I'm curious on everyone's thoughts. I have a 2007 Mini Cooper s with 58k miles. Recently on cold start it wouldn't idle so I took it to the dealer for service. Upon receiving the car in they said that per the key read that it was due for 3 things. A vehicle check, micro filter and brake fluid flush. The car is out of maintenance so the price was $497. As I really don't see the value in getting 497 worth of service for those 3 things, I declined. (I had also just replaced the brakes all the way around about 4 months ago and figured the main portion of the 497 would be the brake flush). Flash forward to today, the cold start rough idle issue was the fuel pump. That's covered under warranty but they said they found carbon buildup on the valves and that comes to $665, which isn't. I tried to get more information on it but didn't really get much concrete information to understand it. Again, I declined to get the carbon buildup service done. I felt the service advisor was a bit put off by me declining it. The car ran five until the idle problem which to me seems wholly related to a bad fuel pump. So, for something that is covered by warranty I would be paying over 1,000 in other service. I'm not saying maintenance isn't needed but just want to get other opinions. Was I a cheapskate ?? Thanks for reading.

Will

 

Not at all. Get the HPFP under warranty and find an independent for the rest, if you can't do it yourself. I question how they "know" it's due for carbon cleaning without pulling the intake. The warranty replacement doesn't require that any other work be done. They can suggest all they want, but you don't have to do it. If they do without your permission, then that's their problem. Just my opinion.
I took mine to a great independent today and had my valves walnut blasted. With club discount it came to $250. Service man told me and showed me I had a slight leak at the thermostat, but it didn't need to be done right then. Original T-stat by the way. From now on Euro Motors in Raleigh is going to get any and all work that I can't do myself.

 

For a list of independent shops go to:
soopercooperinfo.com
They are listed by state then town.
Good luck finding a good one. Another resource for trustworthy shops would be a local MINI club.

 

As the others have said, do not get the valve cleaning! You can search on here and you'll find that MINI's approach to a failing HPFP is always to recommend valve cleaning first as a way to recoup the cost of the fuel pump. It doesn't solve the problem, but it pays the bills.

Ask them to read the codes (and make sure they show you what they find). Sadly, the policy is that they won't replace the pump until it throws the HPFP code (not a misfire code, which typically precedes the HPFP code). Other than for warranty work avoid the dealer!

 

You don't have to do it now but seriously consider the walnut blasting especially at your mileage! Trust me you wouldn't believe how bad mine was only after 49k miles, with these N14's they consume a lot of oil through the intake and do clog up the back of the intake valves and intake runners!

 

While I agree with declining all of those services right now, I do agree it is worth looking into doing them. The check is just that. The micro filter is a really easy job, just buy the filter and replace. As far as new brakes go, did you or the shop who did them bleed the old fluid out as part of the brake service? If not it needs to be flushed every 2 years.

And for the walnut blast, it may be helpful at your mileage but until you get a new hpfp in there and see what that does I would not have the service done. If the dealer did "the test" for the the carbon building and said you need it, then I would do it, there or at an interdependent shop. But FWIW, MINI does have a procedure to check and see if the service is recommended, but usually the car is throwing codes or running rough at the point before they run the test.

 

I have a very good independant here. He works on MG's, BMW's, MINI's and VW's. I could do the filter since its a easy pull out and put in. I can get that filter from ECS for $41.75 (carbon based) + shipping. Brake fluid flush would be cheap. Fluid would cost around $10. Labor at the shop would run me maybe $50. So for $110 you have your $497 value.

The walnut shell blasting runs about $250 here. You can opt for a chemical alternative for $100 but the vehicle has to sit over night with the fluid and you need to change oil afterwards. It does the job just as well. (A friend of mine and I did both services to compare) But a bit inconvenient. Anyway, this just shows how pricey some things are.

Oh and might I add I work in the service department at a dealership. If that has any say on where to go. I try to do my own work, but for some things I go my independant.

 

Dealership didn't recommend valve cleaning for me when my HPFP was failing. They diagnosed the problem and replaced it.

 

Go for the walnut shell blasting over the chemical treatment.
The chemical treatment "may" be effective as a maintenance procedure but not great at fully cleaning caked up valves.

 

I suppose I should have mentioned neither my valve or my buddies valves were overly caked. And in our case either way had the same result. Like Mini2na said, if the valve are heavily coated, or if you've never had this done, go for the walnut shell blasting. After the initial blasting there are several different ways to maintain the clean valves.

I should mention the chemical used was a BMW spec chemical that will eat almost anything and should only be handled by professionals. That would be a shop only kinda thing to do and not for a DIYer. Walnut shell blast can be done by most, with some help.

 

If you let us know where you live someone may be able point you to a walnut blast that is less money. Yes you need to do that. Yes you need to have the brake fluid changed. The interior air filter can be done by you.

If you skip the walnut blast you will possibly end up burning a valve, costing you many more dollars than the needed walnut blasting will. Pay the money or takes your chances.

 

Glad that you had a good dealer, but you can search here and see that your experience is definitely the exception.

Regarding the walnut blasting, in concept I agree it's a good maintenance item that should be performed. The bigger point is that: a) I would never (ever) pay dealer prices for the service, and (b) the risk of burning a valve is pretty low (it happens, but not very often). The valves have to be really terrible and their condition is tied with a whole lot of other factors like driving style, type of trips, etc.

So yeah, eventually clean the valves, but that's separate from fixing the cold start problem.

 

Like this, the carbon heats up cooking wherever carbon is present! These areas tend to glow and can cause pre-ignition.

 

It is a known problem with this engine and carbon build up. Either clean yourself or pay for it. You will not regret it because you will notice the difference.

 

Never Ever Ever Never Never Never Ever Never Ever Never Never Never Never Ever Anytime Ever Never Never Never Ever Never Ever Never Never Never Never Ever Anytime Ever Never Never Never Never Ever Anytime Ever Never Never Never Ever Never Ever Never Never Never Ever Ever Never Never Never Ever Never Ever Never Never Never Never Ever Anytime Ever Never Never Never Ever Never Ever Never Never Never Never Ever Anytime Ever Never Go to the Dealer for anything NOT under warranty!!! Just don't do it! Stop!!! Do not pass Go because it will cost you much more than $200 more than you would pay a perfectly qualified independent!!!



No!



Don't!


Stop it!


Peace out.

 

I had to pick up a couple of the front body pieces special order at the dealer, and asked what the air cabin filters cost. He quoted me $68, and I said the same Mann filter with the Heppa cotton was only $26 at the three main auto parts places, and showed him one of the web pages. He said he would match that price on the heppa. I did not notice until I got home that he had swapped it for the cheapy paper fan fold sold for $6.98 at the parts stores. As it happened, I did have to go back to pick up one last special order part and told the guy that this was the last time I was going to the dealer for anything because of that; bait and switch really pisses me off.

 

Word.

 

Thanks all for the responses as there is a lot of great information in all the posts. The dealer replaced the HPFP at no cost to me so I was happy about that. I've spent a good amount of money on this car and I do love it but feel it's pretty high maintenance. I've not decided if it's worth it to keep or not. I change the oil every 7,500 miles or so and still have to add a quart every 2k miles so no wonder there's carbon build up it guess. I have a mini independent shop close by (OC, Ca) so I will check with then to see if they offer the walnut blast service if I decide to keep the car. It is a 'blast' to drive (pun intended).

 

Speaking of filters. . . . I bought the Mann-Filter CUK 4436 Cabin Filter With Activated Charcoal for select Mini models for $17 on Amazon. The alternatives to buying from the dealer are many.

 

That's about what I burn in 2500 miles and I live in OC, CA. It's not that oil is leaking between the piston rings, it's just a poor PCV system. At least our Mini's get some fresh new oil between 5000-7500 mile oil changes. Run some BG 44K twice between oil changes to keep the combustion chambers clean, that stuff is amazing for how fast it cleans!

 

If you run top tier gasoline in your car you don't have to worry about carbon buildup in the cylinders, on the valves it's another story. I'd suggest you consider investing in the new late style valve cover to help your oil usage, it has an updated and improved PCV system built in and may also cut down on the carbon on the intake ports and valves.


My car has almost 55K on it and uses no measurable amount of oil between changes at once a year or every 10K. I just did the walnut blast on my valves and had the valve cover off to make sure the valves were fully closed - my engine looks as new, no sludge, nuttin. But the valves were definitely coked up, although not as bad as some I've seen.


Here's proof....



Here's the before/after on my valves...








I also don't know of any test you or the dealer can do to see if they are coked save removing the intake manifold and looking at them....I imagine they suggested it based on the mileage and oil usage.


As to staying away from the dealer, I suggest another approach, develop a good relationship with your dealer, don't badmouth all dealers as crooks, and learn to do as much routine maintenance as you can yourself to save money. Independents can save too, but not all independents are created equal, some are great, some can cause more headaches than they cure.


We had a local club member who took his car in to a recommended indy, they diagnosed a new alternator to fix his problem, when that didn't fix it, a week and a lot of money later they figured out it was a broken crank damper. The dealer probably would have known to look for this first based on the symptoms....


My dealer explained that the reason they charge more for the walnut shell procedure is that they also reflash the computer when done.....that and their labor rate is considerably higher than most independents. Sure enough after I did mine I got a CEL and the reduced power light. Fortunately it cleared itself in further driving, but imagine if you had just spend $400 someplace and you got a few miles away and the light came on - you'd be plenty upset and might have to budget for a trip to the dealer to clear it......more time and money spent.

 

Good points. Sometimes the cheap option is the most costly.

 

You're not a cheapskate. Vehicle check is a joke, the cabin filter is fine unless it smells, and brake fluid can wait until you need real brake service. Your car is low mileage, unlikely that carbon cleaning is necessary. Nothing costly about postponing any of those things.

 

No shame in not wasting money, but do think before skipping any scheduled maintenance.

In your spare time, find a great independent mini mechanic!

 

I just purchased a used 2010 clubman S in feb… how does one know when you need to have it walnut blasted? The dealer (whom I trust) didn't seem to think it was needed until I was having major issues like a mis-fire or stalling… but I would think I'd want to avoid that… I currently have about 37k miles on it. Would sea foam help?

Also, since it was mentioned that these S's seem to "drink" oil… how often should I be topping it off? This dipstick is downright impossible to read!