I agree with this. I have an auto non-S and the majority of my driving is rush hour, stop n go, stoplight or stop sign every few blocks. To give you an idea, my 8 mile drive to work is taking me between 45 minutes to 1 hour lately. The sport button is an absolute must for this kind of driving.

As for the original question, there were a lot of reasons I picked the non-S over an S. I wanted a convertible and my finances were such that I could either get the convertible or the S. Couldn't do both. I decided that the performance to cost ratio was not enough to justify getting the S instead of a convertible. Also, the reliability aspect came into play and even though neither is rated as being particularly reliable, the non-S seemed to be more reliable than the S.

Also, my last car was a rocketship. Saturn Sky redline, 0-60 in approx 5 seconds or less, 300 hp. That was my midlife crisis car and when I bought it, I went for the top of the line, fastest model available. When I traded it for the Mini I decided I no longer needed the fastest model available, just something practical, reliable, but still fun, hence the convertible.

Do I miss the 180hp I gave up? Sure. Going from 300hp to 120hp was a big drop. It was nice to be able to pull away from any car short of a vette or a porsche or one of the few cars that could keep up with it, but day to day driving, I don't really need that much power. It was just a matter of fun.

Bottom line, while I miss having all that extra hp the Sky gave me, a Mini S would have still fallen short so no regrets here. I'm perfectly happy with my non-S convertible.

 

Wow I'm surprised to see how many people say the sport button is a joke. Not trying to bash anyone else's opinions but personally I love the sport button, not really because it makes it feel faster or tightens the steering, but the way it changes the throttle response, and the way I coordinate with my feet I guess. With sport mode off, I tended to have some rough shifts, and i tried it with the sport button on one day and it was a complete night and day difference. I was able to match shifts near perfect every time, heel-toe while braking into a turn, blip-ing the throttle before turns, much easier and it just felt a whole lot smoother. It must just be my driving style, but I am 100% smoother with the clutch/throttle with sport mode on. People get in and are amazed to never feel a shift, up or down because I can match RPMs with no problems, sometimes if i'm driving nice and easy and casually I won't even use the clutch, not a grind or jolt, can't even tell the difference...every so often I will forgot to push the button and all hell breaks loose. It's just the timing of the RPMs with my feet I guess.

Just some extra food for thought on the sport button, use that info as you wish.

 

Since I haven't tracked my car (yet.) and I've never road raced an S, I can't say who's faster through the corners, but I know that on the empty twisties my R50 goes like hell, and is not slow out of the apex by any means. I have driven S cars on the same roads and they don't feel any faster when the curves get tight. That's why I gave the '08 S back to the dealership instead of trading "up."

To be fair, I credit the mods I have done with much of the Smile Factor of my car. It was fun when I got it, but now it is FUN. I have a set of ST Coilovers waiting to be installed in the spring, and then it will be a real treat.

Like many said, there are a lot of faster cars, both straight line and in tight handling.

 

I personally rarely use the sport button my MCS. Being it starts building boost way to low in the RPM range for me, therefore creating extra heat and being inefficient below 3000 RPM. I also like the feeling that when I step on the gas I notice the turbo spool and kick in.

I use the sport button when climbing hills cause it just makes it easier, but on a day to day i do not use it. My car seems slower with the sport button on.

I also dyno'd with the sport button on and off.. and I made the most power with the sport button off.. which I find a little weird.

My personal experience is to not use it unless I am climbing a hill and dont want to shift a ton.. other than that I dont use it all.

Oh I am a Manual trans MCS.

 

We've owned three MINIs - 2 Justas and one S convert. My next will be a non-S coupe. The plain old MINI is plenty fast and perky for me. Love the much much better gas mileage and one less thing to worry about breaking. If I were still a single 20 year old, I'd feel the opposite. As a 60 year old I don't need to impress anybody anymore. (little secret from an old guy - girls don't really give a hoot about what you drive)

 

I dont know why non-s owners say they get better gas mileage.. I drove from SLC,UT to Big Bear Lake, CA on a little over a tank. i was getting 44.1 MPG and thats hand calc not OBC and I was averaging 65-75mph.

With that being said I know Justa's get similar gas mileage but I also have another 100WHP more than a justa. So MPG shouldnt really be an argument.. they are direct injection motors they are known to get great gas mileage when you are not on it.


I would have to disagree greatly with the above statement based on dating and being that 22 yr old guy still out womanizing in the world. Lots of girls care about what you drive, no girl wants to be picked up in a POS.. and I must say most girls enjoy the feeling of being pushed back in their seats. This could i guess vary based on where you live, the kind of girls you choose to date, etc. SO I cant call it a standard, but I have been told by many girls to them it matters.

Speed makes the panties drop

 

For new MINIs, the whole question about the Sport Button is kinda moot. The button is now standard, and as far as I can tell you cannot get a 2012 (or late 2011?) without the button.

I know that when I was working on the 2011 configurator for my car, the Sport Button was not something you could even get rid of!

 

I never needed a car to get laid, but that's just me

 

Probably my favorite post in this thread. haha.


No one needs one, but its always nice to have an upper hand.

 

I love my automatic Non-S and I use my sport button all the time. I use it when cranking through the back roads and when merging into traffic as well as cranking around the entrance and exit ramps. I use it all the time when climbing the mountains around my home. I find it incredibly useful and makes the car a whole new level of fun.

 

I guess the sport button is more appealing to those without a manual gearbox.

I personally drive manuals because in my opinion.. you drive a manual car and an automatic car drives you. There is a disconnect between car and driver with an automatic that seems non-existent in my manual.

Now I know some people sit in a lot of traffic and all that so automatic works for them, but it seems some you are very avid "sport" drivers so it seems odd more wouldnt have went to a manual gearbox for just that.

 

I needed to get an automatic for my wife, she can't drive stick. This replaced my 5spd Supercharged Saturn Ion Redline and my 6spd Manual Cadillac CTS-V is sitting in the garage. Its nice to have fun in my commute without constantly shifting.

 

I wasnt putting you down or dissing your purchase as I know there are reasons people buy autos like the one above. I assume its mainly her car then being you seem to be very die hard american cars.

I bet the CTS-V is some fun to drive, I used to love horsing around with CTS-Vs in my VW. They never expected me to pull on them like i did.

 

Seems like we are beating a dead horse here with S vs Justa, sport vs non-sport and stick vs auto... but still:

 

It's okay, the advertisers love it.

 

No, I didn't take it in any negative way. Its primarily my car, she uses it when she has to steal an illegal parking spot at work. This car was the biggest surprise for me because exactly what you said. I'm a big horsepower american car guy, and I have so much fun in this little car. The V is awesome but I can empty the tank in one day. I reserve it to its thrashing sessions and when it time to go out on the town, so-to-speak. Being able to drive this little car any way I want and get over a week out of the fuel has its charms. If I bought an S, it would leave the door open to all the modifications, that I tend to do. This keeps my life a little simpler. I loved surprising other cars with my Redline. No one expected a Saturn to do anything like mine did.

 

IIRC the saturn is the same as the early cobalt SS's (SC not TC). They can be fun little cars, personally they do not appeal to my visual desires but again to each their own. The new turbo cobalt SS's can do some serious work stock turbo though.. 12 second cars with a few mods and tune.. cant go wrong their except the idea its a cobalt is what turns me off to them. I had a 6.0L GTO for a little while and yeah as mileage in that thing was a little ridiculous haha. Thats why I am such a fan of turbo'd 4 cylinders.. great power and great MPG. But one of the funnest cars I have had was my GT30R Evo 8 450AWHP and a blast.

A modded S is a little rocket though, I am quite excited for the coming months where I will being full forging the motor and adding cams, larger turbo and a few other go fast goodies. hahaha.

Being in a small car that people generally write off and then shaking up their world a little bit seems to never get old. Just like the feeling of boost.. I am addicted to that feeling haha.

I used to be really into american cars, and then I took a few of my friends euro cars through some canyons and have been hooked ever since. Something in their engineering even on base models seems to just have the great feel to it. Whether it be MINI, BMW, VW, AUDI, etc.

 

I loved my little Saturn. It was edging 300 hp and it surprised a lot of people. The Recaros in that car were awesome. The new turbo set up is amazing and has so much potential its incredible. If I had an S, I wouldn't be able to restrain myself with upgrades. Eventually when my son doesn't fit behind my seat anymore, I'll upgrade to a Clubman S and the upgrading will begin immediately. Here was my 06 Redline

 

Here's my take on the debate, which I myself debated for a while:

I drive an '09 Justa with an automatic transmission. I live in the city, I'm not a good driver, and I'm putting myself through graduate school. I deal with a mix of stop and go traffic but I tend to accelerate pretty quickly. For me, the Justa has enough power to do everything that I demand of it. I think that with the turbocharger I could get into a lot of trouble. After extensive research, I concluded that the Justa would be cheaper initially, cheaper to fuel (although I have been using Premium for most of my ownership), and cheaper to maintain.

In comparison, I have driven the newer Justa's automatics, with the improved engine, and I noticed a difference in how quickly the new Justa's accelerate. It's not a huge difference but it is noticeable for someone who pays attention to their car and the way it drives on a daily basis.

Also in comparison, my sister drives an '05 MCS with a manual transmission. The last time I drove it, I took a couple of years off my dad's life with how much fun I was having in that car. The '05 MCS is definitely faster than my car and the manual transmission is great if you don't have to deal with heavy traffic on a daily basis.

I LOVE my Justacooper with the automatic transmission. I do not regret choosing it at all. However I will say this, my next MINI, regardless of which model it is, will more than likely be an S. Occasionally, I wish that I had a little more power but paying off grad loans will definitely have to happen before I upgrade. And that sport button? Oh my gosh, it makes takes a car that is fun to drive and turns it into a little monster that takes fun to the extreme. Every time I use it I think, "why don't I use this more often?"

Joe, you mentioned the debate as to whether or not to get cloth seats and that you live somewhere hot. If you get the cloth seats, you will not regret it. This I can pretty much guarantee you. Also, if you live somewhere hot, you may have a harder time selling a car with vinyl seats than you would a car with cloth seats. For instance, over my cold dead body would I ever own a car with vinyl seats while living in Texas and I don't know very many native Texans that have a divergent opinion on this. So take my advice and get the cloth seats. They're awesome.

 

These MINI vinyl seats don't look or feel like vinyl... they feel nice and look even nicer. I believe that cloth is too cheap looking for such a car. I don't care how hot it gets, I want nice-looking seats.

 

We purposefully avoided the R56 S because of all the issues with the turbocharged Prince engine being reported on NAM and other MINI forums. That having said, I'd get a used R53 S. They seem to be more reliable than the R56 S, and the supercharger sounds great.

We got the '12 Justa because the non-turbo Prince engine has a pretty solid reliability history thus far. Plus, 121 horsepower gets the car moving pretty well. It will easily climb steep mountain passes at 75-80 mph.

And if we really want to go fast...well, we have a BMW sedan that'll run away from a stock R56 S.

 

I agree - the cloth on the MINI is very harsh and IMO not worthy of the price of the car. My last car was 1/2 or less the price of a justa Cooper and had nicer cloth seats.

The leatherette is very durable and I find that the 2011/2012 leatherette cars seem even nicer than my 2008.

Anyways koodos to MINI for offering us the choice of cloth, leather or leatherette. Few companies offer that kind of choice.



Now back to justa vs MCS... If you happen to be in Canada with a justa and they don't offer a Sport Button with the automatic, run away! Driving today just reminded me how annoying the autobox is with the default throttle response. Even worse now that the weather is cold. Can't wait for the JCW to arrive - it's almost here!!

 

We've got both a Justa and an S. If I could drive only one, I could be quite happy with the Justa. Especially on the street it can be more fun, you get to use more of the capabilities of the car and you have to work harder at it. On the track, the S is probably more fun, its a bit too easy to find the limits of a Justa.

Apart from the power, which is very noticeable, the brakes are bigger on the S, but they don't get you any more stopping power, they'll both happily lock up the wheels if you (and the ABS) let them. The S needs the larger brakes as it'll tend to be entering a corner faster all other things being equal.

I don't see any reliability problems with the S, ours has been pretty reliable. (The Justa has had a few more problems, but that's probably because its an 07, the first year of the new model).

I don't seem to be able to get good gas milage from the MINIs, and over 20k in the S and 37k in the Justa, the Justa gets a few mpgs better (28.5 vs 25.2).

As for the sport button, its permanently on in both cars (the only mod I've done) the sport button is unnecessary, it should be the default for the MINI, the throttle is just rediculous with the sport button off. I can tell if the sport button is ever off, I end up almost stalling, I can tell if the wife is driving with it off just by listening.

 

I've never had that problem, unless you mean the more powerful cars don't like letting you by, and you need their cooperation to do it.

(Every car at the track is more powerful than a Justa, I don't think I've seen one with less power/weight than a Justa.)

 

Agreed. I was at Sebring this weekend, and I don't care whether you have a MC or a MCS, when 75% of the cars are things like GT3RS's, Audi R8s, track-prepped Caymans, and all sorts of M3s, no one is going to be inherently impressed with a MINI. That said, the way to gain respect at a track day is not straight-line speed, it's driving a slow car fast. 95% of the cars out the would run away from even a Cooper S, but if you can hang with or pass faster machinery in a slow car like the Cooper or Cooper S, that's an accomplishment.