Mystic330, I have the Focal 165 V3E polyglass system installed in my Clubby. I had the system installed a few months ago along with a 170wpc Kenwood amp. I have upgraded just the front channel and I don't think I'm going to do anything with the back. This is by far one of the two very best systems you can put in this car (R56 &R55).

The other very best is the Focal system that replaced the 165 V3E...What you are looking for is the Focal 165 VR3 polyglass system. I am told it is the only Focal set that will fit. I am told that the magnet structure of the K2 system is too big to fit; the basket and magnet of the Utopia system is also too big; and the magnet structure of the midrange in the Access system is too big. The VR3 system is available everywhere, look at Crutchfield and ebay.

http://www.crutchfield.com/s_091165V...R3.html?tp=106

http://cgi.ebay.com/FOCAL-165VR3-NEW...item1c150523c3


http://cgi.ebay.com/FOCAL-165VR3-NEW...item3cb205e8ea


I say "I have been told" because I did not personally try to fit these systems but I had good reason to believe the source in each case.

The 165 VR3 system is not cheap. It goes for between $700 and $900 new retail, depending where you buy. One thing to keep in mind, I have used Focal and JM Lab drivers for over 20 years and I have a couple of contacts who are very close to the company (one friend is a former Focal distributor) Focal can be a bit of a pain in the *** regarding warranty issues if you buy from a non-authorized dealer. This isn't an issue for me but just be aware of the issue. If you look around and bide your time an opportunity to get a set cheap may present itself. I would say that if you get this system you will never feel you overpaid regardless what you pay.

 

How much space is there between the doorcard and where you mount the speaker?

Would I be able to mount a "mdf-ring" between the speaker and the door. And still have clerance to the doorcard.

 

I don't know if you can trust this seller but this is an AMAZING deal.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=300497673721

I think someone in this thread verified that the kevlar sub does fit in the door.


edit: Note all but one of his feedbacks are for buying - not selling. It's probably too good to be true.


This page is selling a lot of Focal stuff. http://www.abt.com/search/search.php...5&image=submit

 

I've found what appears to be an excellent site to get great speakers for the cheap!

They also appear to be truly authorized resellers.

www.zalytron.com

 

That is Elliot's site. He's local to me and I've known him for about 20 years, back before this internet thing was a big deal. I believe he is an authorized Focal dealer... I actually think he's a Focal/JM labs products distributor.

He is good guy, very knowledgeable and can be very helpful. He's not big on stupid questions though.

 

it may have been one of your posts that led me to www.diymobileaudio.com where i found the link to zalytron.

 

Oh, OK.

BTW, He has a small warehouse of stuff, much of it not even listed on his website. When I need an old Focal driver I give him a call, very often he has it or something very close that I can use.

 

Great thread. So far I've read about 1/3. I jumped to the last few pages of the thread as I just purchased a 2011 S Convertible. I have standard audio. I was told by the salesman they had upgraded the audio unit. If so, I'm not impressed.

There have been changes to the head unit -- controls, etc.

I'm wondering if anyone knows how much of what is in this thread applies to a 2011.

Thank you.

 

TomFarin,
It's hard to tell without a spec sheet. The guaranteed best way would be to pull the door card off and see what you have underneath. I would be hesitent to do so having just gotten my MINI. Heck, It's only now that I am done waiting and am ordering speakers for my car a whole 1 1/2 years later.

Chances are that the lower door speaker would still receive a 6.5" speaker. Why not ask your dealer service department for info?

 

the HK has been improved. not the standard radio.

 

Derepente and MotorMouth,

Thank you for the quick response. I probably should have clarified my question. I'm not terribly concerned about speaker size and placement. I'll pop a panel or two to figure that out. From the outside I didn't notice any changes between my 2011 and the Gen 2 photos posted in this thread..

I'm much more concerned about whether the wiring changed. In my case, I'd rather buy a wiring harness and go from there than to start cutting tracing and splicing wires. I did send an e-mail to the folks at newministuff.com to find out whether their harnesses are compatible with the 2011 MC's. I'll share what they tell me.

Again, thank you for the help.

 

Tom, I recommend you contact the guys at newministuff in the UK. They might be able to help you with these questions. They are the wiring gurus when it comes to the Mini stereo system. If anyone knows the answers I would expect they would.

http://www.newministuff.com

They make wiring looms that just plug in so you can add amps and speakers etc. They are in the UK so if you buy anything expect to pay a bit for shipping.

These guys came recommended to me and I have seen them recommended by others in these pages and elsewhere. I have purchased stuff from them and I am very happy.

 

DJDRaddy and others,

DJDRaddy - Thank you for the recommendation on NewMinistuff.com. I had actually sent them an e-mail a bit earlier. But it is great to hear the positive feedback.

Everyone - Here's what I'm thinking at this point. Had I ordered my Mini, I would have ordered upgraded audio. After reading this thread, I'm glad the MC I bought off the showroom doesn't have upgraded audio. My goal is to beat the upgrade quality with aftermarket components for $750 or less.

It looks as though the 2011 Mini will take 6 1/4 speakers in the front and rear (rather than the rear 6x9s in years up to 2010). I'll know for sure Monday after I pick it back up from the dealer who is fixing the 'disappearing stripes' on my Sport package.

I've used Polk Audio speakers in past upgrades. So I'm thinking DB6501s in the front and either 6501s or 651s in the rear. Thoughts on the rear choice would be appreciated.

I'm considering an Alpine MRP F300 for the amp. 4 channels at 50 watts per channel at 4 ohms. It has a direct line out for the sub amplifier and can take either RCA or speaker line input.

I've seen great reviews on the Sound Ordinance 8-BT 120 watt self powered sub. It is on sale through today for $50 off so I placed an order from Crutchfield (only supplier). I figure I can find a place for it as it is only 3 1/4 inches tall and 9" by 14". It should more than make up for the fact I won't have 6x9s in the rear.

My first choice would be to use the newministuff kickwell loom. I could use the loom with the front RCA takeoff to feed the Alpine. But I suspect I'd lose my ability to use headunit fade. On the other hand, I could use the loom with both front and back takeoff. I need to check the manual for the Alpine to see whether it can take two input sources in which case I could use the fade. Thoughts here would also be appreciated.

I'll just need to work out where to pick off the signal to turn the amps on and off. It looks as though from this thread I have more than one option.

If I go with a pair of DB6501's cost will be:
Alpine Amplifier $113.95 - Amazon
2 pair - Polk DB 6501's - $307.14 - Amazon
Sound Ordinance 8-Bt - $149.99 Crutchfield (normally $199.99)
newministuff Loom - Roughly $90 including shipping from the UK

Total - $671.08, less with DB 651's or if I decide to splice wiring myself.

Thoughts would be appreciated. By the way I'm 65 years old and my hearing isn't what it once was so expensive speaker upgrades from what I've spec'd is not likely to improve my experience. Over the years I've done many audio upgrades, but never in a situation quite this complex. The last used DB 651s in my Acura RSX.

This is a great thread and I really appreciate all the work that went into it.

Tom

 

Hi TOm,

The 2011 still has 6x9s in the back.

 

Motormouth,

I have a 2011 convertible. I based my conclusion about rear speaker size on Tomeav's post on 6/25/10 (page 30 of this thread) indicating he found 6.5" speakers where he expected tp find 6x9's. Could this be a convertible-specific feature?

Tom

 

Hi Tom,
I read your proposed system and I think there are a couple of things you may want to consider. These are my thoughts that you are free take or leave as you see fit.

BTW, I used the recommendations from the guys at newministuff as to amp selection and wiring loom choice.

First, I would like to find out if MINI has made any changes to the "Rear Channel Issue" Are you familiar with this? I would answer this before I did anything else.

Second, how are you going to "insert" your amp? This is important because it will determine how you can drive your amp, speakers, etc. I like the amp you are considering but your choice presents you with a couple of issues. The guys at newministuff recommended I use a Kenwood amp instead of the alpine. They use the Kenwood amps in the upgrades they do. The reason is that the Kenwood has Speaker-level inputs with signal sensing turn-on. This addresses the power-on issue with the Alpine. This also allows you to use the kickwell speaker-splice loom which is the easiest to install and the least intrusive to the car's wiring.

Third, I believe your car, like mine, is equipped with a speaker system where the music signal is split between two separate drivers, a 100mm “tweeter” mounted in upper door area, and a 150 mm “woofer” mounted lower in each door. This creates a problem for you if you are looking to install the Polk's which are 2 way coaxial drivers. You will either have 2 tweeters producing much of the same sound from 2 different locations or you will need to de-activate one. Either way you go the result will be significantly less than optimal.

I would suggest that you consider installing a good component speaker system with separate woofers and tweeters. You will want a 6.5 inch woofer system to give you better bass. I can elaborate more about this later.

Fourth, it appears that you intend to mount the same Polk 6.5” 2 way coaxial drivers in the rear. I think your ragtop has 6.5” drivers in the rear but that’s not my issue. My issue with doing the rear channel at the same time as you do the front involves the first question. I would want to know the answer to the first question before I upgraded the rear speakers. If the rear channel is still “compromised” I wouldn’t use it, I would drive the rear speakers off the front channel. This is real easy to do by jumping the front channel drive to all 4 channels of your amp.

I would actually recommend that you do your upgrade in phases, first do the front and then the rear later. This should allow you to spend a little more on your front channel speakers if you leave the rears for later. I would want you to listen to the front channel upgrade for a while and see if you feel you really need to do the back. The front channel is super super important in the ragtop, more so than the Hardtop or Clubby.

Good luck

 

Tom, I just looked back at your post and I think I may have mis-read the Polk speakers you listed. I thought I read 651 but I see 6501 now, the 6501 is a component system... so dis-regard my comments about that.

BTW, how do you propose using the 6501's in the rear?

Sorry, My bad I think?

 

doh! didn't realize you had convertible.. The converts don't have 6x9s

 

For what it's worth, without hassling with an amp on a standard system, I'm cranking out incredible sound in my 2010 for under $300

Front/Rear Channel Swap...No cost
JVC CS-BB2 Powered Sub in the rear...$100
Polk Audio DXi650s (92db) in the lower front doors...$100
Polk Audio DXi350s (91db) in the upper front doors...$60

Total invested: $260.00 plus tax and a lot of labor (but it was worth it)

The sound is incredible, it was a complete make over. Run my "eq" at +2 to the rear...bass at +2...treble at -1. With sensitivity of the Polks over the 90 mark, it's hard to believe it's just a standard audio system. And the Polks have more than enough headroom to add an amp later if I want. Only thing I have left to do is a swap of the rear 6x9s, but I doubt I will. The sound I have now is more than satisfying to me.

 

Guys,

Thank you for all the help. All this good stuff is causing a rise in my confidence level (whether justified or not ).

Djdraddy,

I think I tripped you up by considering both the 651s and the 6501s in the rear. I'm considering the 6501s in the rear to balance both power capacity and sensitivity between front and rear speakers. I'm not sure I'd use the tweets in the rear. Thoughts here would still be appreciated. I suspect I may be throwing money away here unnecessarily.

What has me leaning toward the Alpine amplifier is that Crutchfield claims in one of their videos it is their highest selling amp and I was able to locate the manual on line. Like the Kenwood it also allows for speaker level inputs. The kickwell splice loom should work in either case as long as I deal with the power on/off issue separately.

You are right about the Kenwood having the advantage of not needing a power on/off feed. But I'm going to need to deal with that issue anyway as my powered sub requires a power on/off feed. From reading this and the swap threads there are at least four different potential pickup points.

10Zero,

Thank you for the feedback. At this point I have the front 6501s and the powered sub on order. I plan to do the 6501 door installs first and see how that sounds. The powered sub can always be repurposed to add some bass to my Avalanche.

As for adequate power to speakers, keep in mind I have a convertible. So I may need more power to the speakers when the top is down.

I read the entire front/rear swap thread last night (bedside reading). Molex style connectors don't intimidate me. I've scratch wired modular railroads using Molex connectors to bridge the sections. The front/rear swap looks pretty straightforward. Also, it appears there is an on/off feed in the connector behind the x9331, so I could deal with that issue at the same time. While I'm in there I'll check to see whether the front/rear issue was 'corrected' in the 2011.

Djdraddy,

You are probably right about wiring in the amp. Just use the front feeds (rear if swapped?) and feed all the speakers using the Alpine's four channels. The Alpine also has a line out for the sub amp.

I hope to hear from NewMiniStuff today on whether things changed for the 2011. I suspect even if the head unit changed, the x9331 didn't with the possible exception of fixing the front/rear issue.

One solution to the front/rear swap issue not discussed in the swap thread is to put an adaptor between the male and female x9331 similar to that sold by newministuff. Assuming the appropriate connector can be located, that might be less work than fabricating something to push the male pins back out. That solution would also allow an easy switch back to factory or a substitution of the NewMiniStuff amplifier harness.

Thanks again to all of you for this thread and your help.

Tom

 

Tom, looks like you have things pretty well in hand, but one last thing from me would be that under no circumstances should you do a channel swap and use the rear channel to drive anything in your car, especially your car.

Unless MINI has changed this issue, the rear channel in the Gen 2 mini is severely compromised (no signal below about 150hz) and would be disastrous if you chose to use it to drive the front speakers in a ragtop. Just use the front channel to drive everything.

Good Luck,

 

Djdraddy,

Aha!

Let's see if I understand your thought process behind what you are recommending to me.

The primary reason for doing a MC front/rear swap is to feed the highs and mids to upgraded speakers in the doors and feed a better bass signal to the 6x9s in the rear.

But in a convertible, I don't have 6x9's in the rear. I have four crappy 5" factory speakers, two in the front and two in the rear.

In my case I'm better off feeding the complete front signal to my upgraded front speakers and relying on them for bass, midrange and highs and forgetting about the back speakers. If I'm interpreting you properly it makes a lot of sense to me.

Of course, my other option is to feed the complete front signals from a kickplate tap into a 4 channel amp with a line out to a powered sub. Then feed upgraded front and rear speakers complete signals from the 4 channels of the amp, while feeding a complete line out to my powered sub. Then rely on the equalizer capabilities in the Polk Audio components and in the amp (s) to limit signals to the appropriate frequency ranges for the appropriate speakers.

I suspect long range I'll end up doing the latter option but I'll upgrade the fronts for now and see how I feel without the amp. That mod I am going to have to do anyway.

Thanks for your help, buddy.

Tom

 

Folks,

In the last 24 hours I spent a lot of time reading threads relating to the x9331 connector behind the drivers side kickplate. The threads include pinouts, how to do front/back swaps and what parts to order to build a wiring harness to fit between the male and female x9331 connector. My readings have motivated me to jump right into a full audio upgrade. My goal in a previous post was to come in below $750. As you read through this keep in mind this is a R57 convertible with the base audio system (needing additional quality volume and lacking 6x9 rear speakers). At this point, the following equipment and parts are on order.

1 Pair Polk Audio DB6501 component speakers ($154 - Amazon) - This component package includes a pair of 6 1/2 inch speakers, a pair of 1" tweeters and a crossover for each side. I intend to install this package in the door with the crossover in the armrest. While some have put a tweeter in the base of the A pillar, I'm considering surface mounting mine on the door in front of the door handle. That would be much cheaper (no A pillar cover swaps) and would simplify wiring. The Polk tweeters are designed for surface mounting. The 6 1/2 inch will go in the large opening in the door. These speakers are rated at 120 watts RMS.

1 Sound Ordinance 8-BT integrated subwoofer/amplifier ($150 - Crutchfield on sale) - The integrated amplifier puts out 120 Watts RMS into an 8 inch subwoofer. It accepts a low level amp or high level speaker feeds and has sensing circuitry to sense high level speaker signals and turn on/off automatically. I just need to find a location in the back of my MC that is as unobtrusive as possible. I should have this part in my hands later this week for test fitting. Dimensions are roughly 3" x 9" by 14". The signal will be fed from the Alpine.

1 Alpine MRP F300 Amplifier ($134 - Amazon) - this is a four channel amp that puts out 50 watts RMS per channel at 4 ohms. It is Crutchfield's highest selling amp and has great reviews. It accepts both low level and high level (speaker) inputs. It does require an on/off signal line. It can be bridged to a 2 channel with 150 watts RMS per channel at 4 ohms. It has a line output to feed signals to a sub (the Sound Ordinance)

X9331 Parts ($38 - ecstuning.com) - includes a male and female x9331 connector housing, 12 male pins and 12 female pins. These are BMW/MINI parts, part numbers are in other threads or I can supply. I will use it to build a harness that fits between the male and female X9331 in the MC kickplate area. $1 per pin ???? - Oh my !! Molex wants five cents, but these parts need to match.

The incoming half of the MINI x9331 has 12 connectors.
- Four will be passed through as if the harness wasn't inserted at all.
- Another four are the positive and negative feeds for the right and left front speakers. These will be routed in the harness to a six line Molex connector and from there back to the Alpine amplifier. The fifth line will carry the amp on/off signal picked up from terminal 1 of the X15 connector directly behind the x9331. The five line Molex run will carry complete audio spectrum front signals to the Alpine and will carry the on/off signal.
- The remaining four are the positive and negative feeds for right and left rear speakers. These will be terminated to a four line Molex connector in the harness and left unconnected as I currently have no intention to use the stock MINI rear 6" speakers. They are not 6x9s as in R56 versions of the MINI and plenty of bass will come from the Sound Ordinance powered subwoofer.

I plan to bridge the Alpine converting it into 2 channel 150 watt RMS amplifier. Amplified front door signals will be returned to the kickplate area via a 4 line Molex terminated run. I may also run a second four line run back to the kickplate in the event I change my mind in the future about using the rear speakers. The second Molex terminated line will be left unhooked at both the amplifier end and at the kickplate end for now.

The four amplified full audio spectrum lines returned to the kickplate from the Alpine will feed the outgoing x9331 (through a 4 pin Molex in the harness) routing signals through the MINI wiring to the door speakers and will power the Polk DB6501s. In summary, the MINI feeds 12 wires into the incoming half of the x9331 and the harness will feed 8 to the outgoing x9331. I may hook the remaining four pins of the outgoing x9331 to a Molex connector should I wish to power a rear speaker upgrade in the future. That Molex would also be left unhooked.

Should I decide to upgrade the rear speakers in the future, it would be a simple matter of mating the 4 pin Molex connectors (harness and unused run)in the kickplate, unbridging the amp and using the other two amp channels to power the other end of the unused 4 line run, powering the rear speakers (after upgrading). I don't think that is going to be necessary as I will have high quality component speakers in the doors and a powered subwoofer in the rear and plenty of RMS power to drive both.

This entire project should come in around $500. At this point I have $476 out of pocket but need to pick up the Molex connectors and the wiring for the runs. Fortunately none of thise are BMW/MINI parts. The above costs include shipping.

I'm looking at you guys to shoot holes in this approach. Fire away!

Tom

 

Why not use the factory tweeter location, in front of the arm rest, to mount your tweeters? Those OEM speakers are not going to be used in your setup any, right? I wouldn't since they are not even in the same category as your polks.

Tweeters need to be angled so that they are literally pointing at you when installed. You'll like them if you mount them flat... But you might like them more if mounted angled Towards you.

 

Derepente,

My kneecap rests against the smaller factory speaker opening on the drivers side when I drive. I'm not sure I have ever heard that speaker. The location I'm considering is about 8" higher and about the same distance back from the front door edge.

I'm considering building a small enclosure out some scrap 1/4" oak veneer plywood with the speaker mounting surface angled in my direction. The speaker would be recessed in the enclosure. The enclosure would be surface mounted to the flat triangular area of the door slightly above and to the car front side of the door handle. I'd wrap the enclosure in the 3M carbon fiber look alike which I also plan to use in a number of other areas of the interior.

I ordered my molex connectors and speaker cable last night. The speaker cables are #16 two and four lead cables designed for interior speaker lines in the walls of a house. I ordered them from mono-price.com. The Molex connectors will be coming from Radio Shack.

Im now at $540 primarily because the smallest roll of 4 lead speaker cables is 100'. I can't imagine using more than 10-15'. When I finish my installation, I'll be happy to send chunks to all the good (but needy) people who are helping me out with this project.

I will be running #8 positive power lines to both amplifiers. One amp kit comes with the powered sub from Crutchfield. I also have one left over from another project.

I know better than to run a power lead along side my speaker wire run (induced noise from the power run). How did the rest of you deal with this issue? Ideally both the speaker wire runs to and from the amplifier and the power runs will go up the driver's side of the MC. How much separation do I need and where did you run the cables?

Tom