http://www.hondanews.com/categories/1097/releases/4722

 

Nice to see manufacturers giving us more options when it comes to mpg. Shape looks similar to a Prius.

 

I know....I felt that same wave of nausea when I saw the pics.

 

Lower the roof line, lose the rear door/seats...new CRX?

 

Here's a cool episode of top Gear on fuel economy


Hybrids are still a dubious way of saving the environment in my book. Sucking it up and driving an old CRX or Metro could easily be way more eco-friendly. (I wonder if they'd be safer then a new car if you put in a roll cage and other "racing" safety devices? Airbags are great but I still wouldn't want it get hit in a prius)

 

Here's the one I was really looking for!

 

They are working on a car like this. If you look on the Honda web site there is the CRZ. The next generation 2 seater hybrid. Honda is talking about releasing it in 1-2 years. They are shooting for a price under 20k and 70+mpg.

 

They are always going to bring back the CRX 'next year'.
For the past 10 years.....

I have a few complaints about the hybrids.
(I'm an engineer working in the environmental field
but I'm not an eco terrorist,
a case can be made to drive a 72 impala if you
want to reduce the overall environmental burden
with what you drive - looking at all the pollution
that goes into making a new car, the plastics, etc
disposal of batteries, etc etc)

But my complaints are more economic.

What happens when these batteries need replacing?
They are EXPENSIVE. I mean like $5k-6k.
They will need replacing right about the time hybrids
become not in vogue anymore because the technology
is changing SO fast. The book value will be that of
the Yukon, today, (because of gas prices).

They don't actually get that great gas milage.
People are reporting with their manual minis
not getting down on it in the upper 40s highway.

I've heard but have not independantly confirmed but
I do believe that the auto makers get massive
government subsidies, like $20k per car, to make hybrids.
Since the government is the taxpayer, why should I
subsidize my neighbors car?. (a moot point with all of us
fixing to pay about 1-2 trillion in bailouts).

Now, let's look at the car itself.
It has a small engine in a light car, with the hybrid stuff.
I guess the hybrid stuff is recharger, regenerative brakes,
and batteries. Take all that out, and you have a light
car with a small engine.

I propose that if you took the something like 900 pounds
of stuff off the car that makes it a hybrid, you would get
the same, or better gas milage, than the hybrid. Then why
make a hybrid? Because of the subsidies, of course.

You would also (keep in mind I am CRX biased and I
think the car was decades ahead of its time - lots of
really cool engineering more so on the 1st generation
than the second) have a modern CRX, so to speak.
The european model was a 2 door 4 seater BTW.

So, the HF model got 58 mpg highway in 1987.
I got 48 hwy, with the AC blowing ice, at 80 mph,
with the Si model.

So, 48 mpg, 58 mpg, with 1987 technology. In 20 years,
the best we can do is 44 mpg or so with a prius?
Why? In 1987 I was using a PC, the ones with
"k" not meg memory. I don't even remember how much
K, but it was small.....A cellphone was an idea in a lab,
and was as big as a TV.....Now a cellphone has more
technology than the comptuers we used to put a man
on the moon.

I'm just pointing out what everybody already knows but I
wanted to point it out for emphesis.

So in 20 years we go from 58 mpg to 44, and we
call 44 GREAT. It isn't. Why didn't MPG progress
the same way?

Because somebody decided it shouldn't. I'm not sure who.
But you look at the advancement of technology in
every other area, a car should get 200 mpg.
Heck, when compared to the pace of communications, computers, etc
a BUS should get 200 mpg.

I realize there is a loss of efficiency with more pollution controls
and more safety equipment. But STILL - 20 years and
we are really doing no better if not worse, in the mpg arena.

So (in my opinion) this rush to buy the hybrid, maybe those
people are not stuck, but I am sure the second owner is stuck.
Having a car with ancient technology (by then) and in need
of a super expensive battery replacement and no telling what else.
The Man might even be charging battery disposal fees by then.....

And more specifically about the prius although there are
many more hybrids comming out as I write this, it is
ugly. It is just plain BUTT UGLY.

Surely the human race can do better.......

 

Well, the fuel economy in the CRX HF was great, but it also had about 60 horsepower and a 12-second zero-to-sixty time. The only reason it wasn't a complete dog was its 1700-lb curb weight.

These days, I don't think you could keep the weight down that low and still meet current safety/crash standards, unless you're talking about a *tiny* car like the Smart (1650 pounds), or you start using exotic (and expensive) materials for the construction. Heck, even a freakin' Lotus Elise weighs 200 pounds more than the HF, and there's not exactly a bunch of unnecessary weight on a Lotus.

I don't think automakers would have any trouble at all reproducing or bettering 20-year old fuel economy numbers while still meeting modern crash/safety requirements, except that the performance would suffer compared to what consumers have gotten used to.

As a society, we're not big into the hair shirt/self-flagellation thing. No one wants to drive a car that constantly reminds them of what they're sacrificing.

 

We own one of the original Honda Insight's. There's a lot of disgruntlement on the Insight forums about the new hybrid wearing the same name since it's so different. The Insight was revolutionary. It was built specifically to get the best mileage possible under the emissions laws of the time (the CVT version got better emissions and lower mileage because it didn't get lean burn like the manual tranny did). It was built right next to the NSX out of aluminum, had a magnesium oil pan and we bought ours for under $20k back in '00. This new Insight is not going to be revolutionary and looks just like a Prius . Now that new CR-Z looks pretty good.