It seems to be a good fit. More power and better LSD (I think) but weighs a ton (well, one and a half tons)

 

Just under 2900lbs but can fit good size tires, 245s according to those on the sccaforums board.

TomA

 

I think it will come in around 2700lbs, or, 200lbs heavier than our Mini's. But, with 42 more HP, if it has ANY camber, it should be one to watch out for IMO. Who knows though? Anyone have an opinion?

 

A couple of folks from Vancouver BC did pretty extensive test drives and were very impressed. It could be a good match...

 

Any word on camber?

 

Hmm. Maybe I did get out at the right time...

My co-driver from '04, Ian Baker, keeps hinting at getting one. It would be a good choice for an everyday/autocross car, that's for sure.

Brian

 

The above from a post on Honda-tech.com.

 

"Cram" a 235? At what cost in extra diameter. Most of the stock tires are some wacky small diameter while most of the R Compound choices are larger diameters, the 17's being made for larger vehicles.
So, a 235/40R17 isn't going to be a good choice for a car that comes with, say, a 215/40R17. However, with the 57mph 2nd gear, as long as the car has power and can fit that 235, it could work out OK.

Makes you just want to go to a shifter kart doesn't it?

Brian

 

It looks like the Si will come stock with a Michelin Pilot Exalto PE2 215/45R17 that has a 24.6" diameter on a 17x7 wheel.

The 225/45 R17 and the 245/40 R17 A3S05's are both 24.5" diameter tires. Supposedly there are more V710 sizes coming. Not sure if any are 17's. All of the current V710's are 25.4" or larger in diameter.

I also read that the Si may come with an optional 18" wheel. Can you fit a 245/35 R18 V710 (24.8" diameter) on what will probably be a 7" wide wheel?

The tire options don't look as bad for the Si as I thought they would. I may have to stop by a dealer sometime and see what kind of room is in the front fenderwells.

 

FWIW, on speed channel this sunday at 830pm there's "honda test drive" re: 06 civic si.....

 

Anyone see this? I've been reading a lot on this, and so far test results have said very little negative. Some reviews seem like they're trying to marry the car. A bit questionable to me. Anyway, any other takes on this??

 

How much can one really learn about a cars autocross potential from a speed channel test drive? Now if sportscar or grassroots got a hold of one and took it out on a course with other GS cars, I would be interested. Either way I'm hoping the 245 V710 doesn't fit.

 

I have heard that 2 Civic si's were dyno'd at 200whp and 203whp! I'm going to go check one out to see what all the hype is about.

At my local Honda dealer, I have a tech thats going to check out the camber adjustability of front/rear and we might even be able to see how much rubber can be stuffed under there. I'd say GS is going to be a battle next year either way if 245's will fit and the suspension isn't too sloppy.

I know the wheel base on the Civic's is longer, so, on some slalom intensive courses, no matter what, the Mini will most likely be on top, but, what about a course like nationals for 2005? I'm thinking this Civic might have been a good choice. I guess we'll find out next season. :-)

 

From Honda's website:

*For 2006, Honda is complying with the new SAE standard for measuring horsepower and torque, SAE net (Rev 8/04). This new method slightly reduces a vehicle's horsepower rating and torque due to more stringent testing procedures. Many manufacturers are still using the older standard of measurement. Horsepower and torque can only be fairly compared if both vehicles were calculated using the same SAE standard.

Jake

 

I had one of my local SCCA guys who is a tech run some numbers, and, he found the following to be true on an EX, which, he verified had the same parts for everything besides valving I think.

Negative .3 to .5 on the front
6.6 degree's of negative caster! This means, while turning, the car will produce more negative camber while cornering, maybe up to 1 degree he said.
The rear had negative 1 to -1.5 degree's or so, although, he didn't mess with that any.

Rear swaybar on the Civic Si is 110% LARGER than the regular civic EX, so, they have definitely made it to perform better out of the box.

I think our Mini's will be OK on slalom intensive courses. On sweeper intensive courses, I think they will have a good advantage with the caster(just a guess)

On the tires, I was told the 245/40/17's will fit with no problem. That sucks for us in GS. Either way, I still think nothing can compete with a Mini on slalom intensive courses in GS anyway. We shall certainly see.

Craig

 

It looked like a glorified infomercial to me. Actually, my wife was the first one to make that call . The only negative I heard from the "test drivers" was that the brakes experienced some fade.

Over on the GRM board there is a thread comparing the Mini to the new Civic. I can't stomach it .

Mini- What sport compacts aspire to be

 

Below is a quote from Tim Herron, he's an SCCA autocrosser in CS(placed 3rd last year) who is also a Honda Tech here in the KC area. He was the one who did the alignment specs for everyone on a 2006 Civic EX that they had in stock. He was asked about if factory crash bolts were listed in the Factory Service Manual. Here is his response...........................


"Great questions!!! I looked in the Factory Service Manual and found the part number for factory crash bolts ( P/N 90119-SNA-305). According to the service manual, with both bolts in lower and upper holes of strut/knuckle assembly, expect a camber gain of +/- .5 degrees each side. I expect more like almost a full degree negative camber with use of factory crash bolts. I believe this is also a first for Honda as they have never had a published crash bolt part number or repair procedure before. Although I may be mistaken.

Honda states factory caster should be +7.0 degrees +/- 1.0 degree.
Front camber should be 0.0 degrees +/- .3 degrees per side. ( I witnessed -.3 to -.5 per side just setting up car on alignment rack )
Toe at 0.0 degrees +/- .08 degrees per side.
Rear toe at +0.08 degrees +/- .08 degrees
Rear camber at -1.3 degrees +/- .6 degrees.

Keep in mind though, there is no rear camber adjustment. I still don't think that -1.3 degrees will be too hard to work around as there is quite a bit of rear toe adjustment to be had to help free up the rear end.

Again, these are all factory recommended specifications. With Honda now publishing a crash bolt with part number, static negative camber gain will be even better."

 

Anyway, I'd say with the above info, I'd say the Mini's are finished in GS on sweeper intensive courses. We had a hard enough time with the 140HP Celica's(120whp), now that these 203whp -2 degree camber Civic's(while cornering) are out in GS, we are certainly going to have our hands full.

On slalom intensive courses, I'd certainly guess that we will still prevail.

On a mixture slalom/transition/sweeper, its gonna be a dog fight for sure.

 

Should be fun!

 

Egg-zactly!

 

Has anyone seen very many Si's yet? I think I've only seen run once this year, and it didn't even come close. The driver had about a year autox experience and said he felt like there was no low end power for autocross. Which is obvious with the way that Vtec motor works.

 

There have been a few out at National events. I think Jeff McCrae(sp) had one out at Devens at couple weeks ago. I think he was 4-5 seconds behind Tony Savini. Not a real good indication that they will ever be competitive. There was also another one at Walnut Ridge for the National Tour and it was way off the pace. Its still too early to tell if anyone will be able to make one competitive, but, I'd guess they won't.

 

Wow, 4-5 seconds....sheesh. I can also imagine that the new GTI would be about the same pace, if not worse. It can't be that easy to throw around when it weighs WELL over the 3000 lb mark. Can't remember something around 3300. Kind of a pig. It'll be interesting what'll happen at the end of the year, and what new competition they throw into the mix.

 

Here in Omaha there is a regular who shows up in his '06 Si. He's still running his street tires and he's a little over a second off my pace. But I'm still running my Pirelli Euforia run-flats so...

 

There's an autocross comparison test in Import Tuner (i think that's the mag.) that test the Si and GTi on identical R-compound tires. Even with the awesome torque of the GTi, it wasn't even close. Several different drivers drove both cars and everybody was faster in the Si by almost 2 seconds. Turn-in on the Si is said to be very good. The GTi suffers from obesity and springs that are way to soft.

How will the Si compare to the MINI? Well like everybody has said the course will probably be the determining factor, but not just because of sweepers vs. slaloms. I think it'll be a lot like what I see with the S2000. If you can keep the Si on VTEC it'll be fast, if not, the MCS should beat it. Time will tell.