'S' automatic).
The CVT is a very interesting and efficient automatic transmission. In the regular Cooper it offers 3 program modes:
1) Normal mode (For city/urban driving and max fuel economy)
2) Sport Mode (For faster takeoffs from standstill/highway driving)
3) Simulated "6-speed" Steptronic mode (You can shift your very own pre-programmed six speed forward gears but without having to deal with a clutch pedal).
Since our MINI is still in the break in period, we have not used neither the Sport Mode or manual Steptronic. We'll do so after the 1,200 mile break in barrier is completed.
The main reason we bought the Cooper CVT is because my wife can't and won't drive a stick shift car, although I drive manual transmission and have been doing so for several years. Also, we are driving the MINI mainly in urban traffic conditions rendering dealing with a manual transmission a very tiresome and stressing task.
We couldn't be happier with our decision to get the Cooper CVT. In fact as the car begins to pile up miles, the engine/transmission just gets better and better.
Enjoy and good luck with your decision!
The CVT is a very interesting and efficient automatic transmission. In the regular Cooper it offers 3 program modes:
1) Normal mode (For city/urban driving and max fuel economy)
2) Sport Mode (For faster takeoffs from standstill/highway driving)
3) Simulated "6-speed" Steptronic mode (You can shift your very own pre-programmed six speed forward gears but without having to deal with a clutch pedal).
Since our MINI is still in the break in period, we have not used neither the Sport Mode or manual Steptronic. We'll do so after the 1,200 mile break in barrier is completed.
The main reason we bought the Cooper CVT is because my wife can't and won't drive a stick shift car, although I drive manual transmission and have been doing so for several years. Also, we are driving the MINI mainly in urban traffic conditions rendering dealing with a manual transmission a very tiresome and stressing task.
We couldn't be happier with our decision to get the Cooper CVT. In fact as the car begins to pile up miles, the engine/transmission just gets better and better.
Enjoy and good luck with your decision!
3rd Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Minnesota
Hey never fear, the Cooper is available in automatic, but you CAN learn to drive a stick. I was the worst at driving a stick, (my mom tried to get me to learn by getting all of my behind the wheel lessons in a stick, she and I had a battle of the wills and I ended up waiting until I was 18 to get my drivers license so I didn't have to take the stick lessons. I was so bad I was actually phobic.)
I test drove the automatic and it just lacked something. I asked to test drive the 5 speed manual--my husband was shocked. I test drove it and loved it. (I also stalled it and did a few nice loud gear grinds) I was scared to drive the car for the first 24 hours and now 9 days later, I am practally a pro! It isn't as hard as it seems it is just a matter of timing and coordination. I also went to the dealership several times before my car came and "test drove" their manuals to start to get a feel for it before my car ended up needing a new clutch!
I test drove the automatic and it just lacked something. I asked to test drive the 5 speed manual--my husband was shocked. I test drove it and loved it. (I also stalled it and did a few nice loud gear grinds) I was scared to drive the car for the first 24 hours and now 9 days later, I am practally a pro! It isn't as hard as it seems it is just a matter of timing and coordination. I also went to the dealership several times before my car came and "test drove" their manuals to start to get a feel for it before my car ended up needing a new clutch!
Coordinator :: South East - Florida
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From: Winter Haven, FL
Boy, this sounds familiar. LOL. I learned how to drive a stick when I was like 14...then I always had automatics, so I forgot how to drive a stick. Well, when I wanted a MINI, I decided I'd get a stick..
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Proud owner of a Chili Red MINI Cooper, named "Dolly"...white wheels, barely-legal tinting, white roof, and a "MINI FREAK" tag on the front. MOTOR ON, BABY!!
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Proud owner of a Chili Red MINI Cooper, named "Dolly"...white wheels, barely-legal tinting, white roof, and a "MINI FREAK" tag on the front. MOTOR ON, BABY!!
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>>The Cooper and the MINI One are available with an automatic. The "S" is not and I hop is never, no offense. It's a sports car and shouldn't be supressed by an autoshifter. Don't buy a sports car that is toned down, just spend some time in a '74 Gremlin w/ standard shift. It's inexpensive to buy and if you can learn in that you can drive any stick.
>>
>>Cheers :smile:
I respectufully disagree about your views of a MINI Cooper 'S' automatic. In fact there are a group of "Enthusiast" drivers outthere (Myself counted) that would love to get the extra power of the Cooper 'S' but do not wish to deal with the compromises of a manual transmission on a daily basis. Don't get me wrong, I myself have been meshing my own gears for many years and appreciate the power/control/driver involvement afforded by a stick shift, but I have grown sick and tired of depressing a clutch pedal 1 million times in bumper to bumper traffic..it just wears thin and fast!
I think there is a group of very selfish enthusiasts that are very vocal against the conception of an automatic Cooper 'S'...what about those disabled drivers that can't deal with a stick shift and still wish to enjoy the fine performance of a supercharger? What about those of us with spouses that can't drive a stick shift but still want the extra ponies afforded in the 'S' model?
It is not fair to belittle those of us who prefer the convenience/efficiency/stress free driving experience of a good automatic slushbox.
>>
>>Cheers :smile:
I respectufully disagree about your views of a MINI Cooper 'S' automatic. In fact there are a group of "Enthusiast" drivers outthere (Myself counted) that would love to get the extra power of the Cooper 'S' but do not wish to deal with the compromises of a manual transmission on a daily basis. Don't get me wrong, I myself have been meshing my own gears for many years and appreciate the power/control/driver involvement afforded by a stick shift, but I have grown sick and tired of depressing a clutch pedal 1 million times in bumper to bumper traffic..it just wears thin and fast!
I think there is a group of very selfish enthusiasts that are very vocal against the conception of an automatic Cooper 'S'...what about those disabled drivers that can't deal with a stick shift and still wish to enjoy the fine performance of a supercharger? What about those of us with spouses that can't drive a stick shift but still want the extra ponies afforded in the 'S' model?
It is not fair to belittle those of us who prefer the convenience/efficiency/stress free driving experience of a good automatic slushbox.
4th Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 319
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From: Florida
That's right! It's all about timing... If you're scared at first, just use the clutch a lot!!
Start applying pressure with your clutch foot a half-second before you move the gear shift...Don't take your foot off until you're sure you're in gear.
As you get the hang of it, you will find that you will start pressing the clutch in less and less!
I found the 5 speed on the MINI to be MUCH easier than the Mustangs I have owned...it is really much harder to grinf the gears. --must be the shorter throw distance or something.
PS. Reverse can be a bit annoying! I have found that reverse is almost always never "lined up" perfectly to go into gear first thing in the morning. I usually have to click mine into fourth, and then into Reverse!
Start applying pressure with your clutch foot a half-second before you move the gear shift...Don't take your foot off until you're sure you're in gear.
As you get the hang of it, you will find that you will start pressing the clutch in less and less!
I found the 5 speed on the MINI to be MUCH easier than the Mustangs I have owned...it is really much harder to grinf the gears. --must be the shorter throw distance or something.
PS. Reverse can be a bit annoying! I have found that reverse is almost always never "lined up" perfectly to go into gear first thing in the morning. I usually have to click mine into fourth, and then into Reverse!
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Coordinator :: Mid-Atlantic
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From: Baltiluthermonium
>>I respectufully disagree about your views of a MINI Cooper 'S' automatic. In fact there are a group of "Enthusiast" drivers outthere (Myself counted) that would love to get the extra power of the Cooper 'S' but do not wish to deal with the compromises of a manual transmission on a daily basis. Don't get me wrong, I myself have been meshing my own gears for many years and appreciate the power/control/driver involvement afforded by a stick shift, but I have grown sick and tired of depressing a clutch pedal 1 million times in bumper to bumper traffic..it just wears thin and fast!
>>
>>I think there is a group of very selfish enthusiasts that are very vocal against the conception of an automatic Cooper 'S'...what about those disabled drivers that can't deal with a stick shift and still wish to enjoy the fine performance of a supercharger? What about those of us with spouses that can't drive a stick shift but still want the extra ponies afforded in the 'S' model?
>>
>>It is not fair to belittle those of us who prefer the convenience/efficiency/stress free driving experience of a good automatic slushbox.
HERE HERE! You know I agree with that, Cooper4Us!
I personally love my CVT; it is perfect for my needs.
I know Shaskan does not mean offense....but it is just that kind of comment that really drives me nuts.
But I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion regardless of how snobbish it sounds.
_________________
Pure Silver/Black Cooper.....premium package, sport seats, fog lights, spoiler, 16" 5-spoke wheels....
Smaller is better!
>>
>>I think there is a group of very selfish enthusiasts that are very vocal against the conception of an automatic Cooper 'S'...what about those disabled drivers that can't deal with a stick shift and still wish to enjoy the fine performance of a supercharger? What about those of us with spouses that can't drive a stick shift but still want the extra ponies afforded in the 'S' model?
>>
>>It is not fair to belittle those of us who prefer the convenience/efficiency/stress free driving experience of a good automatic slushbox.
HERE HERE! You know I agree with that, Cooper4Us!
I personally love my CVT; it is perfect for my needs.
I know Shaskan does not mean offense....but it is just that kind of comment that really drives me nuts.
But I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion regardless of how snobbish it sounds.
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Pure Silver/Black Cooper.....premium package, sport seats, fog lights, spoiler, 16" 5-spoke wheels....
Smaller is better!
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Absolutely. I am just getting sick and tired of comments being thrown around stating that Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy and manual transmission = good/sporty/smart/fast.
Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Alaska
I did not intend to disrespect anyone who drives or wants to drive an automatic MCS. Perhaps I'm being a bit rash. I just see the MINI Cooper S as a rally racer and the sportyness of the MINI seems to call out for a stick shift.
I only laugh out of fun
Cheers
I only laugh out of fun
Cheers
Coordinator :: Mid-Atlantic
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From: Baltiluthermonium
On a side note......the car is technically not AUTOMATIC.....it also has a tiptronic mode, which is enough fun for me on the highway. Very good pick-up....I was surprised! I am one of those people that really lack in the manual tranny driving department, plus I live in the city. I could not have asked for a better car! :smile:
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>>I did not intend to disrespect anyone who drives or wants to drive an automatic MCS. Perhaps I'm being a bit rash. I just see the MINI Cooper S as a rally racer and the sportyness of the MINI seems to call out for a stick shift.
>>
>>I only laugh out of fun
>>Cheers
Apologies if I went over a bit hard on you....is just that there is a group of enthusiasts that are always coming up with dumb comments aimed at "Demonizing" the automatic transmission and those of us who prefer it for the reasons stated above. Choice is definetely good and the MINI affords ample choice in this regard. I just hope MINI decides to issue in the near future an automatic MCS perhaps with a CVT or sequential shifter...I woul dbe the first one in line to place an order!
>>
>>I only laugh out of fun
>>Cheers
Apologies if I went over a bit hard on you....is just that there is a group of enthusiasts that are always coming up with dumb comments aimed at "Demonizing" the automatic transmission and those of us who prefer it for the reasons stated above. Choice is definetely good and the MINI affords ample choice in this regard. I just hope MINI decides to issue in the near future an automatic MCS perhaps with a CVT or sequential shifter...I woul dbe the first one in line to place an order!
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>>On a side note......the car is technically not AUTOMATIC.....it also has a tiptronic mode, which is enough fun for me on the highway. Very good pick-up....I was surprised! I am one of those people that really lack in the manual tranny driving department, plus I live in the city. I could not have asked for a better car! :smile:
Yeah I couldn't agree more. However, the MINI CVT's Steptronic mode is not very intuitive at first due to the akward logic in order to shift(+) and Downshift(-). Still I prefer it to Chrysler's autostick (Side to side shifter motion) and Lexus' E-Shift mode which places the controls in the steering wheel (A la Formula 1) but makes diffcult performing quick up/downshifts when turning the wheel at the same time.
the day we picked up the car, our dealer wanted us to practice the Steptronic mode in one of their demo CVT Coopers.....interestingly enough, the second time I played with it and was able to do all up/downshifts very seamlessly and smoothly..is very fun once you get the hang of it. Can't wait to get out of the break in period to give it a good workout.
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Delived 9/7/02: '02 MINI Cooper, Pepper White, Black roof and mirrors, CVT, Multifunction Steering wheel, 8-Spoke 15" Wheels, STD black leatherette seats with Silver Gray door panels, STD painted bumpers (No Chrome accents). Having lots of fun!!!!
Yeah I couldn't agree more. However, the MINI CVT's Steptronic mode is not very intuitive at first due to the akward logic in order to shift(+) and Downshift(-). Still I prefer it to Chrysler's autostick (Side to side shifter motion) and Lexus' E-Shift mode which places the controls in the steering wheel (A la Formula 1) but makes diffcult performing quick up/downshifts when turning the wheel at the same time.
the day we picked up the car, our dealer wanted us to practice the Steptronic mode in one of their demo CVT Coopers.....interestingly enough, the second time I played with it and was able to do all up/downshifts very seamlessly and smoothly..is very fun once you get the hang of it. Can't wait to get out of the break in period to give it a good workout.
_________________
Delived 9/7/02: '02 MINI Cooper, Pepper White, Black roof and mirrors, CVT, Multifunction Steering wheel, 8-Spoke 15" Wheels, STD black leatherette seats with Silver Gray door panels, STD painted bumpers (No Chrome accents). Having lots of fun!!!!
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
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From: Lockport, NY, USA
>>Absolutely. I am just getting sick and tired of comments being thrown around stating that Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy and manual transmission = good/sporty/smart/fast.
>>
>>Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
>>
>>
Umm, automatics by their very nature are slow(er), and a manual in the hands of someone who can drive it is fast(er).. and theirfor sporty...
But I am also glad the MCS does not have a CVT... just like i'm glad it has a 6 speed, and not a 5 speed...
Rocketboy_X
>>
>>Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
>>
>>
Umm, automatics by their very nature are slow(er), and a manual in the hands of someone who can drive it is fast(er).. and theirfor sporty...
But I am also glad the MCS does not have a CVT... just like i'm glad it has a 6 speed, and not a 5 speed...
Rocketboy_X
5th Gear
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From: SoNo
Here here, Rocketboy. I prefer when to have my car downshift (or upshift for that matter), I don't want to leave it up to some preprogrammed nonsense. IMO, there is no other way to go. Can you imagine an automatic Porsche? What's the point?!
Coordinator :: Mid-Atlantic
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From: Baltiluthermonium
>>Here here, Rocketboy. I prefer when to have my car downshift (or upshift for that matter), I don't want to leave it up to some preprogrammed nonsense. IMO, there is no other way to go. Can you imagine an automatic Porsche? What's the point?!
You know....normally you are a nice guy, but here you insult the CVT owners......
You know....normally you are a nice guy, but here you insult the CVT owners......
>>[clip] Can you imagine an automatic Porsche? What's the point?!
Uhhhhh, I think they call those RACE CARS. Porsche developed the tiptronic AUTOMATIC transmission for racing. Other manufs have followed suit.
I love my 6 speed MCS, but I did recently drive a VW Passat with the tiptronic and it was quite nice. Unfortunately, I suspect that many owners of such-equipped Passats don't bother exploring the manual shift mode. But as everyone keeps saying here, to each his/her own!
Uhhhhh, I think they call those RACE CARS. Porsche developed the tiptronic AUTOMATIC transmission for racing. Other manufs have followed suit.
I love my 6 speed MCS, but I did recently drive a VW Passat with the tiptronic and it was quite nice. Unfortunately, I suspect that many owners of such-equipped Passats don't bother exploring the manual shift mode. But as everyone keeps saying here, to each his/her own!
Hey, when they come out with an auto in an 'S' I'll be down to get one. Hopefully they'll have the sport mode on the steering wheel with paddles. Automatics are the wave of the future. With the proper application of technology they can become more efficient than manual transmissions. Automatic or manual, doesn't matter, as long as it motors your MINI! 
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So what is the advantage of having a slick 6-speed manual shifter in urban bumper to bumper rush hour traffic?
Sure you can grow muscles in your left foot/leg....and then what else?
Perhaps I don't look at driving from the perspective of a "Closet track racer", but rather from the everyday experiences behind the wheel in public city streets where a manual transmission does not always give a clear advantage over a well calibrated automatic slushbox.
And I agree, automatics are the wave of the future. Manuals will soon be the domain of automotive museums, and the driving enthusiasts or 'purists', which by the way are a minority in this country.
_________________
Delived 9/7/02: '02 MINI Cooper, Pepper White, Black roof and mirrors, CVT, Multifunction Steering wheel, 8-Spoke 15" Wheels, STD black leatherette seats with Silver Gray door panels, STD painted bumpers (No Chrome accents). Having lots of fun!!!!
Sure you can grow muscles in your left foot/leg....and then what else?
Perhaps I don't look at driving from the perspective of a "Closet track racer", but rather from the everyday experiences behind the wheel in public city streets where a manual transmission does not always give a clear advantage over a well calibrated automatic slushbox.
And I agree, automatics are the wave of the future. Manuals will soon be the domain of automotive museums, and the driving enthusiasts or 'purists', which by the way are a minority in this country.
_________________
Delived 9/7/02: '02 MINI Cooper, Pepper White, Black roof and mirrors, CVT, Multifunction Steering wheel, 8-Spoke 15" Wheels, STD black leatherette seats with Silver Gray door panels, STD painted bumpers (No Chrome accents). Having lots of fun!!!!
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2002
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From: Redmond, WA
>>Absolutely. I am just getting sick and tired of comments being thrown around stating that Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy and manual transmission = good/sporty/smart/fast.
>>
>>Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
But "Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy and manual transmission = good/sporty/smart/fast" is my opinion. So how's that fit your logic?
Actually, I'm just playing devil's advocate - I guess I just don't get why you or anyone else cares what anyone thinks. You drive what you bought and you bought what you did for a reason.
I actually bought my first automatic this year. An '02 BMW 525i for my wife. This is also the first automatic she's driven. my impression of the automatic in the '02 BMW is "Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy" and actually convenient for stop and go, but I'm glad it's her car and not mine on a daily basis. :smile:
-dq
>>
>>Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion!
But "Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy and manual transmission = good/sporty/smart/fast" is my opinion. So how's that fit your logic?
Actually, I'm just playing devil's advocate - I guess I just don't get why you or anyone else cares what anyone thinks. You drive what you bought and you bought what you did for a reason.
I actually bought my first automatic this year. An '02 BMW 525i for my wife. This is also the first automatic she's driven. my impression of the automatic in the '02 BMW is "Automatic transmission = evil/dumb/slow/lazy" and actually convenient for stop and go, but I'm glad it's her car and not mine on a daily basis. :smile:
-dq
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2002
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Me too. I have ordered my MINI with CVT for the same reason. Shifting is fun but working in downtown stop and go traffic is a not.
>>We just took delivery of a new '02 MINI Cooper CVT a couple of weeks ago and the car has been terrific!. The CVT transmission (Stands for Continously Variable Transmission) features technology that makes it totally different from the typical automatic slushboxes found on most new cars today as it doesn't have any 'real' gears. The CVT tranny can only be purchased on the Standard Cooper (As a $1275 option) and it is not currently available in the Cooper 'S', unfortunately (I am keeping my eyes peeled for the day MINI decides to build a Cooper 'S' automatic).
>>
>>The CVT is a very interesting and efficient automatic transmission. In the regular Cooper it offers 3 program modes:
>>1) Normal mode (For city/urban driving and max fuel economy)
>>2) Sport Mode (For faster takeoffs from standstill/highway driving)
>>3) Simulated "6-speed" Steptronic mode (You can shift your very own pre-programmed six speed forward gears but without having to deal with a clutch pedal).
>>
T
>>
>>Since our MINI is still in the break in period, we have not used neither the Sport Mode or manual Steptronic. We'll do so after the 1,200 mile break in barrier is completed.
>>
>>The main reason we bought the Cooper CVT is because my wife can't and won't drive a stick shift car, although I drive manual transmission and have been doing so for several years. Also, we are driving the MINI mainly in urban traffic conditions rendering dealing with a manual transmission a very tiresome and stressing task.
>>
>>We couldn't be happier with our decision to get the Cooper CVT. In fact as the car begins to pile up miles, the engine/transmission just gets better and better.
>>
>>Enjoy and good luck with your decision!
>>We just took delivery of a new '02 MINI Cooper CVT a couple of weeks ago and the car has been terrific!. The CVT transmission (Stands for Continously Variable Transmission) features technology that makes it totally different from the typical automatic slushboxes found on most new cars today as it doesn't have any 'real' gears. The CVT tranny can only be purchased on the Standard Cooper (As a $1275 option) and it is not currently available in the Cooper 'S', unfortunately (I am keeping my eyes peeled for the day MINI decides to build a Cooper 'S' automatic).
>>
>>The CVT is a very interesting and efficient automatic transmission. In the regular Cooper it offers 3 program modes:
>>1) Normal mode (For city/urban driving and max fuel economy)
>>2) Sport Mode (For faster takeoffs from standstill/highway driving)
>>3) Simulated "6-speed" Steptronic mode (You can shift your very own pre-programmed six speed forward gears but without having to deal with a clutch pedal).
>>
T
>>
>>Since our MINI is still in the break in period, we have not used neither the Sport Mode or manual Steptronic. We'll do so after the 1,200 mile break in barrier is completed.
>>
>>The main reason we bought the Cooper CVT is because my wife can't and won't drive a stick shift car, although I drive manual transmission and have been doing so for several years. Also, we are driving the MINI mainly in urban traffic conditions rendering dealing with a manual transmission a very tiresome and stressing task.
>>
>>We couldn't be happier with our decision to get the Cooper CVT. In fact as the car begins to pile up miles, the engine/transmission just gets better and better.
>>
>>Enjoy and good luck with your decision!
3rd Gear
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 156
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From: Redondo Beach
>>We just took delivery of a new '02 MINI Cooper CVT a couple of weeks ago and the car has been terrific!. The CVT transmission (Stands for Continously Variable Transmission) features technology that makes it totally different from the typical automatic slushboxes found on most new cars today as it doesn't have any 'real' gears. The CVT tranny can only be purchased on the Standard Cooper (As a $1275 option) and it is not currently available in the Cooper 'S', unfortunately....
When I read this, I was really glad we were getting input from someone who bought, and enjoys, the MINI with the CVT. Very interesting technology; and Audi (in particular) is now using this very CVT concept on cars in the 300HP class. That's one fast "automatic"!
One of the amusing things about modern cars & technology is how things sometimes work out "differently" than we normally anticipate. For example, the "norm" for sporty cars has always been "more" performance, "more" gears, and always MANUAL transmissions! We (wife, son & I) still have only had cars with manual transmissions; and I find them to be generally more enjoyable; despite having to commute in the LA rush-hour!
What's "amusing", however, is that at the upper edges of the automotive food chain the car designers are finding that the "DRIVER" is now becoming the limiting factor to improved performance. And not just because they're designing for the average person who needs to commute to work. Michael Schumacher (Five Times Formula 1 World Champion) drives an "automatic" as his "work" car; an 800HP F1 Ferrari. And Ferrari's latest "supercar" (the "Enzo" also is ONLY available with an "automatic". Ditto for the World Rally Championship cars of Ford, Peugeot, Subaru, etc (which look very much like future competition for a racing version of the MINI).
Now, it's true... Michael's F1 Ferrari doesn't have a lever that moves between "Park" and "Drive". But, it's also true that he has no clutch pedal! Most of these cars use "sequential" gearboxes that allow VERY fast, VERY precise, COMPLETELY automated gearshifts... very much like the "+" , "-" mode of the MINI CVT box (although using a completely different internal mechanism). If Mikey wants to shift up, he hits one paddle; to shift down, he hits another. Just like us mortals!
Now, "when" (sigh) I finally get my MINI Cooper S, it'll come with a 6 speed transmission. They're just so darned fun! It's like playing a musical instrument; where part of the enjoyment is practicing and mastering the art of certain specific movements.
However....
if I look in my rear view mirror in a year or two, and see that MINI has introduced CVT-powered "S" cars... I'm CERTAINLY not going to assume they're going to be driven slowly or lazily!!
_________________
David G
When I read this, I was really glad we were getting input from someone who bought, and enjoys, the MINI with the CVT. Very interesting technology; and Audi (in particular) is now using this very CVT concept on cars in the 300HP class. That's one fast "automatic"!
One of the amusing things about modern cars & technology is how things sometimes work out "differently" than we normally anticipate. For example, the "norm" for sporty cars has always been "more" performance, "more" gears, and always MANUAL transmissions! We (wife, son & I) still have only had cars with manual transmissions; and I find them to be generally more enjoyable; despite having to commute in the LA rush-hour!
What's "amusing", however, is that at the upper edges of the automotive food chain the car designers are finding that the "DRIVER" is now becoming the limiting factor to improved performance. And not just because they're designing for the average person who needs to commute to work. Michael Schumacher (Five Times Formula 1 World Champion) drives an "automatic" as his "work" car; an 800HP F1 Ferrari. And Ferrari's latest "supercar" (the "Enzo"
also is ONLY available with an "automatic". Ditto for the World Rally Championship cars of Ford, Peugeot, Subaru, etc (which look very much like future competition for a racing version of the MINI).Now, it's true... Michael's F1 Ferrari doesn't have a lever that moves between "Park" and "Drive". But, it's also true that he has no clutch pedal! Most of these cars use "sequential" gearboxes that allow VERY fast, VERY precise, COMPLETELY automated gearshifts... very much like the "+" , "-" mode of the MINI CVT box (although using a completely different internal mechanism). If Mikey wants to shift up, he hits one paddle; to shift down, he hits another. Just like us mortals!
Now, "when" (sigh) I finally get my MINI Cooper S, it'll come with a 6 speed transmission. They're just so darned fun! It's like playing a musical instrument; where part of the enjoyment is practicing and mastering the art of certain specific movements.
However....
if I look in my rear view mirror in a year or two, and see that MINI has introduced CVT-powered "S" cars... I'm CERTAINLY not going to assume they're going to be driven slowly or lazily!!
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David G
4th Gear
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 468
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From: San Diego, CA
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>>What's "amusing", however, is that at the upper edges of the automotive food chain the car designers are finding that the "DRIVER" is now becoming the limiting factor to improved performance. And not just because they're designing for the average person who needs to commute to work. Michael Schumacher (Five Times Formula 1 World Champion) drives an "automatic" as his "work" car; an 800HP F1 Ferrari. And Ferrari's latest "supercar" (the "Enzo"
also is ONLY available with an "automatic". Ditto for the World Rally Championship cars of Ford, Peugeot, Subaru, etc (which look very much like future competition for a racing version of the MINI).>>David G
Exactly what I wanted to say, David! When Chapparal won races with a GM slushbox, and gained fractionally on the straights because the driver didn't shift!, I wanted that, I said. I've driven more shift cars than I care to remember, including a whole lotta Minis, and this CVT is the best tranny out there. True engine braking, no heell & toe, no synchro-grinding. I still love a stick, but let's face it, almost none of us are "Quick Vic" Elford, who could move his hand faster than the best tranny could handle, and if Schumacher and the rest of the best use one, well, hell who am I to say what's better. Maybe shifters are for those backward, non-technicals who can't figure out how to program a VCR!
HeHe! Try commuting in real slow, steep uphill traffic, and when you get that new clutch job thousands of miles early, with an overhaul as well, I'll relax and enjoy the drive past the service center.I love my CVT - it's the future, right now.
BCNU,
Rob in Dago
2nd Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
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15% of Americans drive a manual. Is automatic the fututre? Of course. Will manual still exist? Of course. There will always be that option, because people (granted, a minority) will always want them, because as nice and precise as an automatic can be, or as similar as a tripronic can get, it doesn't change the fact that nothing can completely replicate the feel of a nice manual. It's all I drive. It also helps that manuals are always much cheaper.
As for the MINIs, I have a MCS, for one reason and one reason alone: 6 speed. If I was going to get a MC, it would definately be with the CVT, because I think it's an awesome concept. But the 6 speed is a much different experience than is commonly offered right now. Of the top of my head, I know that newer Mustang GTs are available in 6 speed (but not standard, we have the advantage there). There's probably others, I just can't think of them for now.
By the way, I saw someone in another post mention something about the CVT just not being physically able to handle the torque produced by the MCS. I'm not an expert on that, so don't quote me, but if that's true, I'm sure that's the one and only reason that we don't have a CVT MCS.
As for the MINIs, I have a MCS, for one reason and one reason alone: 6 speed. If I was going to get a MC, it would definately be with the CVT, because I think it's an awesome concept. But the 6 speed is a much different experience than is commonly offered right now. Of the top of my head, I know that newer Mustang GTs are available in 6 speed (but not standard, we have the advantage there). There's probably others, I just can't think of them for now.
By the way, I saw someone in another post mention something about the CVT just not being physically able to handle the torque produced by the MCS. I'm not an expert on that, so don't quote me, but if that's true, I'm sure that's the one and only reason that we don't have a CVT MCS.
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Joined: Aug 2002
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From: California
According to all the information I have found on the CVT. BMW is using a steel belted CVT. Which eliminates the bad porformance of the older CVT Type trannies.
The steel belted CVT's should be able to handle up to 260 lbs of torque. Which I think even in the MCS the Cooper CVT should be able to handle.
I know one thing though. That in the autocross I am happy with the CVT I can grab any gear down shifting into a turn and know that on the other end I do not have to worry about shifting out because it will do this for me. It forces me to keep the RPM between 4000 and 6000 rpm's. Now it always shifts at 6100 rpm. So I can not take it past this but anything more is out of the top of the power curve anyway.
It did take me a while to get used to the CVT. But, this goes with any car.
I know with the CVT the shift points are programable. But, I get my best performance in excelleration when I shift before the 6100 mark. Would I experince better performance if I could go up to 7000+ rpm's? I do not know yet.
In the manual is there a rev limiter? Or can you all take it above 6100 rpms? If you can will the ECU allow you to go over 7000 rpms?
The steel belted CVT's should be able to handle up to 260 lbs of torque. Which I think even in the MCS the Cooper CVT should be able to handle.
I know one thing though. That in the autocross I am happy with the CVT I can grab any gear down shifting into a turn and know that on the other end I do not have to worry about shifting out because it will do this for me. It forces me to keep the RPM between 4000 and 6000 rpm's. Now it always shifts at 6100 rpm. So I can not take it past this but anything more is out of the top of the power curve anyway.
It did take me a while to get used to the CVT. But, this goes with any car.
I know with the CVT the shift points are programable. But, I get my best performance in excelleration when I shift before the 6100 mark. Would I experince better performance if I could go up to 7000+ rpm's? I do not know yet.
In the manual is there a rev limiter? Or can you all take it above 6100 rpms? If you can will the ECU allow you to go over 7000 rpms?