Hello all....

I have a 2002 MINI Cooper with navigation system.

I am considering replacing the stock speakers and adding an amplifier.

I can not change the headunit because I will lose the full Navigation functionality.

I know nothing about car speakers or amplifiers.

What I do know is that I do not want to cut up my MINI for new speakers. I'd like to have speakers that fit in the same places as the stock speakers.

The amplifier is tricky. I don't want it to take up space in my boot. So it must be able to be hidden somewhere perhaps under the driver seat or in one of the compartments on the side of the boot, if that's even possible.

Most important to me is QUALITY sound not BOOMING bass.

Can anyone help me to pick out the right stuff?

Also, if you know of any GREAT installers in Washington state please let me know!

Maynerd

 

Hey Maynard, I'm in Portland and would be happy to help you. I've have completely removed the stock system and installed new fronts and rears, a sub and 3 amps. Sounds like you would want to go with a small, but good 4 channel amp that could be placed in the passenger side cubby of the boot. Since you want to keep the stock head unit, you'll also need to make sure the amp has high level inputs.

I would suggest something like the Blaupunkt PA4100 4-channel amp. It's the size of a paperback book and runs cool, so it would fit easily in the cubby hole. Also, it's a very clean and powerful amp.

As for speakers, well that is VERY subjective. I suggest you listen to many different brands at a local shop and decide which sound best to you. You'll want5.25" or 6.5" components in the front and 6x9s for the rear.

Personally, I have 4 way 6x9s. Woofer/mid/tweet/super tweet. Really improves the imaging. I would definitely suggest at least a 3 way 6x9 if you like vocal and or tight/crisp sound.

Let me know if you have any questions. What part of WA are you in?

R

 

Thanks for the input Davbret.

I am in the seattle area. More specifically Bremerton.

So you think that this blaupunkt would fit in the boot cubby? If so it sounds like a good amp for me. It looks like it has good power. Is it a very clean amp? As far as importance for this set up is...

1. Keep navigation functionality
2. No cutting of the MINI
3. Do not take any extra space in the MINI
4. Sound is really clean
5. Bass

I guess that's the order of importance for me. Probably missed a few things.

I understand that I need to listen to some speakers before I decide. However can you point me in the direction of a few different types of speakers? I am somewhat clueless when it comes to brands for this stuff.

I'm also considering the blitzsafe thing so I can hook it up to an IPOD. I called one installer and they said the blitzsafe is kinda lame, but that was the first time I'd heard something like that.

Maynerd

 

Yes, the Blaupunkt is very clean. It's a class T amp!!

As far as speakers, I would steer you towards:
-Focal
-Infinity
-Pioneer

Those are my personal favorites, as far as the actual sound vs price. I have all Pioneer in my car. Everyone's tastes are different though.

R

 

does that blaupunk amp for $450.00 seem like a good deal? I was looking on crutchfield.com and found almost every amp was that or less. Is it because of the size?

Has anyone tried the Infinity Kappa Speakers?

 

What's a class T amp?

 

Class A amplifier - Class A operation is where both devices conduct continuously for the entire cycle of signal swing, or the bias current flows in the output devices at all times. The key ingredient of class A operation is that both devices are always on. There is no condition where one or the other is turned off. Because of this, class A amplifiers are single-ended designs with only one type polarityoutput devices. Class A is the most inefficient of all power amplifier designs, averaging only around 20%. Because of this, class A amplifiers are large, heavy and run very hot. All this is due to the amplifier constantly operating at full power.The positive effect of all this is that class A designs are inherently the most linear, with the least amount of distortion.

Class B amplifier - Class B operation is the opposite of class A. Both output devices are never allowed to be on at the same time, or the bias is set so that current flow in a specific output device is zero when not stimulated with an input signal, i.e., the current in a specific output flows for one half cycle. Thus each output device is on for exactly one half of a complete sinusoidal signal cycle. Due to this operation, class B designs show high efficiency but poor linearity around the crossover region. This is due to the time it takes to turn one device off and the other device on, which translates into extreme crossover distortion. Thus restricting class B designs to power consumption critical applications, e.g., battery operated equipment, such as 2-way radio and other communications audio.

Class AB amplifier - Class AB operation allows both devices to be on at the same time (like in class A), but just barely. The output bias is set so that current flows in a specific output device appreciably more than a half cycle but less than the entire cycle. That is, only a small amount of current is allowed to flow through both devices, unlike the complete load current of class A designs, but enough to keep each device operating so they respond instantly to input voltage demands. Thus the inherent non-linearity of class B designs is eliminated, without the gross inefficiencies of the class A design. It is this combination of good efficiency (around 50%) with excellent linearity that makes class AB the most popular audio amplifier design.

Class D amplifier - Class D operation is switching, hence the term switching power amplifier. Here the output devices are rapidly switched on and off at least twice for each cycle. Since the output devices are either completely on or completely off they do not theoretically dissipate any power. Consequently class D operation is theoretically 100% efficient, but this requires zero on-impedance switches with infinitely fast switching times -- a product we're still waiting for; meanwhile designs do exist with true efficiencies approaching 90%.

Class G amplifier - Class G operation involves changing the power supply voltage from a lower level to a higher level when larger output swings are required. There have been several ways to do this. The simplest involves a single class AB output stage that is connected to two power supply rails by a diode, or a transistor switch. The design is such that for most musical program material, the output stage is connected to the lower supply voltage, and automatically switches to the higher rails for large signal peaks. Another approach uses two class AB output stages, each connected to a different power supply voltage, with the magnitude of the input signal determining the signal path. Using two power supplies improves efficiency enough to allow significantly more power for a given size and weight. Class G is becoming common for pro audio designs.

Class H amplifier - Class H operation takes the class G design one step further and actually modulates the higher power supply voltage by the input signal. This allows the power supply to track the audio input and provide just enough voltage for optimum operation of the output devices. The efficiency of class H is comparable to class G designs.

Class T amplifier - Uses Tripath's proprietary Digital Power Processing (DPP®) technology. Class-T amplifiers offer both the audio fidelity of Class-AB and the power efficiency of Class-D amplifiers, while running cool.


Hope this helps.

R

 

yo Davbret: where did you source that amplifier classification info?

derivational idea: I've always wanted to put a pair of Pass Labs XA200's in a car; it would be a challenge to stuff them in a MINI!? You have any ideas on DC/AC converters?

 

I kinda cut and pasted from several online searches. Compiled it together to give a general overview of the basics of the amp classification system.

And woah! The Pass Labs XA200 is such a prototypical Class A...freakin' huge!!



R

 

Davbret: Where did you dig up that picture: that is not a press-release photo! Are you in the audio industry?

cheers,
Ryan

 

Nope, but boy do I WISH I was in the audio industry...unfortunately in the banking industry.

As for the picture, I was just searching Yahoo with the brand/name and found that picture on someone's website. Liked how it showed the giant size of this cow...rather tasty cow though.

R

 

yea I looked at the pics properties and have been checking out this guys page. His range of audio design seems varied, which is quite impressive.

As for Maynerd's original question, if you want to keep your electronics intact, you've got the right idea of just changing your drivers. There are a VAST amount of drivers out there, but what you're looking for are drivers of the same size and impedance. Since My MCS is still on order, I can't give you any useful feedback beyond that. I believe the Cooper uses 6.5" mid/bass in the front doors and 6x9" in the rear side panels. The tweeters are probley a half inch mylar balanced dome (yuk). In the car audio market, most products are crap compared to home audio. A few recommendations however; Orion HCCA components are no longer in production however they sound quite good for car components; Focal is unreasonably expensive, sound mostly OK (their tweeters are rather harsh, lots of 3rd harmonic distortion); Davbret went the middle-of-the-road way, with Pioneers (good quality, good price). JL audio components are also good (much better resolution than their subwoofers).

I'm using Scan-Speak drivers in my BMW 3-series, however they are NOT drop-in fit (like most home-audio drivers), requiring lots of hand-fabrication and lots of time. The results, although expensive are worth it.

Bottom line: Your budget will call the shots here.

 

if you keep the stock head unit, how do you hook up an amp?
do you have to cut the rear speaker connects? thanks!

 

>>if you keep the stock head unit, how do you hook up an amp?
>>do you have to cut the rear speaker connects? thanks!

You'd have to use a High-to-Low level converter to turn your speaker wire leads into RCAs. But most amps have onboard converters where you can just plug in the speaker wire leads.

 

>>if you keep the stock head unit, how do you hook up an amp?
>>do you have to cut the rear speaker connects? thanks!

You'd have to use a High-to-Low level converter to turn your speaker wire leads into RCAs. But most amps have onboard converters where you can just plug in the speaker wire leads.

R

 

The fronts are 5.25" components and the rears are 6x9. The rears can take drop in replacements. The fronts will not. Even the stock 5.25" woofer in the door has a built in/attached 0.75" trim ring allowing it to sit above the door casing. If you just tried to replace the stock 5.25" with another 5.25" it would run into the window. There's really not much room behind this speaker and that's why everyone is putting in spacers between the door and the speaker, so the magnet/back of speaker doesn't contact the window.

R

 

hey Davbret.
have you got any good links for installation help or pics of your installation process?
thanks in advance!

 

Hey Dave is there anything you don't know. Man you seem like the Dr. Ruth of MINI's

 

I think I know what post is next.... But I'll let Ryan tell you.

 

Why thank you MINI2Go.

R

 

(MORE)

Headunit wiring.

Great thread on changing a headunit.

Amp installation in a Cooper (no battery in trunk).

I've got loads more at home to pull from...let me know if you need more info.

R

 

You should go for this Phase 1 install!

Isn't it cute?
_________________

 

Dang Mighty, you sure love that picture! I think you need to get some plane tickets to Germany and check it out. Call it a trip to Mecca.

R

 

It's NEAT and it doesn't sound good....


I'd rather install Rosket Launchers and drive through Baghdad

Helloooooo Saddam! Let's Motor!

 

Bwaaahaahhaa!!! Maybe that's what Monster Garage should have done with their MINI...not a snowmobile, but a portible rocket launcher.

R