Hey, so i just read this reiew of the R56 by Jeremy Clarkson. Its a good read. He in the end is fond of the car, but thinks the non function hood scoop is bad [but understands they're putting a bigger engine in sometime where it will be come usefull?] and he thinks its a tad pricey.

http://driving.timesonline.co.uk/tol...cle1394750.ece

And in it he said that when drove it, he found that he turned the traction controll, [ im assuming this is the DSC?], off. Now why would he do that! For racing on his ttrack? Can you not powerslide with it on?

" I also grew rather tired of the traction control, which if it were human would be king of the Health and Safety Executive, a high visibility control freak whose job was to make sure you never tripped over anything. Mostly, I turned it off."-Clarkson

-Dave

 

When the traction control comes on the car jerks or shudders until the traction is sufficient. In my less than full on test drive this happened twice. The engine has such good torque at low speeds I could see if you are driving for fun or not used to it, this could be annoying.

 

What I can't figure out is why any experienced driver (like Clarkson) would want to leave the traction control on when pushing the car to its limits? On any sporty cars I've owned with traction control, one of the first things I did when starting out every time was to switch off the traction control. Unless I'm driving on snow or ice, I'd rather not have it on, ever. Too many electronic nannys drive me nuts. I'd just aas soon not have ABS on most of my cars, but I don't really have much of a choice anymore.

-Keith

 

I have DSS on my 02 MCS and hate it - whenever there is any wheel spin it kills the engine power. I keep forgetting to turn it off when starting and then find it kicking in at the most inconvenient times - you are briskly pulling out into traffic and the engine suddenly feels like you can't get more than 50% power. My next car will definitely not have DSS but I can understand needing it if you live in the snow belt.

The other problem I have with DSS is that you can't have DSS off with ABS on.

 

So i think when i turn on my r56, i will hit the sports button and the DSC buttong, turning sports on and turning dsc off! [its sitting in NY now, waiting to come down to DE]

 

This is my concern as I look at options for a possible MC/MCS purchase. But doesn't the standard ASC still step in with traction control even if you don't order DSC? Is the standard ASC less agressive than the DSC?

 

That's an awsome question. Any Mini Engineers trolling want to whisper the answer to someone so they can trickle it back to us.

My first guess would be that DSC is watching many more factors, like pitch, yaw, 4 wheels' revolution speed, steering angle, vehicle's direction and which way it's pointed relative to that, throttle position, engine speed, etc. Unfortunately all this information seems to be a little too complex of a formula, because in the end if you encounter a ripple in the road as you're turning onto it, DSC can freak out and let the wind out of your sail pronto. It's honestly not as bad as some folks might make it out to be, and I'd only disable it when you're trying to behave like Fangio, like at a track, autocross, or for a brief 10 seconds at a stoplight dragrace. After that, put the DSC on and leave it on. It's like a seatbelt; you won't know when you're going to need it until 10 seconds after the crash.

My guess is that ASC is more targetted at helping your car pull away from a stop in slippery weather by feathering the brake a bit on the wheel that's slipping to help transmit power to the other wheel and prevent the one that's slipping from digging itself a hole in the snow.

 

Bear in mind that the "expensive" bit will apply to UK prices for the car which are significantly higher than those in the US.

 

You are right looks like there is no way to avoid engine-killing electronics without having to remember to turn something off every time you start the car

 

I was careful to order my car without DSC. I've never driven a car with such a system, but I have a general antipathy to gadgets that suddenly do something to "help" me. After all, if part of the reason for choosing a particular car is to have fun, why pay to have a device that is designed to spoil the fun? Who wants to have to turn off a gadget whenever they start their car?

Another point: is there any juried research that shows that vehicle control systems are an effective measure for increasing safety or reducing the number or severity of accidents?

Happy motoring,
[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][/SIZE]
Joe s

 

I read that DSC/traction control was going to be manditory in the US in a number of years (maybe 2010?) due to it's preceived assistance in reducing crash severity and accident avoidance.
I searched traction control prior to ordering my S and found that tidbit but I don't remember where.

 

"Perceived assistance" is a long way from juried research. None the less, it is interesting that its use will become mandatory. The perception that ABS would provide for safer cars and a lower number of fatal accidents seemed obvious, but the facts show that ABS has made very little difference in safety and reduction of motoring fatalities.

It seems strange to me, and I would always want ABS in any new road car that I bought. Are there still any cars sold in the US that lack ABS? I believe that the majority of auto accidents result from poor judgment, inattention or divided attention, and poor driver skills. I have sometimes ridden with drivers who struck me as likely to have accidents, and for the most part, they did. Most of the track or autox drivers I've ridden with are very safe and their driving makes for relaxed passengers.

After your research how did you order your car? As noted in an earlier post, I did not order DSC on my MCS. I liked having the option to do without it.

Happy trails,

Joe s

 

If you are a normal driver doing commuting on the street then you can leave the DSC or traction control on and never have to turn it off. It's part of the design of the car and offers a measure of passive safety under normal driving situations for the bulk of us.

If you are a performance junkie driving your car to the limit then you don't want to have electronic limitations that would affect your control of the car including when testing the car. Turning off DSC is appropriate and advised.

Some interesting links-
http://driving.timesonline.co.uk/tol...icle785747.ece
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-lock_braking_system
(see risk compensation)
http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/vrtc/ca/lvabs.htm

ABS has it's limits-
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=2006
http://www.abs-education.org/news/nwnhtsa.htm

Modern cars with optional ABS-
2007 Toyota Yaris
2007 Suzuki Reno
2006/2007 Chevrolet Aveo LS sedan
2006 Saturn Ion
2006 Hyundai Sonata GL
2005 Chevrolet Cobalt
and others- just don't have one in front or in back of you on the road.