Bringing 'another late model turbo car' into a discussion about the differences between the turbo and supercharged MINIs is moot.

Zip

 

Agreed. I may be proven wrong, but I think that testing will show that the R56 Turbo has the advantage on the low-end, but the R53 Super has the advantage on the high-end, power-wise. Perhaps even stock vs. stock... but almost certainly (IMO) when comparing stock R56 to JCW or GP R53.

Mind you, the reduced weight of the R56 gives it a bit extra advantage too, once you get off the dyno and out on the road.

 

I couldn't find anything about the brakes on the R56, but people already clarified that for us so big thanks to them~
About the speed, the torque might be deceptive and MAYBE, just maybe, the R56 is slower than an R53 JCW. Certainly tho, it is a LOTTTTTTTTT faster and smoother than the stock R53, or even a avg modded R53~
But speed is not all it matters, the R56 is easily the better city crawler with the torque and it cruises on the highway with easeeeeeee. R56 is actually like the big brother 3 series now which isn't a bad thing~

 

To some people, it is. "Connectedness with the road", etc. That doesn't mean I'm bashing the R56 or trying to start another war (not at all). I like and respect the R56 for a number of reasons. It's just... different, that's all.

 

Every review i've read about the R56 says it feels much more like an average every day car and less like a "Go Kart". I personally like the Go Kart feel the old MINI has, but the major factor that made me decide between the 06 and 07 was appearance.

The 07 looks like an SUV! It's SO high off the ground it's ridiculous. The front of the car looks awful in my opinion. I just hate the look of the new car...Not much more to say about it, you got the HP stats correct, it is indeed a wopping 4 HP more than the 06 model, and right now NOBODY has a clue how to extract any more HP out of it.

There was a post a few days ago by Alta that they'd figured out a few performance related things and would be releasing a few trial products in the coming months.

As for JCW, nobody knows when this will be available. Last I heard they had trouble making the power gains reliable. It could be well into 2008 before they work all the technical issues out.

2006 Cooper S JCW = 210 HP (Normal every day Cooper S with the JCW kit. Unless you're a nut about having a warranty this is a waste of money, and you're better off buying a normal Cooper S and just installing a pulley. Resale value will be higher on the JCW, but you will NOT get back the full amount of the premium you pay for it)

2006 Cooper S JCW GP = 217 HP and about 88 lbs lighter (This is a very stripped version of a Cooper S. You give up your back seat, premium stereo, and a few other options to save the 88 lbs. You'll notice many of these cars haven't dropped much from the purchase price, they're limited edition, and likely will stay at or slightly below the purchase price new for a few years).

You'll probably end up modding the JCW anyway which really negates any of the "Warranty Benefits". I'd just go with a normal Cooper S and do it all aftermarket!

 

The R53 Works cars (JCW or GP) still rule the roost over the R56... time will tell if BMW improves upon the benchmark that has been set. But even if that day comes, it won't be a real cooper garage car, as the garage has shut down. In the end the R53 Works will remain ever the classic...

 

I think you guys are worried that the R56 is going to be a better car. It's already faster than most modded R53's. I am talking on the track not just at the drag strip.


oh....I just got out of my R53 and into a R56 so I can speak first hand unlike many other people here who just speculate. If you have driven both and still like the R53, than my hat is off to you. For those of you who speak from seeing it in a magazine need to experiance it first hand before you judge.

 

Nope, I don't care about that at all. I didn't buy my MINI to be a track car, I bought it as a daily driver, for STREET fun. Not worried at all! I have driven both. Like I said before, I am impressed with the R56, I like it... but for me, I prefer the R53 I already have. Everyone has different preferences, and the R53 meets mine better. That doesn't make it a better car... just better for me.

 

I totally respect that! I am just tired of people bashing the R56 before they see/drive it. You have given an honest opinion based on actually driving the car!

Dont get me wrong I loved my R53 too!

 

I don't have to drive it to know I don't like it... every picture of the R56 makes me dislike it even more. It's bigger, taller, higher off the ground, and less sporty looking.

Where you got that it's faster than most modded coopers I have no idea... coming from an R53 owner that had an R53 that could give an E46 M3 a run for it's money in the twisties i'd beg to differ.

It may have a bit more punch (For the 5 seconds that "Speed Mode" is on) but the factory published 0-60 is almost exactly the same as the R53. As for track times, I don't track my car, so I could care.

I also don't care to deal with all the first year kinks and issues that R56 owners have published. I don't mind the go kart feeling, if I wanted a car that had a plush ride I would have bought a 3 series .

As for where the R56 can go with performance, nobody knows. As of now not even BMW themselves can figure out quite how to tune the car for JCW .

 

I'll say this: if I hadn't yet owned a MINI, I'd have no problem buying an R56 S. It sounds like BMW did almost everything right w/ the new rendition. However, I'm very doubtful that I'll be enticed away from my '06 all JCW MCS by the R56. Granted: I haven't driven an R56 yet, but the JCW brakes and suspension alone are going to make a big difference, and 210 bhp might have the edge where 0-60 times are concerned.

 

No worry here... I grabbed one of the last R53 factory JCW cars built. Bottom line: don't like the looks of the R56 or where BMW is taking the brand. Fake hoop scoops and other doo-dads is not what I personally want in a performance car.

 

You guys crack me up. Drive a R56 then talk to me about 0-60 times being the same....lol.

The one thing I do agree is that it does sit very high.

 

The Factory published 0-60 times on a 2006 MINI Cooper S are 6.8 seconds. The factory published 0-60 times on a 2007 MINI Cooper S are 6.7 Seconds. Explain to me what has changed? An 06 with half a tank of gas vs an 07 with a full tank could make up for the .1 second difference in 0-60's.

Don't pretend that the 02-04 MCS is the same car as the 05-06 MCS. It's a completely different car and the 0-60 differences are SIGNIFIGANT. The factory published 0-60 times on the 04 MCS were 7.2 seconds.

Here's a link to the Motortrend right up on the Mini Mania S3 kit. Keep in mind these numbers are on an 03 with the longer gears. On an 06 the same kit would show quite a bit faster. (.3-.4 seconds faster on the 0-60, and likely the same or more on the 1/4 mile).

For comparision purposes, I had an 04 MC40 that dynoed 236 to the wheels (Check my gallery for the dyno sheet). Using 11% drivetrain loss that calculates out to 265 bhp, or about 20 HP more than the car they tested at motortrend.

Sorry, the R56 may be new, it may be turbo, but it's not doing sub 15 1/4 miles, and it's certainly not even CLOSE to sub 6 second 0-60's.

 

While I'm very partial to the R53, I'd still go with the '07, loaded, and add the JCW kit to that if/when it becomes available. I wouldnt buy a year old car.

 

The only problem with that is that the "full" JCW engine option will not be available as a dealer install - only as a factory option. So that will require waiting. A less dramatic JCW upgrade for regular R56s will be made available to dealers, however.

 

Oh, well then that could create a problem. I'm more of a "mod it yourself" type person, so I wouldnt get JCW anyway. I think I'd still get the R56 and wait for mods to become available.

I havent driven the R56, or even seen one in person yet..so my opinion isnt that reliable anyway, haha.

 

you really need to drive one before you talk. Ryphile is making strides with his r56 as is alta. People are starting to bring power out of them in the aftermarket... maybe not through the ecu yet... but through bolt ons... We aren't all that much further then that with the r53.

I have an r53 with enough mods to keep pace with a jcw easily and even pass most of them as my mcs is for some reason one of hte stronger stock ones.

After driving the r56 and the r53 back to back... the r56 is a much much more drivable car. 30+ ft/lbs of torque more then the r53 and the r53 jcw makes a huge huge difference in the cars want to get up and go where the r53 would not.

Sure the r56 0-60 times aren't much faster then hte r53... but then again... the jcw times aren't that much faster thne a stock r53. Either way they are both nice cars. But if you:

A) have not seen an r56 in person
B) have not seen an r56 in person with a drop on it
C) have not driven an r56
D) have not driven a jcw gp

You should not really be commenting.

When I first say the r56 i hated it. I hated every little bit of it. I even wanted to hate it... with it's looks and new engine and interior. But as time has come I have grown to become ok with it. It does look pudgier yes but from behind the wheel and looking at the interior. It is a much more refined vehicle.

Just remember there is more to a vehicle then some guys opinions who hasn't even seen one in real life... looking at rustyboy here.

I drove my car and the r56 back to back... my car is generally a jcw spanking S... and if i dont spank them im never more then a half car length. And after driving my car back to back... and the STOCK r56 I still have to say go with the stock r56...

That r56 with 1000 worth of bolt ons will make that jcw car look like a joke... mark my words..

for the record... I love my r53 and I will buy another marque of car before I would give it up. I'm still an r53 fanatic to i die because of the exterior styling... but dant those r56's are sawheet.... Gimmie a M version in awd and im there.

gl tough choice... you win either way.

 

I HAVE seen it in person, and I HAVE since driven it... there are no less than 5 MINI dealerships within a 40 mile radius of me, and quite a few R56's on the road here. I don't like it at all. I'm pretty creative (I'm a photographer ) and while the drop certainly helps, the car still doesn't do anything for me.

I have no problem with people who like it better, but when people make comments like "The R56 is better from the factory than the a heavily modified R53" it just sounds dumb. You're right, it's turbo, it's easier to extract power out of, but it's still not MINI enough for me. If I wanted a big family car that had comfortable seats, was easy to tune, and could handle twisties fairly well, I would have bought a 335 Ci .

I've owned a lot of cars, M3's, VW's, MINI's (This is my second R53), a G35 Coupe 6MT. None of them come close to the fun factor and tossability of the R53 MINI.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but when you start making comments as if they're fact and not opinion, it completely changes things.

This forum is educational most of the time, but for people that know nothing of either car, and come here looking for OPINIONS and people start making false comments, you're playing with fire. I'll admit i've learned a lot on this forum, but i've also learned a lot on my own, and found that more often than not people make comments on here that they know nothing about... like the R56 being faster than the R53.

I have no problem driving my R53, and the .1 second change in 0-60 doesn't matter to me, as i'm already 70+ HP over stock. and will soon be close to 100 HP over stock.

Keep thing's civil, and let people voice their own opinions. If you're going to involve facts, rather than opinions, make sure the facts are accurate.

 

Icemen125... I haven't seen a follow-up on your original post here. Are you with us?

If so, my opinion of your choices boils down to you looking at what the car will be used for. If it were for a weekend toy, only, I'd be tempted by the R53 JCW GP. However, I would never buy the GP as a daily driver, though, as it lacks items such as back seat, glove box, rear windshield wiper (VERY necessary in places like the Midwest, as a daily driver) and let's not forget sound-deadening insulation that was removed.

Now, if the GP is out of the question, test the drive the R53 JCW and R56 again, and maybe again. The difference between the handling and response should be evident. It's subjective... Do you like the harsher, go-cart feel & R53 design, or does the new style and new comfort, etc., appeal? There isn't a black and white correct answer. It's what works for you!

 

This debate always amazes me. To me it's like this- (in each of these comparisons, money is not a factor at all)---

Hmmm do I buy a Playstation 3 or a Playstation 2? Money is no matter.

I'm in the market for a computer. Do I get one with a Pentium III or a Pentium IV?

Do I need to go on??? For those of you who like the R53 better for its looks, that's fine (I happen to like the looks of the R56 better). That's something that is very personal. I think Adriana Lima is the hottest supermodel ever to live (some would disagree). However, those of you who think that the R53 beats the R56 in performance are just kidding yourself. The R56 is better technology. It performs better. It's more efficient. It's cleaner. And yes, it STILL HANDLES LIKE A "GO-KART". You guys need to read more reviews on what pros are saying, or you need to go take one for a drive yourself!

ATTENTION R53 OWNERS!!!- Yes you have a fantastic car. The R56 owes everything it is to the R53. BUT, you need to face the fact that you now own outdated technology. Stop trying to lull other people into buying what you have so that you can feel better about owning a MINI that's not "TOP OF THE LINE" anymore. It's like me saying-

"Na dude. Buy the Playstation 2. The black plastic casing just looks way better."

Na dude. Buy the computer that's a year old. They'll never make a body casing that is the same ever again. This is your last chance to own a piece of history...."

WAKE UP PEOPLE. Does a bear **** in the woods? The R56 is just a better car. Period.

 

kendrick, your post borders on Trolling. Have you ever owned an R53? No? Then your opinion is limited to what you know.

There's more to the differences in the R53 than just looks... and some of us (myself included) LIKE those differences. You don't, that's fine... but stop trying to goad people, because that's exactly what you're doing.

I'm not saying that the R53 is better. It's just different. Better in some ways, worse in others. And opinions are going to vary based upon your personal preferences and what you want in a vehicle.

However, suggesting that those of us have concerns about some of the changes are trying to make ourselves "feel better" is ridiculous. We already have the car we want, but that isn't going to stop us from making an honest assessment of the changes.

 

Actually, my dad has one. And I have driven it...a lot. It's what got me going on getting a MINI in the first place.

 

That's fine... and you have decided that the changes in the R56 result in a net improvement for your needs. Good for you. But stop trying to slam R53 owners who are very happy with the car they have, and wouldn't change a thing about them, including a free trade for an R56 with the same specs. I'm in that camp. But that doesn't mean I don't like the R56, I do.

Bottom line, I'm suggesting you focus your attention on the cars, not the owners.

 

You lie. HAHAHA just joking. Let's be friends.