Back off, maTT. I've got dibbs.


P.S. I love your sig line!!

 

It's obsolete only if you no longer have a desire to possess it. My Cooper is not obsolete because I still love it as much as when I picked it up off the lot almost 2 years ago.

Zip

 

Ok you win, the oldie goldie is yours

which siggy line, my siggy is starting to read like a novel lately hehe

 

Let me take a guess... I firmly believe that some things are worth saving.

 

And some things you want to wrap your lips around.

ok, that could be two things. But I was talking about the 'lemons' line.

 

You can't light up the night sky with an R56.

 

You can if you find a steep enough hill.

 

I have enthusiast friends who are now in the process of lusting after MINIs of their own. What are they looking at? R53s....one guy just bought a LY/B '02. I think it will be very hard to avoid the '02s-'06s being considered classics most readily. They were first, and that always gives them added points, imo.

 

Yes they are obsolete. Just like 65 Mustangs, 67 Vettes, 356 Porsches, 66 Shelby Cobras, MGs, Austin Healeys, slot car wheeled orginal Mini CooperS, all obsolete.

 

If someone loves them, and they fulfill whatever functions their owners need or want them to, they are not obsolete.

You want obsolete? A computer that is only able to run MS-DOS is obsolete, unless its owner is using it as typewriter, and, assuming someone has a printer that'll even recognize it. That's pretty much obsolete in today's computing world.

Of course, it can always serve as a perfectly functional boat anchor.

Zip

 

Nope the R53 are not obsolete because the R52 Cooper and Cooper S convertibles will continue to offer the same basic R50/53 design and mechanicals until the end of 2008

Also if your 5 month old 2006 MCS has been reliable, it is most likely it will stay that way keep in mind the R56 is an all new design with a new engine and reliability is still unknown at this time. Some UK early R56 adopters in the UK have reported problems with the new cars in different areas, some more severe than others and a few requiring their cars "lemoned law".

The R53 is a great car and a great drive. The R56 is a different concept in which comfort and a little more luxury are given emphasis. The R53 is more rough around the edges, a little better steering, handling and, as for me personally, I like the looks better of the outgoing car than the new.


Trading in a 5 month old car is a bad idea. You are going to lose a substantial amount of money on the transaction. Ask yourself this question.... What does the R56 offer that I can not live without in my R53? then take it from there.

My suggestion... enjoy your new '06 MCS for another 2-3 years and come back to revisit the R56 when MINI has had enough time and opportunity to iron out the problems from the first year cars. Also in 2-3 years time, MINI will make the R56 even better by introducing revisions to the car, both cosmetically and mechanically. AWD and JCW are in the cards, 2 options which are well worth hanging to that sweet R53 at least until the end or very near the end of the warranty.

 

Not quite correct. As I pointed out in my last post, the R52 convertibles are carry over r50/53 basic design and powertrain that will be offered until the end of 2008. The all new R57 convertible will go on sale early 2009 (One year after the Clubman launch)

 

Yes, but the handbrakes are failing in some R56, so not a good idea at least not just yet

 

Obsolete? Not yet! I'm coming up on 5 years with mine and I still get a smile everytime I fire it up. When the smile stops maybe then it will be obsolete.

I checked out the new model and it does look nice, but I don't think I'll be trading my 02 in any time soon.

 

MiniSuperCooper - I love my 06 MCS, but I must admit liking the R56 a lot now that I've seen it in person. The interior and exterior bits I didn't like aren't as bad as I thought they would be (and some are quite nice!).

Still, I think what C4 is suggesting above is what I'm going to do. Drive mine for another 2-3 years and then make a decision. I may move to an area with more stop & go traffic, and at that point, I may want to trade to an automatic (vs. stick - please don't flame me for this!). Also, even though I know how to drive a stick, I don't always feel so confident. So I have other reasons for thinking about a trade. Still, there are design elements of mine (like the curves in the bonnet) that I love and that are absent in the new version. So it is a hard choice.

There's also a big difference between having a daily driver for 4-5 years or a classic that you plan on keeping for 25+ years. If you're looking for a daily driver, you may want to consider the R56 once they've ironed out most/all of the kinks... in 2-3 years. Then you also won't lose as much money.

 

I'll bid $1501

I specifically waited until the '06s because I wanted the whine of the supercharger and I didn't like some of the things that were being done to the interior.

So, are they obsolete? NO! There will continue to be a market for the Mk.1s for a long time into the future.

Will I get a Mk.2? Who knows. Maybe a Mk.3 will be more to my liking. You can never tell. Just as long as MINI/BMW doesn't mess around with it too much.

 

Obsolete? Hell no. Instant classic? Youbetcha.

There will always be people who prefer the r53 over the R56, and vice versa. There are people who never liked anything but the original Corvette. You get the idea.

Technically, the R53 would not go 'obsolete', since it is able to perform al the duties it was designed for, and as long as you can keep it supplied with fuel and parts, you're good to go. Like all cars, unless one pampers the hell out of the car, that MINI will become a rumpled, rusty, worn out clunker just like so many Ford Fairmonts. Each and every beater you see puttering down the road or filling up scrapyards was at one time a shiny, new automobile. Every one. Some get there faster than others (think Yugo, Chevy Vega), but suffice it to say, that mess headed for the crusher was at one time someone's pride and joy.

An aside to the computer analogy above. Computers go 'obsolete' remarkably fast. In fact, prior to the PC age, 'obsolescence' moved at a relative snails pace. The thing is, if one buys a computer and uses it exactly as they did when first purchased and did not want to go faster, run the latest apps, etc, it would still fit the bill as long as it continued to work and not need parts. Where I work, there are many 'legacy' systems used for process control, automation, etc. These computers will never need to be used beyond the singular task set they perform, and have the potential to last forever. They are obsolete in every sense of the word, but just as useful as they were when new. The problems arise only if there is a hardware failure. The only source for parts are from ones that have been junked.

The vast majority of televisions in the US are about to become obsolete at the same time once over-the-air analog broadcasting ceases in '09. Unless you have cable or satellite, you will soon have a box that will serve up only static unless you use a retrofit digital tuner box. I'm willing to bet that most people in this situation will just toss their perfectly good, yet forced-into-obsolescence set and buy a new set. This is an example of obsolescence at it's worst.

 

I've got a Nazgul with your name on it.


Wow - hadn't heard that. Once again, Greatbear proves he knows all!
Will I be able to find a signal if I move the bunny ears around enough? (I'm not big on upgrading to new technologies )

Another example - AT&T, uh Cingular, uh AT&T just sent out notices saying that I should 'upgrade' to a new phone because, by the way, my (less than one year ) old one won't work with their network in 2008.

 

My dad held on to his old Motorola "brick" cellphone for as long as he possibly could, until his cell-phone carrier finally said that their network wouldn't support it any longer. He's hated every phone he's had since...

 

Those "classic" analog Motorola cell phone bricks of 20 years ago were simply amazing...

 

And very advanced for the time. At the same time that my dad had the "brick", many of the cell phones were the type that had a separate battery in a bag, with a cord connecting it to the phone.

And then there was the phone that he had *before* the brick. It was actually a radio phone in his car - looked like a regular house phone, except that it was bolted to his transmission tunnel. Every time he used it, he had to talk to the radio operator, tell the operator what number he wanted to call, and then when the call was over, he had to talk to the operator again to "release" the line.

Amazing how far we've come in 25 years.

 

I'm not really a know-it-all, I just play one on the internet.

Wireless telecommunications companies and the attending technology is some of the worst when it comes to needless obsolescence. Most, if not all of the old analog handsets have been forced to be upgraded. New models come out in practically monthly cycles, with each new one forcing the manufacturers to abandon their old gear quickly. If one has a handset that is more than a few years old, most likely it is in need of a new battery. Finding batteries is tough if not impossible in some cases, so one has no choice but to replace the handset, relegating the good one to e-waste and incurring another 2 year 'unbreakable' service contract.

Traditional camera makers learned quickly once they dipped their feet into digital photography that their entire business model would be turned upside-down. Here is an industry that generally had new model cycles measured in years (especially for 'pro' gear) and planned their design cycles for such, now they had to cater to the fickle whims of those people raised on fast-moving 'digital' culture where a top-of-the-line PC becomes an entry level model in a year or less and who want the latest stylish, do-everything toys constantly (Awkward sentence alert!). Contrast this with an old pro photographer still shooting large format using cameras which are decades old and still considered state of the art.

Sometimes the notion of obsolescence can be blamed on the consumers (say, cameras), and other times the companies (tech, cell phones, cars, etc).

A Model T still can do what it was designed for. Even today, one can still find parts to ensure that it continues to do so. But how many people want to be driving a Model T everyday?

 

And that is the loophole. Technically, its not obsolete. In practical terms, it will become a dinosour.

You mentioned PCs. It all depends upon what you want to do. Once CPUs when over 1 GHz, unless you doing intensive computing, ALL PCs are I/O bound, not CPU bound. One of my PCs is a 1.6 Ghz machine bought 7 years ago and runs and does its job just as well as the day I bought it.

In the IT industry, many ppl just get caught up with the latest buzzwords, dual core, quad core ... hyper threading ... I GOTTA have that! Not true for most ppl who dont do much of anything other than reading websites and Email

So yeah, technically, ANY car will never be obsolete. But the question becomes do you want to own one of those. Just as many baby boomers drool over 426 Hemis and 427 Vettes, they tend to forget how BAD those cars were overall compared to today.

So maybe the R53 is not obsolete, but its going to become undesirable in comparison to the more modern offerings, and as time goes on, more and more so.

 

I think that the R53 will continue to be desirable for years to come. More raw, more connected and (don't tell any of those R56 guys in the other forum), much better looking car.

Being that the 2002-2006 (hardtops) and 2005-2008 (Cabrios) are the only factory supercharged MINIs, that will give them added value.

Then again, it all depends how the new PSA turbo engine fares in terms of reliability and tuneability. Heck, BMW is having heat issues with the R56 JCW and this is why the car will not be introduced for another year. Turbos have advantages over S/C engines, but long term durability, ease of tuneability is what will determine whether this cars will be remembered in the same league of the R53s or not.

Only time will tell. Will MINI go back to Supercharging in the 3rd generation MINI in 2012? That will be an interesting question.

 

I look at it like this:

The Supermarine Spitfire is obsolete.
The F-22 is state of the art.

I'd sell a kidney to get a ride in a Spitfire.