OK, I dont understand this comment.

The magazine tests the car and got some numbers. Maybe the numbers are not what you want to hear.

So are you insulted by the numbers or the magazine?

 

I think he's referring to the tone of the copy, not the actual performance numbers. A lot of times you can tell when the writer doesn't like the car at all, as opposed to giving an objective review.

Sometimes they even verge on "joke" reviews; look up C&D's review of the Escalade trunk thing as an example (it's immensely funny, but the poor beast STILL deserves a fair review...)

 

I have to say, lots of folks are just a bit too worried about what Car&Driver has to say. I read & enjoy their magazine, but just because they say something doesn't make it so. It's only their opinion & that is all it is. Whose opinion is more important? Car & Drivers or yours?

 

My wife's.

 

You sound like a man whose marriage is safe. Gotta compromise I say.

 

Got it. Yeah, auto journalists are human beings like everyone else and I would imagine they should review things objectively (and numbers are objective) but personal preferences will show up subjectively.

Got it

I guess I'll have to read it when it goes online!

 

I'm looking forward to reading the article when my C/D arrives in a few days. Remember that the writers at C&D always inject subjective opinions about the cars - and they should - it generally makes for more entertaining reading (otherwise you might as well read Consumer Reports) although sometimes it stings if your particular ox is being gored. As several have pointed out, pure performance numbers are achieved by revving the engine, dumping the clutch and generally abusing the machinery in a manner that most owners would not consider - it helps to check the rolling start 5mpg to 60mph numbers for more "real world" accelaration comparison. Most drivers on the street, if they're honest with themselvers, simply do not drive at anywhere near 9/10s, or in a manner that makes the absolute numbers comparisons particularly relevant to their enjoyment of the car - and like it or not, that's where some of the "subjective" opinion about how easily a car handles in spirited driving comes in.

 

And C&D tends to try to get the quickest numbers. I have read its to get more readership ... lower numbers ... happier owners ...
But they are just doing their jobs. Who knows.

 

Yep, it's not the fact that they place it third out of 6, it's the tone.

Examples, The quickness of the controls is fun right up until it's not"

"Let's just say the MINI is great fun if you think it is"

They complain about the stability control instead of just turning it off.

"It's styled to the bleeding edge"

"but then you begin to notice how self-conscious it is"

You'll see more examples when you get a chance to read the test.

I think he hated the MINI, but felt he couldn't place it any lower than 3rd because it performed very well.

 

Yeah, thats subjective personal impressions.

He's doing his job, as others have said, otherwise it would be boring. But, for example, R&T in its reviews tells you outright if someone is, for example, a Vette fan and hence give more one-sided reviews.

You got a point

 

I'm still ho-humming, but the fact that I'm here probably means a R56 is in my near future.

After spending plenty of time driving the MS3, GTI, MCS, WRX (and some others I won't even mention) I found the MS3 to be simply the best "car". It does everything well, but it doesn't come accross as "fun" as the MCS.

Now the GTI's new transmission is the new benchmark for all other transmissions to be compared to. If it weren't for VW's bad reputation, it would be on my list. I hope Mini will have a transmission similar in it's near future. That's something I would wait for.

WRX STi was amazing, but costed too much more. And the depreciation stinks. Obviously many who buy a WRX STi only does so for rally purposes and therefore trashes them. That and they're butt ugly.

Ok i'm just droning on and on.. I'll stop now.


No really, there was no point in what I just wrote.

 

For what its worth if you eliminate the ones for rear seat space/width/legroom and trunk MINI would be at or near the top. All in all some fair comments. I'm used to love GTIs but the miserable reliablity sent me elsewhere ten years ago.

 

C&D is a good source for info re trucks; cars, not so much. I spent a lot of time, money, and effort to make my last car what they might call "twitchy and difficult to control on the twisties." I called it quick handling with excellent feedback through the wheels. I used to consider the car mag reviews a good source of info. But over time I've changed my mind. Of the cars that I drove that they had reviewed I often felt that they had missed the boat. I also feel sure that car makers that buy lots of display ads tend to get better reviews than those who do not. For each of us, we are the best reviewer when choosing a car.

Happy trails,

Joe S

 

I don't know why they had such a problem with interior room. I find the Mini to provide plenty of room up front. I also love the stylishness of the interior. The interior was a major selling point for me.

 

hehe, hate to say it (admitedly another mazda fan, I own a regular 3, but I've test driven a speed3 without the salesman in the car), but the Speed3 will munch a mini on just about anything but an autocross course, even my wife's R53 JCW. The mini has that fun to drive characteristic that no other car can get that you either appreciate or you don't, this writer clearly didn't, but that doesn't diminish it.

As an R53 owner, I still can't get over the funky styling of the R56, but I was very impressed with its performance numbers, and I figured with the crazy BMW bias that C&D usually exhibits, it would have finished higher.

And about the size, most people if faced with two cars that accelerate and brake the same and handle similarly for the same price, one bigger than the other, they choose the bigger car. Mini owners are clearly different, but recognize, to most, size is a positive thing (I happen to think its a negative, but then again, my wife owns a mini).

 

Probably they didn't like it because it's so "different".

The article was filled with sarcastic and subjective comments about the MINI. I think the writer hated the MINI before he even tested it, and just wanted to make sure he backed up his original bias.

 

I must say that they have come up with the right result in the rating - lets face it, our Minis are not as roomy, are on the pricy side (especially once you start clicking the add-on buttons you quickly get to $30K and if it comes to performance, you are very close to faster competitors), you either like the interior design and exterior looks and none of the other cars is even a consideration or you think it is too gimicky, in which case one is much better off with the dime-a-dozen, run-off-the-mill look of the GTI, Mazdaspeed, etc.

Personally, I did not even consider any of those, never mind going to the dealer to look at it - I just love the individualism and charm of the Mini. While it is is fast and fun, the last thing that I need is to try to outrace some 18year old in their GTI at a red traffic light - who cares (there are pickup trucks out there that go to 60mph in 5 seconds.
What the Mini has an in my opinion none of the others is the "put-a-smile-on-your-face" feature that comes from the combination of great looks, unique details, fun performance and individualism ....

 

I bet if the MINI had won the comparison C/D would be a great publication.

mb

 

So true.

It doesnt bother me that C&D or any other reviewer dislike the MINI. Their opinion is just that, their opinion. Plenty of people dislike cars that arent the mainstream. Uniqueness in of itself can be seen as a negative. I dont know that I would want MINI's to be as common as say Honda's or Mazda's.

 

Anyone who thinks the article is unfair, is clearly overly biased towards MINIs.

It's okay that there are other cars out there that actually are better than our cars!

It's okay that other people have other opinions.

Move on with your lives, and just go enjoy driving your MINI.

Why do you feel that you have to preach to the choir (us NAM'ers), about one magazine review? All of us reading these posts agree that the MINI is a great car, but some of us have a hard time realizing that we're all MINI fanatics; otherwise, we wouldn't be frittering away our time day and night on NAM. Most importantly, not everyone shares our opinion of the car, (nor do they have to)!

This article is not unfair; if anything it is accurate to the car-buying public's outlook on all the assembled cars. The MINI is not everyone's cup of tea, and that's okay!

 

Not true for me. I have a problem with the wise-*ss and condescending attitude of the reviewer...if you haven't actually read the review yet, check it out.

 

Its still a Mazda...built in some farmhouse in a rural area in Japan.

Who cares? Who the hell drives Mazdas anyway?

The MINI is a cultural icon, the Mazda is not. The Mazda is flavor of the month, much like the Dodge SRT-4 and the Cobalt SS.

No will care, nor will anyone remember the vehicle in 2-3 years.

And lets not forget, Mazdaspeed was the same group that produced turds like the Mazda MP3 and the infamous Mazdaspeed-plastic-Protege.

 

Sinthanius, I think your last post qualifies you as one of these:

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ad.php?t=96206

where are all these "rural areas of japan" you speak of, hahaha

Lots of people drive mazdas (I do), and Mazda has brought such cars as the Miata (arguably a more historically significant icon than the mini) as well as the monster that was the Twin Turbo FD RX-7 (1993-1995).

The MP3 a turd? Its faster through the slalom than a Porsche GT2 for under $20k, hardly a turd in my book, same with the Mazdaspeed protege (an excellent handling, quick economy car that can make bring some more expensive sports cars to their knees on the right course). I will also remind you, Mazdaspeed brought us the 787B, the only Japanese car (and only rotary powered) car to ever win LeMans. If this is the type of attitude you take towards mazdas, you need to do a little reading on what is a fine, proud brand.

Not to mention, thats awful condescending talk about the SRT-4 and the Cobalt SS, considering they would slaughter your mini. . .

don't get me wrong, I like minis (my wife has a 2006 JCW R53 and I love it, if she'd just let me drive it more), but you've got to put things in a little perspective or you just come off as an arrogant snob instead of a true automobile enthusiast.

 

I like Mazda's as well, the wife loves and has owned a couple 626s over the last 18 years. She really wanted me to get the Mazdaspeed 3 or the Miata, but I exercised my veto power (very rarely allowed or used) and choose the MINI. The Mazdas have given us many years of good service and we've had no trouble keeping them in good shape. We even bought our daughter a Protege. However, since the MINI will be my daily driver, it came down to what I prefered.

 

Ruby - I own a Dodge SRT-4 and a fairly modified Integra GSR.

The MP3 is a turd, if you consider blue sway bars and a 1985 jukebox sub-woofer in the trunk a great car, you, my friend need to drive some more cars.

As far as arrogance goes, hell yes! There is no reason not be. And my arrogance is not directed towards the Mazda [FONT=&quot]enthusiasts [/FONT], rather the reviewer for C & D.