First, if you buy these, order two extra bearings...$40.00


I spoke with Jeff today regarding a couple of modifications.

1. Update instructions to indicate the stock washer and two spacers under the bearing. Currently the instructions show one under and one on top.

2. Any way to drain water from the bearing should water become trapped in it...answer was "no". This would probably require a complete re-design...not sure this is a problem in practice.

3. Make plates available that increase the height of the camber plate. Most of us are typically concerned with plates that raise ride height. These are exactly the same height as stock...so when adding a lowering coilover for example, there may not be enough height. There is enough room to add two plates, or 1/4".

His demeanor was positive about 1 and 2, but not sure how long it would take to arrange 2.

 

What is the problem with the washers as instructed?

 

As I posted elsewhere, the large washer above the upper spring perch will bind against the bearing block if installed with less than 2 IE washers. The same is true for the 2 washers above the bearing.

 

DrPhilGandini, ScottinBend

I read your post regarding the order, but my plates came with 3 spacers, not four. I called Jeff and he said to install two above the stock washer - under the bearing - and one on top, the instructions I have show one under and one above. Two below and one on top fits very well...if I install two on top, the nut will barely catch threads on the damper, and, will contact the upper portion of the bearing. I beleive you ground some the material away to avoid contact. I also used the stock nut and not the one provided by H&R since its outside dimension is 1mm larger and squared off at the bottom. I felt more comfortable with more space around the nut.

Another mod that would have been nice; enlarge the hole to the nut on the dampers. If this needs to be tightened, the plate needs to be removed from the car, and the top portion of the bearing removed. A wee bit of a PITA.

The 3 or 4 spacer difference is a little puzzling, but mine works fine. Our coilovers are different, however...not sure about the actual differences.

 

I noticed that durring my install... I fabricated a smaller diameter washer from a few OEM strut washers I had laying around. I used a grinder and a drill. I have to believe you could buy an apropriate washer at the HW store, but it would have taken me more time to drive there and back than massage the washers I had; so I can't say for sure. I'm 2.5 degrees negative camber and a quick check with my eyeball told me there could have been a binding issue with only one washer.

 

meb: it all seems to be coming together for you--great! I agree that the 2 washers under the bearing is the preferred set up. I did put 2 above and as you say, releave the inside edge of the hole in the top part of the bearing block--a 1/16" chamfer just to be sure... It would be great if that hole were big enough to access the strut top nut without disassembling the strut from the car, but it would leave little meat on the block near the 4 cap screws that are used for camber adjustment, is my guess.
cheers,

 

...yes, now that you mention that. I didn't really focus on the relationship between the small hole and the four allen screws...twas an observation after the install...and I may not have tightened the passenger side enough. So, I'll attempt to remove the plate and top portion of the bearing, but leave the strut attached to the knuckle...I know I can lower this far enough, but I may not have room for my hands and tools...

Another observation...I beleive I can get more neg camber from these than with the Megans...about a 1/2 degree more. This is a visual, not an alignment rig observation. What do you guys think - 2.5 degrees??? The Megan perch was really tapped out at 2 degrees neg., but the springs had lots more room before contacting the strut towers.

 

I have -2.0 and I cut away little notches in the shock towers for access to the inside 2 cap screws--but, they aren't even close! I'd say -2.5 is easy, and a little cutting of the tower holes will ensure your alignment guys can give good access. I see the only thing stopping you from getting -3 would be the springs hitting the inside of the shock tower, and maybe not even that.

 

Unfortunately for me I learned the hard way that these plates (and probably any plates ) won't work with the TEIN SS+ coilovers.

When the piston shaft snapped on the right front, I lost two of the washers I had below.

In order to get the car ready for the Dragon, I got a set of PSS9's but didn't have enough washers to use the plates.

My kit came with 3 for each side so I only had 4 washers for both struts.

With the PSS9's I noticed that even using 2 washers below the bearing that the bearing block was still binding against the upper spring perch.

Order was spring perch, flat OE washer, 2 IE washers, camber plate.....and so I decided to just go back to the stock upper strut mounts.

One other suggestion I'd have is to actually include the directions with the kit. My did not come with any and it just happens I had it correctly installed initially (2 below the bearing, one above between the nut and the bearing)

Lastly the upper plate's finish is not exactly that robust.

Partsman commented that it looked like I had the plates on for 10 years, not 3 months.

 

That was one of my very questions posed to Jeff. I was concerned that the lower portion of the strut bolt would contact the bearing, and in fact is does while moving it in your hands. His reply was that for this to happen, you need about 20 degrees of rotation - in hand - but in actual practice it's about 7 degrees. I plan to pull these apart tomorrow night - if I get home early enough - to inspect them before I drive to Don's shop for an alignment and CB.

Keep in mind as I wrote above, I used the stock strut bolt. The lower portion of the stock bolt is rounded and the bolt has a diameter 1 mm less than most aftermarket bolts - H&R in my case. These are tiny tolerances and every little bit helps here.

Regarding the top plates...I'm working on a custom kit as we speak...I've no idea of cost yet. But the plates will be 2.5-3 times as thick.

 

I would suggest more clearance between the strut nut and the top aluminum section of the plates. When hitting bumps the strut nut slams into this piece. It feels like someone hit the car with a sledge hammer.

For the price these are close, but SO far away. I took a gamble with these and lost. In retrospect I should have spent a little more money on decent plates, which is what I'll be doing now anyway. I could have spent the $275 on something else.

I may take some time to sort these out, but I think the design is doomed, at least for a street car. Spherical bearing, very little bushing material and the above mentioned clearance.

I see alot of threads about theseplates, if you have a set already that's one thing, but everyone else should move on to something better built, imho.

 

The clearance is tight...but I haven't felt that kind of contact...but when i pull these apart tonight, any contact will be revealed inside...I'll report back.

 

I have about 1k miles without issue... I used three washers; two narrow diameter flat washer underneath the plate and one thick (maybe 1/8") lock washer on top that came with my H&R coils. There is no evidence of any issue... I'm running -2.5 degrees. No clunking. Although the ride height adjustment wrenches rattle a little bit in my glove box durring low RPM launch.

 

You received washers with your H&R kit??? I received nuts, no washers...not that it matters. It went together easily with the stock washer and IE supplies spacers.

 

I'll try to attach a pic... It was taken with my phone so it's not the greatest; but it should show that I ended up with about 3-4mm of clearance.

 

I just had these apart and I could clearly see where it had impacted. I checked the play of the bushing when raising and lowering the car on the lift. There is less play than stock, but too much for the clearance my plates have. Someone mentioned poorly cast bushings on early batches, maybe that is all it is. Maybe it's my shocks, biltstein sport. Whatever the case, the hit is extreemly hard and not inline with the stiffness of the suspension. I know what I need to do, but I'm working on other parts of the car at this time.

Anyone else with the hard crashing on pot holes, freeway joints, etc...? Obviously these obstacles will be harder than stock suspensions, but this is a very solid hit.

Here's a tip for those installing these plates. Put anti seize on all the bolts and don't over torque them, the aluminum is very soft.

 

...yes...but I'll pull these apart tonight...

 

No problems and no rubbing anywhere...no signs of contact. I'm hopeful the condition remains the same for the next 100,000 miles The losseness, no, odd deflection appear to be coming from the Power Flex bushing. I thought it was fine as it moves freely enough in my hands with the outer ball joint disconnected. But I cannot create the same loads as a car in motion contacting a pot hole at 80mph...I'm a little suspect of these bushings now.

 

I meant the bushings in the plates.

 

Sorry 002, not sure what you mean...

 

The extra bearings that you recommend are surrounded by a PU bushing. That bushing alows axial play (like most mounts). When raising or lowering the car on lift you can get a feel for the play that they have. When lowering my car the strut rod nut settles within mm. of the top half of the mount's aluminum sandwitch. I can see where the nut has been impacting the top aluminum piece. Unless my plates are significantly different from the rest, I would expect others to have a similar issue. There's nothing unusual about my set up, H&R with bilstein sport and IE street/race plates.

I hope that makes more sense. I hate trying to explain physical properties in a short post without beeing able to wave my hands around.

I'll try to get a picture up.

 

...apollogies for the highjack... but, when viewed from the top, does your set-up and clearances look different from the photo I attached above? I'm not familiar with the Bilstein Sport (although rumor has it that the H&R damper in our kit is actually made by Bilstein)... if the Bilstein sport that you are talking about is an adjustable style damper with the adjustment in the strut-rod; these style strut-rods tend to be longer than the non-adjustable found in the H&R kit. Also, if the ride height range (i.e.; the H&R damn near slams the car even at the highest setting) or other dimensional characterstics of the strut are different with the bilstein sport, could that maybe account for variations in the tollerances (i.e.; I know -camber increases as the ride height is lowered ergo if the ride height is higher it may be necessary to use more inward adjustment at the camber plate to get the desired -camber. Also, there is the style of the nut; I can say for certain that the H&R kit I have uses a flatter nut than stock strut.

At the end of the day, I don't see evidence that any part of the strut-rod, etc. of my H&R damper is hitting the IE street/race camber plate after 1000miles on some pretty cr#@ roads. I had the struts off two weekends ago to make sure everything was kosher before a corner balance and alligment. I can say that my IE plates were bought in Jan of 07... IE may have made some recent changes to the plate and bearing?

 

chilirojo,
That is pretty much what mine look like, but with much less clearance. Your gap, the black section between the nut and the aluminum, is huge compared to mine. I'll just have to take them apart again and shave off some material. If now one else has this issue, then maybe I can get these to work. They need new bearings anyway. I'm just not sure I want to waste any more time or money with IE.

 

002,

That is never good to hear. If you find out IE isn't in a hurry to make it right (I doubt they'll hesitate), please let us know.

-Rojo

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to turn people against IE. I just wanted to add my experiece to the forum and gain insight from everyone.

I may get these to work for me, but I have no intention of holding IE responsible. There's no malice here, if that is how it was coming off.

Now back to your regulary scheduled program.