I placed an order just before December for an '08 MCS MY/B. The car will hit the NYC port on Tuesday (12/18). Unfortunately, at time of order, I didn't realize the Xenon's were a safety feature. I thought they were just another gimmicky feature that was mainly for looks and one more thing else that could break and cost a lot to fix. Since then, I have learned that Xenons could potentially save my life or that of another due to their increased visibility at night. Sure I could just take delivery of my current car, but I have a feeling that I'll always think, "oh i should have gotten those xenons".

Because of this, I have decided to reorder my vehicle and I could really use some advice on how to go about this process and avoid any penalties from my dealer (Princeton, NJ).

 

Honestly I don't see what the big deal with the Xenons is, but if that's what you want, then go get 'em tiger!

Just talk to your MA, explain the situation (you've since realized that having Xenons is worth another two months or so wait), and odds are they'll be able to cancel your order and sell it to someone else once it gets there. The only potential issue I could see is if they want to hang onto your deposit until the car's been sold.

I can't really see them giving you any serious grief about it unless you've got some seriously whacked out configuration they're going to have a hard time selling.

Personally, and this is just me, I'd go to the dealer at night, and do a test drive comparison of Xenons vs. non-Xenons. That should give you a much better idea if you want them enough to reorder than just anecdotal evidence from this here forum. Then if you decide you want them you're right there and they can redo your order.

 

I think if I were in your shoes I would just install some of the rally style driving lights. I would think those would add enough light to satisfy your visibility safety concerns. I just don't think I could wait any longer, especially if I had one almost ready for delivery. Good luck with your decision.

 

Plus the driving lights look hella sweet.

 

wow... i thought "hella" was just a cali thing...

 

russr, I agree with the advice to test drive both. I am making the assumption that your driving turf will be similar to what's available in the area around the dealer--wouldn't do much good to test drive Xenons in the city if you live out in the country, right? I would also offer the caution that I think MINI delivers its cars with the lights aimed excessively downward, so it may be a bit difficult to evaluate.

 

Cartman says "hella" on Southpark ALL the time, so I think it might have spread a little farther than Cali by now.

 

Xenons at high-beam are great. I'm not convinced that they are so great at low-beam. They have a very sharp cutoff and very bright in the area they cover. Your eyes adjust to the bright area. So, beyond the low-beam appears pitch black on an unlit country road. In some situations this would give you an excellent view of the deer you didn't see in time.

It would be ironic if you reordered for safety reasons and then got into an accident because of the Xenons. I'm not saying that it would happen. I'm just saying I'm not convinced that Xenons are as life-saving as you've been told.

 

Hey, I have some swap land in FL that will extend you life by at least 10 years - Really,,,, PM me for a Great deal....lol

there are many other ways you can improve your driving that could save your life besides brighter lights... Ya, they look cool but lights alone won't do that much - its a $$$$$$$$$$$$$ choice

With that said, talk to your Dealer - I changed my mind and it actually was their idea - I could not see the LL before I placed my order and I was concerned the white piping was that much different than the PW paint.... Then I saw one at the dealership... As I was sitting in the car - my MA said, want to re-order and get that leather??? put your car back by about a month but it was up to me... Deal done...

Its YOUR Mini - do it your way - if you want to call it a saftey feature - go for it....

 

I was actually asking for advice on how to go about the reordering process, but appreciate the opinions on the Xenons as well. Haven't been a big Xenon fan in the past as I've been dazzled by many cars that have them. This is specifically why I didn't opt for them. Reading the threads here on Xenons, there was an overwhelming majority in favor of them. Did some searches elsewhere as well and found that most places said they were worth it. Check out this video as one example: http://www.carspace.com/videos/play!id=.5ab89b24

 

That is advertising hype, not an unbiased evaluation. Can't help you with the reordering process. Haven't done it. I would guess that the best thing to do is discuss it with your dealer.

 

I ordered them because I like them, certainly not for an added safety feature. I am curious to what MINI has to say about your desire to reorder based on life and death. Good luck with that

 

There shouldn't be any problem at all with just reordering as my MA said as long as I haven't signed on the dotted line I could cancel with a full refund of deposit or reorder at any time. With that, I luv the Xenons. With my old halogen cars I was always buying aftermarket bulbs to make things brighter as the yellowish lights of the halogens just didn't cut it for me. Made me feel all sleepy like how you'd feel if you were in school classroom with dim lights. The Xenons have a brighter whiter light which makes me more attentive. Never had the urge to look for SIlverstars or what not since.

 

The one thing to remember is that everyone who didn't get Xenons isn't posting in the Xenon threads about how happy they are w/ their standard headlights. Your data sample is going to be pretty skewed.

But since it'd be next to impossible to add them later (at least at a remotely reasonable cost) if you want them, then go ahead and reorder. I doubt your dealer's going to be unhappy that you've decided to spend even more money. Just give your MA a call, explain what you're thinking and they should be plenty happy to help you. (Though I personally would still think strongly about doing a comparison yourself just to make sure they make as big a difference to you as to the people posting. It's not quite as subjective a thing as which suspension to get, but I wouldn't want to reorder, have the car finally get here, then be left wondering what all the hype was about.)

 

Good luck with the re-ordering process.

It will be interesting to hear what your dealer thinks of the idea and how they go about doing this.

 

You should think about what kind of driving you will be doing. I got the xenons because everyone talked about how much brighter they are. I found that even at hight beam they cut off more that I liked. I ended up getting the OEM driving lights and am much happier.

My daily commute takes me through 20 miles of deer infested roads where I will see far more of them than cars.... The sharp cut off didn't give me the eye's reflection on the banks above the road I like to see.

If you mostly drive with low beam in traffic I don't know what I would decide...

Good luck.

 

Just went back and read your first post - you ordered an 08 - coupe or Conv?? and that 08 will be in a US port on the 18th.. (a week from tomorrow?)

by now, you should have already called your MA and got the answer - its all up to them - as stated, I did a re-order and it was a NON issue... As far as the lights - well, the above posts are all over and like you stated, you weren't asking for advice on the lights - well, welcome to a forum,,,,, you post, we give advice, lol...

Often we all want something, so we seek info supporting our wants... its your car and your $$ get what YOU want...

 

I drive on all kinds of roads, highways with traffic, hoighways w/o much traffic that are dimly lit, back roads with traffic and again ones w/o much traffic and light and of course the poorly lit country type roads with deer lurking.

From what I understand, the xenon low beam illuminates the foreground much better than a halogen low beam. It lights up the sides better as well has having better range. Folks who complained about sharp cutoffs found that raising the headlights slightly made a big difference.

If the range on xenons is longer, I'm not sure I understand how this sharp cutoff makes it worse than a halogen.

Also, I found posts where halogen users complained about the lights being too anemic and wanted to put a better bulb in.

 

It'll be here tomorrow (12/18). It is a hard top cooper s. When i spoke to my MA on Friday, he thought we could add the Xenons after the fact, but I called the parts dept. and they said otherwise. I will call him today and ask about reordering.

Honestly, I was seeking support that halogens were good enough and after doing some research I found that Xenons were better and were worth the price difference.

 

That pretty much describes the kind of areas I drive.

IMO, that is a serious disadvantage. Your eyes adjust to the bright area and you are less able to see into the darker areas. You really don't need to brightly illuminate that which is too close for you to avoid.

It lights up the sides well and has better range with high-beams. I haven't found either to be the case with low.

If I raise my lights I will be blinding other drivers. I've watched carefully to see whether it would be alright to raise them, and it wouldn't.

I haven't noticed any problem at high beam. Mine seem to illuminate quite high and wide. They really illuminate the area at high beam. It is low-beam where the cut off is a problem. Since they are so bright at high beam, when you have to turn them down you do not see well into the dark areas beyond the low-beam cutoff.

That's pretty funny. Halogens used to be the bright upgrade from standard headlights. In the 1960's they were illegal in California because they were considered too bright.

Our eyes adjust to quite a range brightness levels. We can do quite well if we allow our eyes to adjust. Under a full moon, I can see far beyond the range of the halognes in my Integra. If I use the Xenons in my MCS, I lose that ability. If you need Xenon brightness to be able to drive at night, you are not giving your eyes enough time to adjust, or you have a medical problem.

 

+1
I have the xenons, but have also driven a friend's Cooper with the halogens on dark mountain roads, and can't say that the xenons impress me all that much - I certainly wouldn't expect them to save my life. YMMV.
The light is whiter, they have a distinct cutoff, and they are $$ to replace if they break (not to mention additional coin to start with.)

Note that I haven't experienced the later model projector xenons.

 

Robin, thanks for your reply. What you're saying sounds a lot like Daniel Stern lighting. He stated that a disadvantage of Xenons was that improved foreground illumination meant that one could not see beyond the cutoff area as well due to less pupil dialation. He also said that typical halogens don't illuminate the foreground enough. Every other article that I read praised Xenon's. Here's another site that I used to make my decision: http://www.mvlc.info/xenon_faq.html#Q1

I want to make sure I understand you correctly...are you saying that a halogen low beam is actually better for night driving than a xenon low beam? It seems clear to me that you think the xenon high beam is superior to the halogen one. The ironic thing is that on my current car (Mazda6), I've never felt like the halogen high beam was inadequate. It is the halogen low beam that I've felt wasn't bright enough.

Bottom line: From a pure night driving safety perspective, is it not worth reordering for Xenons?

 

I have the Halogens and am pleased with them Hi or Lo beam. I also have the OEM driving lights if I need them, but honestly they are more for looks.

 

I'm just relating my experience. I'm an amateur astronomer and have gone out to remote sites in Carmel Valley and Fremont Peak for observing "star parties." This usually means driving home on winding country roads at 2:00 AM or so in my Integra.

Where I live is also pretty dark. From my house, the Milky Way is easily visible. There are no street lights on Carmel Valley Road, but there is traffic.

So, I've done a fair amount of night driving in the country.

I was somewhat sorry I ordered Xenons. They seem too bright to me. They cause my pupils to close down so I can't see beyond them very well. With the abrupt cut off of the Xenons, this makes the area beyond the low-beam reach seem pitch black. Because the halogens scatter light more above their cutoff, and are not as bright as Xenons, I feel that I can see farther with the halogen low-beams than I can with the Xenon lows.

The Xenon high beams probably do have a longer reach than the halogens. So, I might have been tempted to buy long-range driving lights if I had gotten halogens. However, I never felt I needed them in the Integra.

Other than fog lights in fog, I have no use for the kind of driving lights that brightly illuminate only the area close to the car. IMO, they cause the same kind of problem as the Xenons. They cause your pupils to close down, limiting your ability to see into the unlit areas.

 

No one can tell you one way or another as its purely a personal choice. My 05 MCS had Xenon low beams and my current Miata does not. There is a difference but its not as huge as some people make it out to be IMHO. But given the choice I'd order Xenons again.

With that said if you are happy with your spec then don't get Xenons just because a bunch of people on a message board told you too. If Xenons were truly a "saftey" feature you'd get a discount on your insurance for them. In reality they are merely a convenience.
my .02
Mike