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R56 Do you guys blip the throttle on downshift at HIGH RPMs??

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Old Nov 8, 2007 | 08:41 AM
  #51  
smackboy1's Avatar
smackboy1
3rd Gear
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 207
Likes: 1
From: Princeton, NJ
Originally Posted by ghosthound
anyway, i understand the theory of heel toeing as well as the concept, but i just feel like my foot/leg cannot bend in a way that can easily apply the brake and gas at the same time. Or at least without getting on the brakes too hard. My feet arent huge, size 11, im wearing shoes that arent fat although they arent driving shoes...

anyway, it seems like the sport button needs to be on otherwise the throttle is too unresponsive but i just cant get on the gas without digging deeper in the brake causing the car to brake pretty hard... what gives?
Disclaimer: I am NOT a driving instructor. This is what I was taught by driving instructors and from books and it seems to work well. Practice in the driveway with the engine off until the muscle memory gets it before trying it when the car is moving.

Pedals set up for heel-toeing should have the brake and gas pedal at about the same height when the brakes are applied hard. The pedals should be close enough together so that when the ball of the foot is on the brakes, the right edge of the shoe can roll over to blip the gas. The MINI pedals are set up pretty good. Special driving shoes are not needed. It's easiest with athletic shoes or any shoe that has a thin sole (so you can feel the pedals) and allows your ankle to move. Heavy shoes, thick soles or boots make it harder.

Heel-toeing is usually meant for the track when the brakes are applied hard to slow the car down for a corner. Usually on the street, the brakes are not applied that hard, so the pedals are not at the same height, making heel-toe more tricky to perform (and probably unnecessary). This is also why it's difficult to get a big enough throttle blip without Sport mode on the street. It actually should be pretty hard to practice heel-toeing on the street (unless you are driving like a maniac).

So how to do it? The seat has to be close enough so all 3 pedals can be fully depressed to the floor and still have some bend in the knee. Place the right heel on the floor so that it is on the line that runs between the brake and gas pedals, and both can be comfortably depressed for driving. If you look down, the right knee should be more or less in line with the right foot. The car can be driven by keeping the right heel more or less planted on the floor and the brake and gas pedals are actuated by pivoting around the heel using the ankle and leg. As the car approaches the corner, keeping the heel planted, the pad of the right foot is lifted off the gas pedal and the the ball of the right foot depresses the brake pedal. In order to blip the throttle, rock the right knee over to the right and then back again. If the right foot is positioned correctly rocking the knee rolls the right foot so the edge of the foot blips the gas pedal. With practice the blip can be done without coming off the brake because the heel on the floor gives stability to the whole foot. It feels unnatural to move the whole right leg just to blip the throttle, but it works pretty well.

The hard part is to not release the brake pedal pressure as the foot rolls over to blip the gas, but at the same time the foot has to roll over enough to give the gas a big enough blip to get the RPMs up. Another method of heel-toeing is to brake with the ball of the right foot and blip the gas using the lower outside edge of the foot by lifting the heel off the floor and rolling it over. Personally I find that method works with some cars but not others. I think it's more difficult to modulate brake pressure, and roll the foot over when the whole foot is off the floor. Our MINI is new so the brakes are very grabby.

Here's Ayrton Senna using both methods (from what I can tell anyway). If only we could all just drive with even a fraction of his ability. http://youtube.com/watch?v=A8-zbfdPfRg
 
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Old Nov 8, 2007 | 06:02 PM
  #52  
ScottinBend's Avatar
ScottinBend
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,589
Likes: 2
From: Oregon, USA
Originally Posted by r56mini
I take the corner in neutral sometimes. You don't push the clutch in in the middle of the turn. Instead you brake while in neutral when you are slowing down for a turn. Carry the speed and turn. Then put it in the gear and drive out. I do that when I am not in a hurry. It is not a dangerous manuver.
You're kidding right............you should never be in neutral while driving. You need to select the gear you need before entering the corner and drive out of the corner.
 
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Old Nov 8, 2007 | 06:10 PM
  #53  
ScottinBend's Avatar
ScottinBend
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,589
Likes: 2
From: Oregon, USA
Originally Posted by ghosthound
ok, now that i finally got my car, im not trying to put a lot of stress on the motor or anything... at least just yet... im at like 60 miles on the ODO.. such a long way to go before i can really drive the thing... anyway, i understand the theory of heel toeing as well as the concept, but i just feel like my foot/leg cannot bend in a way that can easily apply the brake and gas at the same time. Or at least without getting on the brakes too hard. My feet arent huge, size 11, im wearing shoes that arent fat although they arent driving shoes...

anyway, it seems like the sport button needs to be on otherwise the throttle is too unresponsive but i just cant get on the gas without digging deeper in the brake causing the car to brake pretty hard... what gives?
Heel and toe downshifting really isn't necessary for everyday street driving. It is used to get the car into the proper gear WHILE braking for a corner, usually while driving on a track day or other spirited driving. You can practice it while driving home from work, but you won't get comfortable with it until you are really getting on the brakes. That way the pedals are a little closer to being the same height and it makes manipulating the pedals much easier.
 
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Old Nov 8, 2007 | 06:19 PM
  #54  
ScottinBend's Avatar
ScottinBend
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,589
Likes: 2
From: Oregon, USA
Here are a couple of great videos of proper heel and toeing.......
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IuoZeuSgEj4
http://youtube.com/watch?v=klMur6TPkrM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=8yhcMru5g2U

And you can find even more.
 
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