2006 Civic SI??
What I would like to know is when and if we'll get the 5 door sedan that's available in the UK? (http://www.honda.co.uk) I saw it on the "Fifth Gear" show. Good looking, practical small car.
2nd Gear
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
From: Everett, WA
Originally Posted by Pat_Cooper
What do you guys think of the new Civic SI?
Technical Features
• 197hp, 2.0-liter, DOHC i-VTEC® 4-cylinder engine
• Close-Ratio 6-Speed Manual Transmission
• Helical Limited-Slip Differential
• LEV-2 (Low-Emission Vehicle)
• Drive-By-Wire Throttle System™
• Control-Link MacPherson Strut Front Suspension
• Reactive-Link Double Wishbone Rear Suspension
• Electric Power-Assisted Rack-and-Pinion Steering
• Power-Assisted Ventilated Front Disc/Solid Rear Disc Brakes
• 100,000-Miles-or-More Tune-Up Interval
Probably has no torque due to the V-Tec system but this does seem impressive. I heard the handling is amazing. Interior is really nice also.
Technical Features
• 197hp, 2.0-liter, DOHC i-VTEC® 4-cylinder engine
• Close-Ratio 6-Speed Manual Transmission
• Helical Limited-Slip Differential
• LEV-2 (Low-Emission Vehicle)
• Drive-By-Wire Throttle System™
• Control-Link MacPherson Strut Front Suspension
• Reactive-Link Double Wishbone Rear Suspension
• Electric Power-Assisted Rack-and-Pinion Steering
• Power-Assisted Ventilated Front Disc/Solid Rear Disc Brakes
• 100,000-Miles-or-More Tune-Up Interval
Probably has no torque due to the V-Tec system but this does seem impressive. I heard the handling is amazing. Interior is really nice also.
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 413
Likes: 0
From: Bahstun, MA
It happens that today the Boston Globe Auto section had a review, the auto writer was pretty favorably disposed to the new Civic...
http://www.boston.com/cars/car_revie...back_on_track/
He highlighted the lack of stability/skid control as a negative.
http://www.boston.com/cars/car_revie...back_on_track/
He highlighted the lack of stability/skid control as a negative.
OVERDRIVE
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 8,233
Likes: 127
From: San Francisco
The New York Times had some interesting criticisms of the Civic Si.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/18/au...es/18AUTO.html (website registration required, free)
Excerpts:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/18/au...es/18AUTO.html (website registration required, free)
Excerpts:
...the Civic Si's most annoying feature - the electronic throttle's tendency to hold onto revs even after you've taken your foot off the accelerator, as if the flywheel had the mass of a revolving rooftop restaurant. Every time you pop out of gear to shift, the engine zings away as if you've left your foot on the gas.
...why won't everyone who's in the market for a sporty compact car buy an Si? It all comes back to that engine and Honda's performance philosophy of high r.p.m.'s and engines that breathe without forced air induction. Here's the problem with this approach: It's impossible to go fast in this thing without really trying. For instance, in first gear, you don't activate the i-VTEC's hyperspace mode (which kicks in at 5,800 r.p.m.) until you're already traveling about 30 m.p.h. Then you hit that frenzied power peak and it's time to shift at 36 m.p.h. As you climb the gears, you get longer stints in the crazy-VTEC zone, with second gear giving you 43 to 56 m.p.h., third going bonkers at 60 to 80, and fourth coming on right about where third leaves off. Certainly, revving an engine to 8,000 r.p.m. is excellent fun. Spinning along at 8,000 r.p.m. is loud and antisocial and, given the existence of superchargers and turbochargers, completely unnecessary.
... A glance at the Si's power chart reveals that at 4,000 r.p.m., which is the upper range of what you might normally explore in everyday traffic in most other cars, the Civic Si generates a meek 100 horsepower.
...why won't everyone who's in the market for a sporty compact car buy an Si? It all comes back to that engine and Honda's performance philosophy of high r.p.m.'s and engines that breathe without forced air induction. Here's the problem with this approach: It's impossible to go fast in this thing without really trying. For instance, in first gear, you don't activate the i-VTEC's hyperspace mode (which kicks in at 5,800 r.p.m.) until you're already traveling about 30 m.p.h. Then you hit that frenzied power peak and it's time to shift at 36 m.p.h. As you climb the gears, you get longer stints in the crazy-VTEC zone, with second gear giving you 43 to 56 m.p.h., third going bonkers at 60 to 80, and fourth coming on right about where third leaves off. Certainly, revving an engine to 8,000 r.p.m. is excellent fun. Spinning along at 8,000 r.p.m. is loud and antisocial and, given the existence of superchargers and turbochargers, completely unnecessary.
... A glance at the Si's power chart reveals that at 4,000 r.p.m., which is the upper range of what you might normally explore in everyday traffic in most other cars, the Civic Si generates a meek 100 horsepower.
well, if according to the above statement that the civic generates only 100 hp at 4k rpm... the MCS easily out-guns it on daily driving... this is a compiled modified MCS chart on rpm, torque on rpm
notice every single MCS in the dyno chart below, all makes about 120 whp at 4k, granted, all MCS on the dyno that time are modified with at least JCW or 15% pullies
notice every single MCS in the dyno chart below, all makes about 120 whp at 4k, granted, all MCS on the dyno that time are modified with at least JCW or 15% pullies
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 254
Likes: 0
I contemplated the Civic Si. But like others said, the interior. . . gah.
"Honda, I have Buck Rogers on the line and he'd like his dashboard back."
And the NYT is right on. Who wants to spend all their time above 5K?
Okay, here's the other thing: I didn't want citizenship to the Civic Nation.
"Honda, I have Buck Rogers on the line and he'd like his dashboard back."
And the NYT is right on. Who wants to spend all their time above 5K?
Okay, here's the other thing: I didn't want citizenship to the Civic Nation.
Neutral
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Being the original owner of a loaded 2004 MCS w/ Milltek, 15%pulley, Alta CAI, & Unichip, and having spent a lot of time in the Civic Si, I can chime in a bit.
1st, for the shocking part: The Civic Si is Far superior in almost every aspect. Better crash safety, environmental performance, ride comfort, engine performance (by far, don't judge it unless you have driven it), build quality, standard features (ex: LSD), price, performance sound, reliability, ergonomics, noise, vibration & harshness (NVH), HVAC performance, & Value (which is all the above divided by price). The interior, while strange at first, like any other Honda, becomes instantly comfortable and second nature in ~ 5 minutes. After peering at the small speed display at the base of the MINI's tach for 2 years, the high mount Civic speedo & shift light seems very nice.The raked A-pillar is particularly frightening to MINI owners, as our car has such a steep windshield. Kinda like a WWII Jeep vs a NSX.
But, the Civic is inferior to the MINI in personality. Our quirky little British car can not be topped for personallity, and this goes a long way toward owner satisfaction. Also, I prefer the MINI's lack of (rice) boy-racer image. Additionally, the Civic does not have the point-and-shoot razor sharp steering response which I so adore. So, I will happily keep my MINI.
I suppose Honda does not have the (retro) heritage to pull off a car such as the MINI, but if they did, I'm sure it would be as good or better than the Chrysler/Rover/BMW version we all love.
Like BMW, Honda is a small, independent company led by engineers. Both companies offer us the best vehicles on the market, and we should be happy that offerings such as these make it 'a great time to be a car guy'!
1st, for the shocking part: The Civic Si is Far superior in almost every aspect. Better crash safety, environmental performance, ride comfort, engine performance (by far, don't judge it unless you have driven it), build quality, standard features (ex: LSD), price, performance sound, reliability, ergonomics, noise, vibration & harshness (NVH), HVAC performance, & Value (which is all the above divided by price). The interior, while strange at first, like any other Honda, becomes instantly comfortable and second nature in ~ 5 minutes. After peering at the small speed display at the base of the MINI's tach for 2 years, the high mount Civic speedo & shift light seems very nice.The raked A-pillar is particularly frightening to MINI owners, as our car has such a steep windshield. Kinda like a WWII Jeep vs a NSX.
But, the Civic is inferior to the MINI in personality. Our quirky little British car can not be topped for personallity, and this goes a long way toward owner satisfaction. Also, I prefer the MINI's lack of (rice) boy-racer image. Additionally, the Civic does not have the point-and-shoot razor sharp steering response which I so adore. So, I will happily keep my MINI.
I suppose Honda does not have the (retro) heritage to pull off a car such as the MINI, but if they did, I'm sure it would be as good or better than the Chrysler/Rover/BMW version we all love.
Like BMW, Honda is a small, independent company led by engineers. Both companies offer us the best vehicles on the market, and we should be happy that offerings such as these make it 'a great time to be a car guy'!
Banned
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,756
Likes: 0
Perhaps the new Civic Si is a smoother, more composed car than the MINI. But then again, it all depends from the perspective that you look at them. The MINI is what it is, a MINI. BMW successfully translated all the virtues that made the classic such a recognized car in the world. MINIs are not really about smooth ride, futuristic dashboards, or Lexus like comfort. Simply put, the MINI is a car that it is all about handling prowess and raw go-kart driving fun. This is a reason why, the MINI is not a car for everyone and will never be a popular choice.
For folks wanted a more "sterile" driving experience where there is a balance between comforts and performance, the Japanese automarkers have mastered the art of building half bland/half exciting cars with the personality of a toaster oven. There are exceptions to this philosophy. Witness the Honda S2000, the Mitusbishi EVO and the Subaru Sti, cars that raise above the "appliance" way of thinking of most Asian cars today.
Then again, the MINI is a pretty intimidating concept for people that are used to drive "Normal" cars and specially for folks coming over from Japanese brands. The MINI is small, rides harder, has "strange" design elements, simply it was not designed and conceived to please the Honda and Toyota masses. The MINI goes against the tide of "me too thinking" so prevalent in today's cars.
Like someone said, the MINI has PERSONALITY for a $20K car. How many car's in the MINI's price range are as appealing in this regard as the MINI? probably none.
The MINI is made for people that are not afraid to break off from the mold. Let the masses drive Toyotas, Hondas, Scions, Fords and Chevys.
For folks wanted a more "sterile" driving experience where there is a balance between comforts and performance, the Japanese automarkers have mastered the art of building half bland/half exciting cars with the personality of a toaster oven. There are exceptions to this philosophy. Witness the Honda S2000, the Mitusbishi EVO and the Subaru Sti, cars that raise above the "appliance" way of thinking of most Asian cars today.
Then again, the MINI is a pretty intimidating concept for people that are used to drive "Normal" cars and specially for folks coming over from Japanese brands. The MINI is small, rides harder, has "strange" design elements, simply it was not designed and conceived to please the Honda and Toyota masses. The MINI goes against the tide of "me too thinking" so prevalent in today's cars.
Like someone said, the MINI has PERSONALITY for a $20K car. How many car's in the MINI's price range are as appealing in this regard as the MINI? probably none.
The MINI is made for people that are not afraid to break off from the mold. Let the masses drive Toyotas, Hondas, Scions, Fords and Chevys.
Originally Posted by C4
For folks wanted a more "sterile" driving experience where there is a balance between comforts and performance, the Japanese automarkers have mastered the art of building half bland/half exciting cars with the personality of a toaster oven.
so you're saying my G35C is a toaster oven. nice generalization..and
who are you again?
6th Gear
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,110
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by C4
The MINI is made for people that are not afraid to break off from the mold. Let the masses drive Toyotas, Hondas, Scions, Fords and Chevys.
Banned
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,756
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by MyPocketRocket
I think MINI has become a mainstream now, don't you think?
Mmm, depends where you are. Here in South Florida they are very popular, but drive 200 miles to Central Florida and they are a drop in a bucket. North Florida they are a very RARE sight. West Florida, very few and far in between. The Panhandle is pretty much very few MINIs scattered around.
I think MINIs are "mainstream" per se in big cities or locations with at least more than 1 MINI dealer in the vecinity.
MINIs are still "exotic" in many places of the country. Try western Texas, Wyoming, Dakotas, etc.
However, MINIs will never approach (fortunately) the popularity and sales numbers of the Civic for example. While the MINI is not an exotic car based on sales numbers, is not a widely popular choice either. We are somewhere in between.
3rd Gear
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
From: Western Ohio
I also agree with many of the observations thusfar.
What disappoints me is that the Si (along with most other cars) has grown to its current size. At almost 175" long, the Si is nearly three feet longer than our beloved MINI. While people are getting bigger/fatter and safety considerations encourage such growth, it's tough to see the "compact" class get so large.
Another disappointment is the Si's power delivery. The lack of low-end torque has almost been a matter of pride for Honda over the years. Believe me, I have the utmost respect for their engineering (I've owned several civics in the past). Unfortunately, as noted in the NY Times article, many folks (including me) don't enjoy bouncing the engine off of its rev-limiter to extract performance. Occasionally fun, but tiresome over the long haul.
These things being said though, the Civic Si represents a refined, well-built car for a reasonable price. A person could do far worse than a Honda.
What disappoints me is that the Si (along with most other cars) has grown to its current size. At almost 175" long, the Si is nearly three feet longer than our beloved MINI. While people are getting bigger/fatter and safety considerations encourage such growth, it's tough to see the "compact" class get so large.
Another disappointment is the Si's power delivery. The lack of low-end torque has almost been a matter of pride for Honda over the years. Believe me, I have the utmost respect for their engineering (I've owned several civics in the past). Unfortunately, as noted in the NY Times article, many folks (including me) don't enjoy bouncing the engine off of its rev-limiter to extract performance. Occasionally fun, but tiresome over the long haul.
These things being said though, the Civic Si represents a refined, well-built car for a reasonable price. A person could do far worse than a Honda.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
newminijcw
MINIs & Minis for Sale
9
Oct 21, 2015 02:37 PM