When used in conjunction with a rear anti sway bar, what are the benefits, if any, of also putting on a front anti sway bar. Most of the posts I read talk about putting a rear anti sway bar to reduce understeer. Wouldn't adding a front bar bring that back?

Also, as I am not a racer, what do camber plates do and how do they work?

Thanks

 

If your gonna putt-putt the car around town...not much. It's a beotch to put on. I had mine set on stiff and it kept wanting to slide me into curbs. I repostitioned it to the only other setting and the combo works great for me.

 

We have f/r anti-sway bars from the factory. Adding a stiffer RSB will help reduce understeer. Adding a stiffer FSB will increase understeer as you say. So don't go there. I've even heard of people putting a Cooper (smaller diameter) FSB to help reduce understeer.

The front camber plates also work to reduce understeer be tilting the top of the wheels inward a degree or two (negative camber). This will increase the contact patch for the outside front tire in a hard turn, yielding more grip for that tire.

You really don't need any of this unless you drive really hard. If there's a nice curve in your area you can try to push your car through it harder than usual to see/feel when the car starts transition to an understeer condition (be careful) if you feel you don't need to go that fast then you probably shouldn't worry about suspension mods. An MCS does pretty well with the stock setup.

 

From Randy Webb's website:

 

Thanks guys!

 

I'm trying a slightly different approach. Way (Way Motorworks) just put an H-Sport front swaybar on my car. I'm hoping to be able to soften the front damper settings a touch to improve front grip in sweepers, but not loose as much transient response as I did with the stock front swaybar when the dampers were at that setting.

Of course that is all focused around autocross performance. On the street it was fine before, and with the slightly larger front swaybar it feels even flatter with the same relatively soft damper settings I use for daily driving.

I won't know if this line of thought pays off until I've had a chance to run the car at a couple of different events at different sites (some sites favor sweepers more, others are more transient intensive). That starts next weekend.

Scott
90SM

 

Beware of any advice that tells you that "mod x is the only way to go". You need to taylor your mods to your car, other mods, driving style and driving type (race, road, etc). For example, I had WAY too much oversteer with the rear bar only when on race tires and an autocross alignment. Added front bar, still too much. I'm now running with the H-Sport competition front bar and the stock rear bar and it's just about perfect. For me.

I agree with the advice of leaving the suspension alone for street driving. BMW's engineers did a great job of making a fun ride. Believe me, the more you play with it, the more complicated it gets to keep it daily drivable.

 

...I just finished returning all but component to stock...the Webb rear bar is set to near full soft - which is apparently softer than stock...

In an effort to chase down a nasty jiggle in the front end, I removed one front swaybar endlink and drove to work today. Now, the alignment is way off, but my general feeling is that the balance is not bad...actually surprisingly good.

The jiggle is not in the swaybar bushing or endlinks...so I'll look elsewhere. but when I have this settled and aligned, I will remove the endlink again to get a very good idea for performance.

Veni Vidi Vici's advise is really the best anyone can give.

 

FYI, the larger front sway bar worked as intended for me and I'm really happy with the change. My goal was to be able to go a click or two softer on the front dampers to improve grip in sweepers but still retain the good transient response that I have with the front dampers set stiffer.

It worked. We had a very transient intensive course today, with only 3 sweepers. The car worked really well, with no push.

Like everything else in suspension setup, there are lots and lots of variables. For me, with my combination of hardware and settings, the slightly stiffer front swaybar resulted in LESS understeer due to the ability to run softer damper settings.

Scott
90SM

 

And in support of 90STX's experience, I disconnected one front swaybar link - after returning the car to 99% stock - the Webb bar remains. On fast long sweepers, the backend wants to come around the harder the throttle is pressed. Very nice turn-in during sharp corners, but one must beware at high speed. This is just an experiment. The swaybar link goes back in soon.

 

I ditto many of the comments made in this thread. The one thing I would add is this. The stock suspension setup is very forgiving, meaning that if you're pushing it through a turn and the car starts to loose traction, the traction loss is relatively progresive thus providing the driver with a reasonable time window to correct the problem. When you install a stiffer rear swaybar, you reduce understeer, as already mentioned, but the car also becomes less forgiving, meaning that if you now push the car through a turn and it starts to loose traction, that traction loss is much more snappy and the time window to corrrct the problem is much smaller. It's much the same scenario as the difference between treaded and slick tires; the latter will provide more traction through turns, but they loose grip with very little warning.

I would therefore recommend that when you install a stiffer rear swaybar, NEVER start off on the stiffest setting. Start on the lowest or medium setting and take it easy through the turns to give yourself time to learn the new handling dynamics of your car. It's very easy to swap ends in a turn when you have an over stiffened swaybar and you're not used to the way it handles.